Obamacare Explained in One Sentence

ChicagoGranny wrote:

ems

That took you longer than six minutes to find, Granny!

ChicagoGranny wrote:

ems

[/quote

ChicagoGranny, I like to consider every side of every issue, whether I agree or disagree, but your comments on various threads, have become simply nasty and personal, and your response to ems is kindergarten behavior, and sort of the last straw for me, so I have decided to block them from this point on. Not worth the time nor the effort to respond.

Nate

NateS wrote:

ChicagoGranny wrote:

ems

[/quote

ChicagoGranny, I like to consider every side of every issue, whether I agree or disagree, but your comments on various threads, have become simply nasty and personal, and your response to ems is kindergarten behavior, and sort of the last straw for me, so I have decided to block them from this point on. Not worth the time nor the effort to respond.

Nate

Way to go, Nate! :-{)>

ems wrote:

ChicagoGranny wrote:

NateS wrote:
whereas what we now have in this country is the opposite:

Industry ownership of Government!

Best wishes, Nate

What is going on? You seem to be wiser.

How do you not get this? It would seem to me that you would be wiser. I'm sure you read and watch TV. But alas, I always forget that you watch Fox News!

+1

NateS wrote: I was one of those 30+ year old hippies - my sister, who was at Woodstock (and "slightly remembered" being there ) thought of me as a "wannbe" because of my age, but I still play all the music and yes I yearn for the return of the spirit of those days and the causes.

The pragmatist in me wants Obamacare to succeed although I would have preferred a single payor system like Medicare, but this was the best we could get for now. It is ironic that the people attacking Obamacare as socialistic fail to understand or believe that large parts of the law were written by America's private health insurance co.'s lobby. They run around fretting about "socialism" which refers to:

Government ownership of Industry

whereas what we now have in this country is the opposite:

Industry ownership of Government!

Best wishes, Nate

Well I guess we were/are Hippie wannabe's from opposite ends of the age spectrum.

I've never criticized Obamacare as socialistic cuz it's not! It is fascism, plain and simple corporate control over government to create mandates to strip the wealth from the common working folk.

What you seem to have now realized is that our government has been hijacked by corporate fascists ...
which is exactly the point I have been trying to make in most all of my posts ...
which is exactly why I say our government system is broken and non-functional (and so does Jimmy Carter) ...
which is why I say it is pointless to argue over GOP vs DEM politics, they are two sides of the same corrupt coin.

BlackSpinner wrote:Laughter - the whole world is laughing at you.

And then they cry because, by the gods, you guys can't even get something simple like your health care to work and you expect to dictate policy all over the world?

Please find another venue, BlackSpinner. Your anti-American comments are beyond annoying.

rd1978 wrote:

BlackSpinner wrote:Laughter - the whole world is laughing at you.

And then they cry because, by the gods, you guys can't even get something simple like your health care to work and you expect to dictate policy all over the world?

Please find another venue, BlackSpinner. Your anti-American comments are beyond annoying.

Hmm, how is speaking the truth about the fact that many Americans are without health insurance anti-American RD1978? I am glad she keeps speaking out and I hope she continues to do so.

You right wingers' lack of compassion is really disgusting and extremely frightening. You would rather people die than let them have access to health insurance. Of course, if they do die, it is all their fault because they didn't try hard enough and wanted to live off of the evil socialistic government

49er

rd1978 wrote:

BlackSpinner wrote:Laughter - the whole world is laughing at you.

And then they cry because, by the gods, you guys can't even get something simple like your health care to work and you expect to dictate policy all over the world?

Please find another venue, BlackSpinner. Your anti-American comments are beyond annoying.

Maybe you should find another annoying forum?

49er wrote:snip ...

You right wingers' lack of compassion is really disgusting and extremely frightening. You would rather people die than let them have access to health insurance. Of course, if they do die, it is all their fault because they didn't try hard enough and wanted to live off of the evil socialistic government

49er

Simply pointless ....

Our government is a fascist government, not socialistic ... evil yes, but not socialistic.

49er wrote:

rd1978 wrote:

BlackSpinner wrote:Laughter - the whole world is laughing at you.

And then they cry because, by the gods, you guys can't even get something simple like your health care to work and you expect to dictate policy all over the world?

Please find another venue, BlackSpinner. Your anti-American comments are beyond annoying.

Hmm, how is speaking the truth about the fact that many Americans are without health insurance anti-American RD1978? I am glad she keeps speaking out and I hope she continues to do so.

You right wingers' lack of compassion is really disgusting and extremely frightening. You would rather people die than let them have access to health insurance. Of course, if they do die, it is all their fault because they didn't try hard enough and wanted to live off of the evil socialistic government

49er

Lack of compassion, huh? You don't even know me. What's a 'right winger?" Apparently, someone who doesn't agree with you. Yes, I am a Conservative, and proud of it. I believe, just like you, that everyone in this country deserves equal access to quality healthcare at an affordable price. What puzzles me is that so many people think Obamacare is answer. It is not. Unfortunately, folks like yourself don't seem to be particularly interested in honest debate; rather, you simply attack those who disagree with you and suggest that they would rather people die. Frankly, that's really disgusting and extremely frightening.

What is extremely annoying are those who offer no solution and spend their time and energy trying to tear down what others are trying to build. And when I say solution, I don't accept, "fuck'em, let them die in the street" as a solution. ACA is not perfect, but I feel it represents a glass half full. I too would have preferred a single payer system, Medicare for all as it were. I see ACA as the next best opportunity. JMHO. let the flames begin.

Cut

Anti "ObamaCare" explained in one sentence

Pure unadulterated GREED!

http://www.politicususa.com/2013/08/11/ ... ssful.html

In fact, there is a direct correlation between the renewed frenzy to sabotage the health law and industry profits that drives Republican opposition. The secret trigger in the ACA that pushed early Republican opposition was the so-called 80/20 rule that required insurance carriers to spend 80% of premiums on real healthcare or write rebate checks to policy holders for amounts they did not spend. Republicans rushed to defend the industry that railed at the idea of only reaping 20% profits. The second trigger is that competition inherent in healthcare exchanges in states that embraced the health law has reduced premiums substantially. For example, in New York, premiums are set to fall by roughly 50%, and in California, this author’s premiums fell by about 40% after 17 years of perpetual increases and that does not include rebate checks that began rolling in last year according to the 80/20 rule. It is the health law’s success stories like these that have Republicans in a panic and it is the third reason they are going all in to sabotage the ACA; it is successful.

rd1978 wrote:

49er wrote:

rd1978 wrote:

BlackSpinner wrote:Laughter - the whole world is laughing at you.

And then they cry because, by the gods, you guys can't even get something simple like your health care to work and you expect to dictate policy all over the world?

Please find another venue, BlackSpinner. Your anti-American comments are beyond annoying.

Hmm, how is speaking the truth about the fact that many Americans are without health insurance anti-American RD1978? I am glad she keeps speaking out and I hope she continues to do so.

You right wingers' lack of compassion is really disgusting and extremely frightening. You would rather people die than let them have access to health insurance. Of course, if they do die, it is all their fault because they didn't try hard enough and wanted to live off of the evil socialistic government

49er

Lack of compassion, huh? You don't even know me. What's a 'right winger?" Apparently, someone who doesn't agree with you. Yes, I am a Conservative, and proud of it. I believe, just like you, that everyone in this country deserves equal access to quality healthcare at an affordable price. What puzzles me is that so many people think Obamacare is answer. It is not. Unfortunately, folks like yourself don't seem to be particularly interested in honest debate; rather, you simply attack those who disagree with you and suggest that they would rather people die. Frankly, that's really disgusting and extremely frightening.

What am I supposed to think when so many people on this board who are against Obamacare start attacking people who have the misfortune to be on assistance or disability and essentially blaming them for their plight. What I am I supposed think when you attack someone as being anti American simply for criticizing our healthcare policies? What am I supposed to think when all people do is criticize Obamacare without coming with an alternative plan?

Actually, you don't know me either as I am for single payer and wasn't thrilled with Obamacare. But agree with Cut that we have to start somewhere. The old system definitely is not working.

Frankly, I would take any insurance plan that got the insurance companies out of the equation since their aim is generally to doing whatever possible to avoid paying for anything. But that isn't going to happen.

I am just absolutely stunned that on an apnea board we continue to have these discussions but I guess I shouldn't be surprised.

49er

rd1978 wrote:What puzzles me is that so many people think Obamacare is answer. It is not.

The current system has had over 70 years to show it is the answer. By it's performance it has demonstrated it is not. So what is?
The US may have the best medical technology in the world, but it has one of the most broken healthcare delivery systems in the world.

rd1978 wrote:Yes, I am a Conservative, and proud of it. I believe, just like you, that everyone in this country deserves equal access to quality healthcare at an affordable price. What puzzles me is that so many people think Obamacare is answer. It is not.

I don't think anyone would argue that we have anything even remotely resembling equal access to quality healthcare at an affordable price now, pre-Obamacare, so anyone serious about achieving that goal must envision some kind of change. Access is not equal and affordable because healthcare itself can be very, very expensive, and that cannot be avoided. We all worry about how expensive healthcare is in the U.S. compared to most other countries, but even if we could cut it by 30 or 40 percent, serious diseases would still be terribly costly to treat. The simple fact is that we can do so much today, dramatically more than we could do when I was a kid, and it costs a bundle. So the only way healthcare can ever be affordable is through some kind of health insurance, and the only way access can be equal is if everyone can find insurance at a price that is within reason.

I think Obamacare is the most conservative approach to that goal I can envision. I personally think there is much to be said for a single-payer, Medicare-for-all approach, but that totally lacks popular support. Instead, we are looking at a law that expands Medicaid to cover all the truly poor, not just a patchwork with dramatically different rules from state to state, and a system to cover those who don't get health insurance from their employers for the purchase of coverage from commercial carriers on a guaranteed issue, community-rated basis, using tax credits or subsidies to keep the cost under 9.5 percent of income.

Obamacare won't really equal (because many providers shun low Medicaid rates) and only barely affordable if some people have to pay 9.5 percent of their income. So I'm willing to listen to alternatives if they come from someone who is actually committed to equal and affordable access for everyone. What is the superior alternative that satisfies those criteria: equal, affordable, quality, and universal? It isn't easy. Sometimes I hear answers that are pure wishful thinking with no evidence, like tort reform plus interstate competition for health insurance. No one has ever presented proof you could lay out on a spreadsheet that simplistic solutions like those would actually work. What would?

In the interest of comparing ideas, imagine a 55-year-old man who had good insurance once but was laid off in 2009 and now is self-employed and making $35,000. He has a family history of high blood pressure, coronary artery disease, and stroke, and in fact has had a minor stroke himself but recovered well. He could easily need angioplasty or coronary artery bypass before he hits Medicare age, and he could have a major stroke at any time. Any one of those would lead to medical expense beyond his annual income. His baseline medication costs for hypertension are high. He would be a very poor risk any company to write an individual policy for. What alternative to Obamacare could provide him and others who have similar stories with affordable quality healthcare on an equal basis with everyone else? I can imagine someone saying that his situation is unfortunate, but it is his problem, not everyone else's. Society can't afford to take care of his medical needs. But for people who reject that, who take the position that everyone in this country deserves equal access to quality healthcare at an affordable price, what will work better than Obamacare?

rd1978 wrote: Lack of compassion, huh? You don't even know me.

As long as conservative leaders claim that poor people have good health care because they can go to the ER, we can say they lack compassion.

Its true I don't know you, but as long as you identify as a conservative, we can ask you to defend their agenda. (And going over your posts, I don't really have that much to complain about, but I do fail to see how RomneyCare is "socialist." I live in MA, and all RomneyCare did was to allow me to buy insurance from a provider at the same rate they charge companies. How is that "socialist?")

rd1978 wrote: What's a 'right winger?" Apparently, someone who doesn't agree with you. Yes, I am a Conservative, and proud of it. I believe, just like you, that everyone in this country deserves equal access to quality healthcare at an affordable price. What puzzles me is that so many people think Obamacare is answer. It is not.

Its certainly better than what the Conservatives came up with. Oh, wait ... It IS what the conservatives came up with!

ObamaCare is very simple: Everyone should buy in (or pay a modest fine); the insurance companies must offer to all the same plans that they offer to large companies, at the same rate with no denials; and low income folks will get a subsidy roughly similar to the subsidy rich people with "cadillac plans" receive. A few other niceties include no lifetime caps, no massive increases or profits, and certain minimal requirements. Since the primary components of the plan are simply extensions of the existing system, I have trouble seeing what all the fuss is about!

I will admit that some people might have an issue: The 20 somethings that have been "free-loading" will have to pay (but will receive a large subsidy if they're low income). Some rates will go up, mainly because "minimal coverage" has been raised. And what good is catastrophic coverage that is capped or can be denied if you get sick? The small business owner may be forced to offer insurance, but the absolute minimum insurance will be pretty cheap, under $500 a year. Frankly, I don't get this reluctance; when I had a small business I paid 100% of good coverage because it was the best way to show people I wanted them to be happy and productive.

rd1978 wrote: Unfortunately, folks like yourself don't seem to be particularly interested in honest debate; rather, you simply attack those who disagree with you

Sorry. Big Fail here! The Conservative side of this debate has lied consistently about almost every point. Can you say "DEATH PANELS!"? How about Health Care Rationing? That's what the insurance companies have been doing, ObamaCare will greatly reduce it. Congress exempted themselves from ObamaCare? FactCheck says "FALSE." 19,500 new IRS employees to enforce? Politifact says "Pants on Fire." ObamaCare just like Canadian system? Hardly, ObamaCare is mainly an extension of our existing system. The list goes on; its hard to find anything the conservatives have been truthful about.

rd1978 wrote: ... and suggest that they would rather people die. Frankly, that's really disgusting and extremely frightening.

As long as most of the Red State governors deny the Medicaid extension, which costs them nothing and would be a literal lifesaver to their citizens, you can save your "indignation" for them.