Update on statins

As I've posted before, I have lost weight (135 lbs.) and gotten my meds cut down and eliminated. However, after three months off the statins (of which I was only on a 5 mg. dosage), my cholesterol went up, so my doctor put me back on simvastatin. It was devastating to find this out because I have religiously followed my diet and worked out hard. I know that high cholesterol is genetic with my family, but still, eating right and exercising just wasn't enough. My total cholesterol went from 136 to 196, but even worse, my bad cholesterol rose significantly.

Added to my current grief is the fact that my doctor only recommends tuna once a week because of the mercury and general pollution in the ocean. She recommended egg white omelets. So disappointing. She also recommended organic eggs, etc. because you can't trust the antibiotics and other drugs put into the chicken feed. The same applies to all other beef as well. So disappointing.

To add to my bad day, I found out that my teacher retirement insurance is going to fail, and they are considering the possibility of having retired teachers pick up a plan offered by the Affordable Care Act. Until then, they are doing all they can to keep spiraling medical costs down, but it is a losing battle. I'm not eligible for Medicare, and even with Medicare Advantage, not all doctors want to be in that network. Even worse, I'm looking at the possibility of increased insurance premiums for myself alone (I am not 65) of $800 a month, and teachers in my state do not get a COLA. Screwed, all the way around. While things may be good for now, the long term vision is not rosy at all, and I'm as depressed as can be over that.

RestedRebel wrote:As I've posted before, I have lost weight (135 lbs.) and gotten my meds cut down and eliminated. However, after three months off the statins (of which I was only on a 5 mg. dosage), my cholesterol went up, so my doctor put me back on simvastatin. It was devastating to find this out because I have religiously followed my diet and worked out hard. I know that high cholesterol is genetic with my family, but still, eating right and exercising just wasn't enough. My total cholesterol went from 136 to 196, but even worse, my bad cholesterol rose significantly.

Added to my current grief is the fact that my doctor only recommends tuna once a week because of the mercury and general pollution in the ocean. She recommended egg white omelets. So disappointing. She also recommended organic eggs, etc. because you can't trust the antibiotics and other drugs put into the chicken feed. The same applies to all other beef as well. So disappointing.

To add to my bad day, I found out that my teacher retirement insurance is going to fail, and they are considering the possibility of having retired teachers pick up a plan offered by the Affordable Care Act. Until then, they are doing all they can to keep spiraling medical costs down, but it is a losing battle. I'm not eligible for Medicare, and even with Medicare Advantage, not all doctors want to be in that network. Even worse, I'm looking at the possibility of increased insurance premiums for myself alone (I am not 65) of $800 a month, and teachers in my state do not get a COLA. Screwed, all the way around. While things may be good for now, the long term vision is not rosy at all, and I'm as depressed as can be over that.

Hi Rested Rebel,

You might want to check this site out for a different opinion regarding fats and cholesterol:

http://chriskresser.com/the-diet-heart- ... -the-enemy

I am so sorry about your insurance issues and I hope you can resolve them.

Take care,

49er

I would be wary of simvastatin. It can affect the quality of your sleep. And at least
in me it made me sleep all the time. And as the previous poster said some views about
cholesterol are changing. By the way a total cholesterol of 136 ? well that is scary.
Once i was on lipitor and my mine got down to 138 and my Dr. told me to stop taking it.
I tried to post it but couldn't find out how to but at least one large study said that the all
case risk of death is just about the same between about 180 and 220 total cholesterol
Now get your chlosterol down to 140 or lower and your risk of dying is about 8 times what
it is when it is 210. I think Sweeden just redid it's guide lines and said drop the margerine
and eat more butter.

i have some internet reports which say that Fish Oil Capsules do not have mercury.

Thank you for your replies. I intend to visit with my doctor to discuss this issue as well as another one. The article will help a lot. The biggest problem for me is that my father died of a massive heart attack at the age of 64. He was on cholesterol reducing drugs but ate tons of eggs, with yolks, rich desserts and butter. He appeared to be in good health right up until he died. I am 62 and don't want to suffer from the same fate. I exercise, which is something he didn't do. I also stay active. It's a strong possibility that he had undiagnosed sleep apnea, so therein lies a possible answer as to why he died when he did. At any rate, I do need to visit with my doctor to discuss the issue and come up with a plan. He told me 3 months ago that he would keep me off simvastatin as long as my total cholesterol was under 200, which it is. I need to find out if the nurse just recommended the simvastatin or the doctor did. I need to find out what he thinks, so another appointment is warranted. I figure I might as well do this now before my insurance changes to something I don't like at all.

With your family history of high cholesterol, do you also have a family history of cardiovascular disease?

I read a study published out of the Cleveland Clinic where the goal was to get total cholesterol below 100.
Interesting thing buried in one sentence in the study was the statement that there was no difference in mortality between the treated group and the untreated group even though the treated group did get below 100.

The study was published in the New England Journal of Medicine several years ago.

BTW oatmeal is a good reducer of cholesterol.

Yes, my family does have a history of cardiovascular disease and hypertension. My hypertension is still controlled by medication. I also eat oatmeal every morning for breakfast, along with a serving of fruit. No sugar. I am of the belief that sugar is poison to our bodies and stay away from it. My glucose level is 84, so I'm certain that I'm doing the right thing by omitting as much refined sugar as I can from my diet because I do believe that sugar is the real culprit. That being said, I am not particularly in favor of adding lots of fat to my diet because I get plenty of fat from other sources. My understanding is that it is sugar that contributes to cardiovascular disease, not fat. I watch how much fat I eat, not because I'm afraid of it, but because I wish to keep my weight in check.

I am also aware of the fact that one can get Omega3 fatty acids from eating walnuts, which I do eat on a daily basis (single serving portion). I'm not sure of the efficacy of taking fish oil as a supplement (not to mention the fact that it makes me gag when I take them). Studies seemed to indicate that they were ineffective and that eating fish was better. I still can eat fish one day a week, and I will. I will also continue to eat beef and pork, again in moderation. I eat Greek yogurt, cottage cheese, etc. so I do get my protein from various sources.

What I don't eat is sugar, nor do I eat bread, rice or pasta, although I do eat baked potatoes in moderation. I find my body to be starch intolerant. My body loves protein and meat in moderation, balanced with carbs. Again, everything in moderation. Just no sugar.

Dietetically, the most difficult guideline is to eat 4 servings of vegetables a day. (corn and other starchy veggies don't count)
Canned vegetables generally are loaded with salt, some even have sugar added.
Fresh vegetables are perishable, and labor-intensive; but so worth it for the quality and taste.
Edit: Get enough veggies and protein, and carb cravings vanish. (unless you have ONE cookie!)

I agree, Chunky. I tend to stay away from the starchy veggies, but I do occasionally need to have some as well, all for balance in my diet because they also have things we need. I usually have a veggie snack, as in cherry tomatoes or carrots or sweet red pepper. I will have a salad mixed with greens and different fresh veggies, topped with balsamic vinaigrette and whatever protein I'm eating with it (cut up and tossed in). 3 times a week, I add something like cauliflower, broccoli, or brussel sprouts. If I do each peas or corn, I do so in a mixed vegetable bag rather than eat a full serving of corn or peas. I do get frozen veggies but as you say, never use anything from a can. Not just sodium, but the can itself isn't good. That's what my dermatologist told me. I wait to go shopping until I get my weekly flyers and then I go shopping at Wal-Mart using price check so they will match the prices of the other stores. Last week, I bought cantaloupe, raspberries, strawberries, and bananas. This week I bought pineapple and pears. Whatever is on sale works well for me. The strawberries I bought last week weren't good because they were from California where there was a drought, but I get variety and the benefit of antioxidants. By using price check I get a variety of fresh vegetables and fruits at a good price.

As suggested on one of the statin threads last year, I took a three months 'vacation' off of the generic Lipitor (with my doctor's consent) and have found no difference in my CPAP therapy or sleep patterns or anything else that I can tell. I'll still continue not taking it for at least one more month because I'm having my blood/cardio panels run in mid March. It'll be interesting to see how they come out. As a side note, I have tightened up my diet by cutting out quite a bit of fats, most processed sugar and a reduction of salt etc.

I find that by the time I take all my morning meds I am full until I take my afternoon pills. Those hold me until I take my night pills. Is this a good balanced diet?

Sir NoddinOff wrote:As suggested on one of the statin threads last year, I took a three months 'vacation' off of the generic Lipitor (with my doctor's consent) and have found no difference in my CPAP therapy or sleep patterns or anything else that I can tell. I'll still continue not taking it for at least one more month because I'm having my blood/cardio panels run in mid March. It'll be interesting to see how they come out. As a side note, I have tightened up my diet by cutting out quite a bit of fats, most processed sugar and a reduction of salt etc.

I sincerely hope that experiment works better for you than it did for me. I was off the meds for 3 months and my cholesterol shot up, so I'm back on the meds. But, at least I got to eat grapefruit for a while. Regardless of whether or not it works, you're eating right and should feel great. That in itself is its own reward. The rest is just icing on the cake.

lastlib wrote:I find that by the time I take all my morning meds I am full until I take my afternoon pills. Those hold me until I take my night pills. Is this a good balanced diet?

Ha, ha, laslib... you crack me up. The Keith Richards/Rolling Stone's diet, only with Big Pharma legal meds.

RestedRebel wrote:I sincerely hope that experiment works better for you than it did for me.

You and me both.

Does 3 glasses of wine and 2 bloody marys count as 5 fruit and vegetables?

I'm interested in your entire cholesterol profile--HDL and Triglycerides, too. Are you willing to share them?

As others have pointed out, total and LDL cholesterol are not good predictors of cardiovascular risk. About 50% of people who have a heart attack or stroke have high total and LDL cholesterol, but that means 50% have LOW total and LDL cholesterol. So do you really accomplish anything by having low total and LDL cholesterol?

As we age, our cholesterol should increase, and studies have shown that higher total and LDL numbers are PROTECTIVE when we age. All cause mortality--death from cancer, infection, and other illnesses, increase as cholesterol decreases as cholesterol increases, while cardiac deaths don't really increase as cholesterol increases (The drug companies make the relative risk increase sounds very dramatic, but the absolute increase in cardiac deaths is VERY LOW--a fraction of 1% for someone with higher cholesterol who has not already had a heart attack). Hmmm. . .

For a fascinating way to look at this, consider the "numbers needed to treat" (NNT)--how many people have to take a drug for how long so that a heart attack will be prevented? According to this http://www.thennt.com/nnt/statins-for-h ... t-disease/ 60 people have to take a statin drug for 5 years to prevent 1 heart attack. Meanwhile, 1 in 50 of those same people developed diabetes and 1 in 10 had other harms like muscle damage. (Hey, wait, Isn't the heart a muscle???).

It's important to look at your cholesterol panel ratios. In particular, a study by Harvard Medical School back in 1997 said that those with a higher ratio of triglycerides to HDL had 16 times the risk of heart attack as those with the lowest ratio of triglycerides to HDL. http://circ.ahajournals.org/content/96/8/2520.abstract

I suspect from the fruit you eat and your daily bowl of oatmeal, your triglycerides are probably high. You want that ratio of triglycerides to HDL to be below 2.0. You say you "avoid sugar"--but fruit and oatmeal ARE sugar--enzymes in our mouth immediately begin to break down the starch in things like oatmeal into simple sugars, while fruit is sweet because it contains fructose and glucose. These are carbohydrates. Carbohydrate intake is directly related to HDL so if your HDL is high (lab norms say below 100 is good, but it really should be below 50 and HDL should be above 60 for a man), then you might consider reducing (you don't have to completely eliminate it) the fruit you eat. Fish oil will help bring your HDL up. Good quality fish oil does not smell or cause fish burps. Trader Joe's brand is very reasonably price, and I've punctured the capsules to smell to be sure the fish oil is not rancid.

There are some very good studies that have shown that dietary saturated fat does NOT increase dietary cholesterol. So I doubt very much it was the butter and cream your dad succumbed to, more likely his inactivity you mention and possibly he ate too much sugar along with his butter and cream? You should not fear egg yolks or butter from pastured animals. They contain vital nutrients you can't get very well elsewhere. Egg YOLKS are a good source of Vitamin A and choline--90% of Americans are deficient in choline. Butter (from pastured cows) contains vitamin K2, which prevents heart disease by making sure the calcium in your body stays in your bones instead of in your bloodstream. It is much more likely to prevent cardiovascular disease than the statins you take. If you aren't eating saturated fats like egg yolks and butter, you may be eating soy and vegetable oils which are highly inflammatory and inflammation causes--heart disease...

You sound like you are on the right track. In your place, I would replace some of your fruit servings of non-starchy vegetables (they taste a lot better with BUTTER on them!) and find something besides oatmeal to eat for breakfast (BTW, oatmeal is only good at reducing cholesterol COMPARED to other crappy breakfast cereals. It is not an effective cholesterol reducer--otherwise they'd be prescribing that instead of statins). How about real, whole eggs?

Beware, that if you manage to get your HDL up, your total cholesterol will go up because of it (HDL is part of the equation for determining total cholesterol). Your doctor will think that's a bad thing and want to give you MORE statins. But hopefully by then you will understand that increased HDL and decreased triglycerides are a good thing, your LDL and total are not dangerous, and it makes no sense to use a drug to reverse good health.

Two videos you may find very informative:
How Bad Science and Big Business Created the Obesity Epidemic https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3vr-c8GeT34
Fathead, the Movie https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=evcNPfZlrZs (This one is funny, too!)