Off-topic: Obama and Romney

lazer wrote:

DreamStalker wrote:....In the meantime the sheeple should awake from their American Dream and start learning to grow their own food, build local community, and prepare for a totally new way of life.

How will we power our xPaps if infrastructure is broken and we have to rebuild?

Battery bank. We hose heads need to start building a battery bank with a method of recharging it -- solar, wind, hydro, steam, or some combination. That means getting a machine that runs on 12 volt directly without the inefficiency of needing a sine wave converter. Learn to use a passive humidifier or none at all -- FF masks will become difficult to use w/out high humidification.

What Jim says is certainly a very real possibility. The thing to keep in mind is that the police state also requires large amounts of resources to maintain, resources that will be in short supply for them as they will be for us. So the martial law and government control will be relatively short-lived IMO ... still won't be much fun though.

There are people in complete "De Nile" as Jim likes to say and then there are those who are totally asleep and unaware. There are those who see us as paranoid schizo's, doom and gloomers, or whatever they want to call us ... but for me I don't care what they call me because the more people I can wake up, the better it will be for everyone else. Getting people to wake up and prepare for the massive changes headed our way will make it easier for all people to make the transition.

Everyone needs to start growing their own backyard/porch veggies and raising small livestock, collecting and treating rainwater, learning to conserve energy, water, and all life sustaining resources, building community with real human relationships (meet your neighbors and reconnect with family and friends). Even for people who don't believe that our civilization can collapse, these things are good things to practice and will increase resilience against natural disasters.

I think that a lot of people sense that something is not right with the world but they just don't know why. I think Jim's estimate of 80% having no idea is a bit optimistic -- based on my own experience I would say more than 90% have no idea what is headed our way. But more and more people are waking up every day.

The world's banks are all insolvent and in need of more bailouts again ... just like back in 2008, only a lot worse. The governments will beat the drums for more war (the US will be involved in another war before year's end) to keep the sheeple distracted while the banks attempt to prop up and keep the economy from complete catastrophic failure ... but they can't do that forever. Just like California earthquakes, it's not a matter of "IF", it's a matter of "WHEN" it all comes down.

For goodness sakes! Teach me not to initiate a political discussion with a bunch of crabby, old, paranoid apneics.

ChicagoGranny wrote:For goodness sakes! Teach me not to initiate a political discussion with a bunch of crabby, old, paranoid apneics.

Go back to sleep you old political crab

Lizistired wrote:

Sheriff Buford wrote:The only thing I will say is that if you like the last three years, then you know who you will vote for.

Sheriff

I like the last 3 a hell of a lot better than the 8 before that!
Romney doesn't want to be president. He just want's more tax loopholes for himself, but Cheney, Rumsfeld, Wolfowitz and Rove are waiting in the wings.
Watch what you ask for.

You didn't read my note. I said,"The only thing I will say is that if you like the last three years, then you know who you will vote for." Obviously you enjoyed the last three years, so YOU know who YOU will vote for.

Sheriff

DreamStalker wrote:
Go back to sleep you old political crab

Oh, it's OK, I went to bed early last night and had some good REM periods. No apparent leaks.

A timely excerpt from one of my favorite bloggers ... Dmitry Orlov

In the United States the problem is significantly worse. Here, there is no unique national language, no single ethnic, historical or cultural identity, and the nation as a whole is a synthetic entity—the result of an explicit political pact. We are expected to derive our sense of belonging from our inclusion in a set of impersonal public institutions and participation in a scripted political process. But in spite of what our handlers in politics and the media tell us, our gut sense is that these public institutions do not belong to us, and that the political process is one of manipulation rather than inclusion. Many of us know full well that we live in a kleptocracy that prioritizes international financial interests and the interests of a small, privileged rentier class above all else. More and more of us are being excluded—based on our inability to pay for a middle-class lifestyle.

Where do we belong, then? With the Republicans/Democrats? Looking at the current presidential contest, in one corner we have a wealthy Mormon aristocrat posing as a self-made man, while in the other corner we have an exotic product of the American academe posing as a man of the people and, because he randomly happens to be brown-skinned, as a champion of the children of former slaves. Both are, in fact, faithful servants of financial interests, many of them transnational or foreign. Both will maintain the power of the center at the cost of the periphery, and extend the milking, the bleeding and the fleecing of the people for as long as possible. Meanwhile, the US Congress performs a sadomasochistic folie à deux on behalf of their corporate sponsors. Only 17% of the people approve of their performance. Such a high number is perhaps explained by the fact that roughly 20% of Americans are mentally ill. (Even so, it would appear that a few percent of the mentally ill are insufficiently delusional to approve of congressional performance.) The people as a whole, sane or otherwise, may be forgiven for thinking that they don't belong, and for acting accordingly.

http://cluborlov.blogspot.com/2012/07/p ... cious.html

I made a modification so everyone can be happy:

A man died and went to heaven.. As he stood in front of St. Peter at the Pearly Gates, he saw a huge wall of clocks behind him.

He asked, "What are all those clocks?"

St. Peter answered, "Those are Lie Clocks. Everyone on Earth has a Lie Clock. Every time you lie the hands on your clock will move."

"Oh,' said the man, "whose clock is that?"

"That's Mother Teresa's. The hands have never moved, indicating that she never told a lie."

"Incredible,' said the man. "And whose clock is that one?"

St. Peter responded, "That's Abraham Lincoln's clock. The hands have moved twice, telling us that Abe told only two lies in his entire life."

"Where's (fill in your favorite politician's name)'s clock?" asked the man.

"(favorite politician)'s clock is in Jesus' office . . . He's using it as a ceiling fan."

Sheriff Buford wrote:

Lizistired wrote:

Sheriff Buford wrote:The only thing I will say is that if you like the last three years, then you know who you will vote for.

Sheriff

I like the last 3 a hell of a lot better than the 8 before that!
Romney doesn't want to be president. He just want's more tax loopholes for himself, but Cheney, Rumsfeld, Wolfowitz and Rove are waiting in the wings.
Watch what you ask for.

You didn't read my note. I said,"The only thing I will say is that if you like the last three years, then you know who you will vote for." Obviously you enjoyed the last three years, so YOU know who YOU will vote for.

Sheriff

Oh, too funny. Without reviewing again the previous posts before Liz's, I thought Liz was referring to the last 3 thread posts, which I assumed included mine. I need a vacation.

DreamStalker wrote:A timely excerpt from one of my favorite bloggers ... Dmitry Orlov

In the United States the problem is significantly worse. Here, there is no unique national language, no single ethnic, historical or cultural identity, and the nation as a whole is a synthetic entity—the result of an explicit political pact. We are expected to derive our sense of belonging from our inclusion in a set of impersonal public institutions and participation in a scripted political process. But in spite of what our handlers in politics and the media tell us, our gut sense is that these public institutions do not belong to us, and that the political process is one of manipulation rather than inclusion. Many of us know full well that we live in a kleptocracy that prioritizes international financial interests and the interests of a small, privileged rentier class above all else. More and more of us are being excluded—based on our inability to pay for a middle-class lifestyle.

Where do we belong, then? With the Republicans/Democrats? Looking at the current presidential contest, in one corner we have a wealthy Mormon aristocrat posing as a self-made man, while in the other corner we have an exotic product of the American academe posing as a man of the people and, because he randomly happens to be brown-skinned, as a champion of the children of former slaves. Both are, in fact, faithful servants of financial interests, many of them transnational or foreign. Both will maintain the power of the center at the cost of the periphery, and extend the milking, the bleeding and the fleecing of the people for as long as possible. Meanwhile, the US Congress performs a sadomasochistic folie à deux on behalf of their corporate sponsors. Only 17% of the people approve of their performance. Such a high number is perhaps explained by the fact that roughly 20% of Americans are mentally ill. (Even so, it would appear that a few percent of the mentally ill are insufficiently delusional to approve of congressional performance.) The people as a whole, sane or otherwise, may be forgiven for thinking that they don't belong, and for acting accordingly.

http://cluborlov.blogspot.com/2012/07/p ... cious.html

I can pretty much relate to the above "quoted" article and especially the bolded.

DreamStalker wrote:A timely excerpt from one of my favorite bloggers ... Dmitry Orlov

http://cluborlov.blogspot.com/2012/07/p ... cious.html

OMG!

Somebody needs to get out in the sunshine and fresh air and move around. Go to the river and take a swim. Ride a bicycle.

Eat some fiber and drink some water every morning.

ChicagoGranny wrote:

DreamStalker wrote:A timely excerpt from one of my favorite bloggers ... Dmitry Orlov

http://cluborlov.blogspot.com/2012/07/p ... cious.html

OMG!

Somebody needs to get out in the sunshine and fresh air and move around. Go to the river and take a swim. Ride a bicycle.

Eat some fiber and drink some water every morning.

I can't stop laughing....Granny, you are awesome!

ChicagoGranny wrote:

DreamStalker wrote:A timely excerpt from one of my favorite bloggers ... Dmitry Orlov

http://cluborlov.blogspot.com/2012/07/p ... cious.html

OMG!

Somebody needs to get out in the sunshine and fresh air and move around. Go to the river and take a swim. Ride a bicycle.

Eat some fiber and drink some water every morning.

First laugh of the day! Yes, fiber does help in certain situations.

ChicagoGranny wrote:

DreamStalker wrote:A timely excerpt from one of my favorite bloggers ... Dmitry Orlov

http://cluborlov.blogspot.com/2012/07/p ... cious.html

OMG!

Somebody needs to get out in the sunshine and fresh air and move around. Go to the river and take a swim. Ride a bicycle.

Eat some fiber and drink some water every morning.

LOL
that is just hilarious,CG.
Thanks for the much needed laugh.

Dear America (and Michael Phelps),

The party's over.

DreamStalker wrote:A timely excerpt from one of my favorite bloggers ... Dmitry Orlov
http://cluborlov.blogspot.com/2012/07/p ... cious.html

Link to an interesting article by Orlov on that page, "Closing the 'Collapse Gap': the USSR was better prepared for collapse than the US."

http://www.energybulletin.net/node/23259

Whether or not you believe an economic collapse of the US is inevitable, or even possible, Orlov raises a lot of interesting contrasts between the factors that helped the Soviet Union survive its collapse compared to the corresponding factors in the US system. The article is well worth reading.

Here's one provocative comment.

Slide [5] Continuing with our list of superpower similarities, many of the problems that sunk the Soviet Union are now endangering the United States as well. Such as a huge, well-equipped, very expensive military, with no clear mission, bogged down in fighting Muslim insurgents. Such as energy shortfalls linked to peaking oil production. Such as a persistently unfavorable trade balance, resulting in runaway foreign debt. Add to that a delusional self-image, an inflexible ideology, and an unresponsive political system.

Right now energy shortfall is debatable because of the massive reserves of natural gas we are tapping. This article was presented in Dec 2006.

Another comment he makes that I find a bit amusing, and in keeping with the theme of this topic is:

Slide [20] One area in which I cannot discern any Collapse Gap is national politics. The ideologies may be different, but the blind adherence to them couldn't be more similar.

It is certainly more fun to watch two Capitalist parties go at each other than just having the one Communist party to vote for. The things they fight over in public are generally symbolic little tokens of social policy, chosen for ease of public posturing. The Communist party offered just one bitter pill. The two Capitalist parties offer a choice of two placebos. The latest innovation is the photo finish election, where each party buys 50% of the vote, and the result is pulled out of statistical noise, like a rabbit out of a hat.

The American way of dealing with dissent and with protest is certainly more advanced: why imprison dissidents when you can just let them shout into the wind to their heart's content?

One comment he makes I find rather intriguing as it goes along with an argument I have made for many years.

In the Soviet Union, very little could be obtained for money. It was treated as tokens rather than as wealth, and was shared among friends.

In this country we treat money itself as wealth. It's not. Money has value only when it is exchanged for the fruits of labor, therefore all money held in bank accounts and such is an IOU against someone's labor somewhere, sometime. You can have a million dollars in your bank account, but it does you no good until you exchange it for a product or service, like a car, or a haircut, or a loaf of bread. If the economy collapses, and hyper inflation sets in, all that money loses its value. Like it or not, real wealth resides in tangible goods you own free and clear, and even that can be tenuous.