Way to go - APOLOGY ALSO

I did watch/read the thread recently discussed when the original poster has changed his first post to "wast of time".
I saw it all including the "tough love" stuff or what I guess was meant as tough love for a depressed person (and it was pretty evident that the OP very likely had some depression issues going on) which was likely why the OP changed his post and presumably has chosen to leave the forum or at least not post here again.

There ended up being some decent discussion develop but someone who is depressed/ill/desperate for help and new to the "tough love" crap that some people here like to dish out....those people needing help aren't going to have the mind set to sort through all the shit that was said to glean the good points.
They are already in a bad place so all they are going to see first is bad stuff.

Compassion....why is it so hard to give to someone even if privately you think they are a loser/whiner/troll?
Would you make fun of a person in a wheelchair? Would you make fun of someone who lost an arm or a leg and was having serious trouble dealing with the loss?

Or let's turn it around...it's pretty obvious I am going through a bit of depression...I admit it and I know what caused it but it isn't so easy to fix and I know that it isn't easy to fix. I am trying very hard to get past it though.
Do you think that it is compassionate to tell me to just quit the forum...don't lurk...do some stupid stuff so that I will just stay away? That was done to me and let me tell you...that hurt me deeply. Maybe it was done to interject some humor but in my current mind state it sure as hell backfired.

The mind/brain is a powerful thing...and sometimes it's a good thing but sometimes it's a bad thing and to make fun of a person who is in a bad way is just plain heartless IMHO.

Pugsy, at 33,000 posts you have a major investment in this forum and the people that visit here. It seems like you are contemplating a divorce which is not fun for anyone.
It sounds like you might be trying to figure out if there is a different approach to the unhelpful posts, that would still fit with your ethics, but also let you stay and continue to help people here. I don't think you want to go, but you may need to go- this is the hardest type of decision to make and I wish you luck.

Focus on what will make things right for you, the group will deal with whatever you decide. Personally, along with many others, hope you can find a way to stay.

The mind/brain creates the reality we experience.

Pugsy wrote: Perhaps if I share privately with someone (who will promise forever not to make it public unless I agree) then I can get another person's perspective

Pugsy, as you know I began phasing out some months ago, but I continue to check in and read. You know how to reach me and you're welcome to.

Pugsy, why don't you create your team to moderate?
Everyone else simply "contributes" to help others.

personally I am glad this thread happened and I think it is being dealt with remarkably well. When a person of Pugsy's stature says they have to leave, it makes everybody sit up and take notice.

kaiasgram wrote:

Pugsy wrote: Perhaps if I share privately with someone (who will promise forever not to make it public unless I agree) then I can get another person's perspective

Pugsy, as you know I began phasing out some months ago, but I continue to check in and read. You know how to reach me and you're welcome to.

I was going thru some tough times with CPAP and depression a little more than a year ago and kaiasgram really helped me thru that stuff... all very level-headed advice. I never had to worry about 'loose lips sink ships' with the K-lady.

Tango wrote:Pugsy, why don't you create your team to moderate?

No, no and no.
My goal has always been to teach people to be able to help themselves.
That's why I tend to write novels and explain the "whys" that are the background for ideas instead of a one line...try this.
I want people to help themselves and not rely on someone making decisions for them.

No way have I ever wanted to do anything else and that includes any sort of moderation of what others may think or say.

Now I will admit to calling someone something not very nice privately but I just won't do it publicly (unless they are really, really, really bad and what they are saying is dangerous) because that's not my place nor do I want it to be my place.

Education and not dictatorship.

PoolQ wrote:The mind/brain creates the reality we experience.

Yes it does indeed but sometimes even when we know what the brain is doing it's something we can't fix no matter how much we want to.

PoolQ wrote: It seems like you are contemplating a divorce which is not fun for anyone.

Yes I suppose it sort of feels that way...when the spouse we are contemplating leaving has developed into someone that is unhealthy for us to stay in that relationship.
Been there and done that and it ain't any fun at all especially when the spouse is someone you still love but is doing stuff that is affecting you negatively.
And to top it all off...the spouse isn't always so bad and sometimes there are still good times that muddy up the waters. We still love the spouse...but hate what they do sometimes but not all the time.

kaiasgram wrote:You know how to reach me and you're welcome to.

Maybe I do need a good therapist and I forgot that's what you do for a living.
The thing is I know that I am the only one I can "fix" but I just haven't decided how to go about it just yet.
None of my choices that I see at this time are particularly attractive at the moment. Perhaps there are other choices that I just can't see at this time due to the pain.

A good therapist can't solve your issues, but they can assist you to find your own solution. People talk with friends, family, and even total strangers to help sort things out, no reason someone can't talk with someone actually TRAINED for this.

Pugsy wrote:

kaiasgram wrote:You know how to reach me and you're welcome to.

Maybe I do need a good therapist and I forgot that's what you do for a living.
The thing is I know that I am the only one I can "fix" but I just haven't decided how to go about it just yet.

Pugsy my dear, you are not broken and you don't need to be "fixed." My offer is just as a forum friend -- just like the help and personal time you gave me when I came on board almost four years ago. No expiration date on the offer.

tooter wrote:

SleepyEyes21 wrote:

R1200ST wrote:Public forums, public issues.

If I participate here, I fully expect to get the good with the bad, and be strong enough, smart enough (lol) , patient enough, polite enough, to TRY and not get into dialogue with the trolls.

Toll, in web talk, is the evil doer. I think the TROLL picture, symbol, word, whatever, should be used to identify someone who, through their advice or actions, causes issues on this forum. If you get a troll symbol after your post, then we all know to ignore your information. Putting a troll after someones post with a ^ shows that YOU feel the person is just being a troll. No harm, no foul, just "buyer beware".

We need to self police the forum, and not ask for a super administer to try and run it. Then people start blaming the admin for nerfing posts and such.

To be quite honest with you all, this has been the most calm forum I have EVER been on. Try talking about what is the best airplane, or who does the best work, and see what other aircraft owners call you. It gets BRUTAL>

Good luck. I hope everyone takes a DEEP BREATH and gets back to normal.

Hi R,

Thanks for participating I like your idea about the TROLL picture/ symbol also. We can ask members to come up with cartoon pics of trolls too.

I think your avatar is perfect.....every time we see what we feel is a troll we could post your avatar.

Hi toddler- if that's the decision of the group's, then I'll gladly change my avatar so that everyone can use the current one with no confusion. Have a great day

Pugsy - I wanted to PM you and not have this in the thread but I see you have blocked PMs right now. I wish, too, that you had not identified our self as the one Madalot was speaking about. I do not believe this thread would exist, if it was anyone but you. People be talking about changing, if it were anyone but you. A lot of this thread is about getting you to come back. It is not about the forum becoming more civil. That, to me, is a shame. I am not speaking against and all you have done for a lot of people on this forum, including myself, but I am nagged by the fact that many would only consider changing, to keep you here.

Edited out.

People do what they do because they believe it's correct (anyway most do). They only consider changing when something important enough happens to make them rethink their position.
Random people telling them every now and then that they are not really helping and perhaps could be doing harm typically does not cause change.

Hawthorne wrote:I am nagged by the fact that many would only consider changing, to keep you here.

Don't let yourself be too nagged. I am not changing, and neither is anyone else.

Pugsy can do what she wants to do.

Hawthorne wrote: I am nagged by the fact that many would only consider changing, to keep you here.

Don't give it a second thought because I guarantee you that the offenders could care less about what you and I think and like I have said before...they either just like to be mean and rude and nasty because it's their general disposition in life (sad for whomever is around them) or they really can see the forest for the trees.

I have no illusions whatsoever about changing anything they do or say. Don't want to....don't want to try.

I just don't know if I can put up with it anymore and that's my problem...not theirs because they don't give a rats ass how I feel or anyone else feels except themselves.
That sort of behavior used to be the rarity on this forum...now its considered the norm and what's even sadder people shirk it off like "oh well, it's the internet and it's okay because it goes on everywhere nowadays".
It's to be expected to have to dodge shit slinging just because it's a forum and it's a free for all to say anything you want because you either disagree or you just like being mean and nasty????
Is that really what this forum has become?

I have a right to have my perception of things voiced...just like anyone else.
If they can perceive things their way and respond in whatever manner they choose....why is it not okay for me to do the same?
Double standards I guess. Maybe I should just join the asshole jerk club and partake in the mob mentality and berate people for not believing or thinking like I do.....seems they think it is okay for them to do it but not me.