1st 2 weeks ever on ASV-SleepyHead Data

General Discussion on any topic relating to CPAP and/or Sleep Apnea.
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NateS
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Q re Lower Number to Raise

Post by NateS » Sun Feb 12, 2012 1:51 pm

JohnBFisher wrote:I tend to agree with the recommendations. An EPAP of 5 seems pretty low. You might want to try to increase that to an EPAP of 8. It would tend to help better splint open the airway. If it works well, I would leave it at that. If that doesn't help as much as you would like, try switching EPAP back to 5 and then let it settle for a bit. Then try an IPAP of 13 instead of 11. Split the difference approach. If that does not help as much as you like, which back to EPAP of 5 and IPAP of 11 and let it settle a bit. Then try combining the two. Try an EPAP of 8 and an IPAP of 13. See how that does. It's possible you need both to get better results. In fact, I suspect that the combination of the low EPAP and lower IPAP contribute to how poorly you feel. By moving up EPAP we will better splint open the airway and the IPAP of 13 will help better maintain the open airway during inhalation, but not leave you feeling as if you are breathing against a Category 5 hurricane.

So, that's several tests:
  • Try EPAP of 8 and IPAP of 15
  • Settle back with EPAP of 5 and IPAP of 15
  • Try EPAP of 5 and IPAP of 13
  • Settle back with EPAP of 5 and IPAP of 15
  • Try EPAP of 8 and IPAP of 13
Give each setting at least three to five days. That should give you a good baseline to see which of those seems to help the most.

Hope that helps.
Okay, to report back I ended up deciding to go all the way back up to a "Max PS" (I don't have anything called IPAP) of 15 in order to feel comfortable and not deprived of full breaths during sleep. Now I feel good.

Now I am considering the suggestions made to move my bottom number up, which you and others have referred to as EPAP, presumably in an effort to perfect a low AHI score by further reducing apneas and thereby further enhance my quality of sleep and rest.

Before doing so, I want to make doubly sure that I am working with the right setting, as I have a setting for "EPAP" currently of 5 as noted above, but I also have a setting for something called "Min PS" which is set to 3.

About EPAP, the manual says:

EPAP and Pressure Support
(ASV mode) EPAP can be adjusted to maintain upper airway patency.
Pressure Support (PS) is defined as the difference between the peak pressure at the end of inspiration,
and the minimum pressure at the end of expiration (ie, the amplitude of the pressure waveform
delivered).
The pressure support trigger points (Inspiration:Expiration and Expiration:Inspiration) are set automatically
based on measurement of the patient respiratory flow. ASV mode automatically adjusts pressure support
between Max PS and Min PS to keep the patient’s respiratory flow even.
ResMed recommends maximum pressure support to be greater than or equal to 10 cm.
…and for menu parameters says:
Default 5 cm H2O
Sets the pressure which will be delivered to the patient when the device is cycled into expiration.


About ASV Mode, which I'm set to, the Manual says:

ASV mode
Treats central sleep apnea and/or mixed apneas and periodic breathing by
automatically adjusting the pressure support (PS). In ASV mode, the expiratory
positive airway pressure (EPAP) is adjusted by the clinician to maintain upper
airway patency, while Min PS and Max PS restricts the range of automatically
adjusted pressure support.


(There were also references in this thread/discussion to "IPAP" but I don't have any setting called IPAP referred to in my manual or settings guides.)

So I just would like to make sure: We are talking about raising the EPAP not the "Min PS" right?

Thanks, Nate

_________________
Mask: DreamWear Nasal CPAP Mask with Headgear
Additional Comments: ResMed AirCurve 10 ASV; Dreamwear Nasal Mask Original; CPAPMax Pillow; ResScan & SleepyHead
Central sleep apnea AHI 62.6 pre-VPAP. Now 0 to 1.3
Present Rx: EPAP: 8; IPAPlo:11; IPAPHi: 23; PSMin: 3; PSMax: 15
"I've had a perfectly wonderful evening, but this wasn't it." —Groucho Marx

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JohnBFisher
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Re: Q re Lower Number to Raise

Post by JohnBFisher » Sun Feb 12, 2012 5:31 pm

NateS wrote:... So I just would like to make sure: We are talking about raising the EPAP not the "Min PS" right? ...
Yup. EPAP sets the base that helps keep your airway open. By raising it, you "stiffen" that splint. The higher PS allows you to sustain breathing when you fail to breathe (such as during a central apnea). So, the thought is that bumping up the EPAP might reduce some of the hypopneas / apneas. But don't bump it up too much if you have complex sleep apnea. The higher the pressure, the more you are liable to have a central apnea, if you have complex apnea.

Hope that helps and makes sense.

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NateS
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Re: Q re Lower Number to Raise

Post by NateS » Sun Feb 12, 2012 7:17 pm

JohnBFisher wrote:
NateS wrote:... So I just would like to make sure: We are talking about raising the EPAP not the "Min PS" right? ...
Yup. EPAP sets the base that helps keep your airway open. By raising it, you "stiffen" that splint. The higher PS allows you to sustain breathing when you fail to breathe (such as during a central apnea). So, the thought is that bumping up the EPAP might reduce some of the hypopneas / apneas. But don't bump it up too much if you have complex sleep apnea. The higher the pressure, the more you are liable to have a central apnea, if you have complex apnea.

Hope that helps and makes sense.
John,

Thanks both for the confirmation and also that explanation. I will be cautious and conservative in my approach with EPAP up.

Regards,

Nate

_________________
Mask: DreamWear Nasal CPAP Mask with Headgear
Additional Comments: ResMed AirCurve 10 ASV; Dreamwear Nasal Mask Original; CPAPMax Pillow; ResScan & SleepyHead
Central sleep apnea AHI 62.6 pre-VPAP. Now 0 to 1.3
Present Rx: EPAP: 8; IPAPlo:11; IPAPHi: 23; PSMin: 3; PSMax: 15
"I've had a perfectly wonderful evening, but this wasn't it." —Groucho Marx

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avi123
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Re: 1st 2 weeks ever on ASV-SleepyHead Data

Post by avi123 » Tue Dec 25, 2012 10:34 am

Nate, only now I see your full report. Your leaks are way above the red line. Resmed machines can't diagnose and treat under such condition. I would get rid of the nasal pillows mask. Why don't you try my hardware of a traditional nasal mask and a chinstrap?

p.s. imo, EPAP also works as PEEP and Provent.

Check:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Positive_e ... y_pressure

_________________
Humidifier: S9™ Series H5i™ Heated Humidifier with Climate Control
Additional Comments:  S9 Autoset machine; Ruby chinstrap under the mask straps; ResScan 5.6
see my recent set-up and Statistics:
http://i.imgur.com/TewT8G9.png
see my recent ResScan treatment results:
http://i.imgur.com/3oia0EY.png
http://i.imgur.com/QEjvlVY.png

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NateS
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Re: 1st 2 weeks ever on ASV-SleepyHead Data

Post by NateS » Tue Dec 25, 2012 11:45 am

avi123 wrote:Nate, only now I see your full report. Your leaks are way above the red line. Resmed machines can't diagnose and treat under such condition. I would get rid of the nasal pillows mask. Why don't you try my hardware of a traditional nasal mask and a chinstrap?

p.s. imo, EPAP also works as PEEP and Provent.

Check:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Positive_e ... y_pressure
Thanks avi for the suggestion. Those charts you are looking at above were from 11 months ago. I've got the leaks under control now, first with a Ruby chinstrap and more recently with chin-up strips (http://www.chinupstrip.com/), and my Aloha. Here is last night's chart:

Image

(My S9 is off by a day and an hour.)

Best wishes,

Nate

_________________
Mask: DreamWear Nasal CPAP Mask with Headgear
Additional Comments: ResMed AirCurve 10 ASV; Dreamwear Nasal Mask Original; CPAPMax Pillow; ResScan & SleepyHead
Central sleep apnea AHI 62.6 pre-VPAP. Now 0 to 1.3
Present Rx: EPAP: 8; IPAPlo:11; IPAPHi: 23; PSMin: 3; PSMax: 15
"I've had a perfectly wonderful evening, but this wasn't it." —Groucho Marx

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NateS
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Re: 1st 2 weeks ever on ASV-SleepyHead Data

Post by NateS » Tue Dec 25, 2012 12:04 pm

And here are the stats to go with it:

Image

Nate

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Mask: DreamWear Nasal CPAP Mask with Headgear
Additional Comments: ResMed AirCurve 10 ASV; Dreamwear Nasal Mask Original; CPAPMax Pillow; ResScan & SleepyHead
Central sleep apnea AHI 62.6 pre-VPAP. Now 0 to 1.3
Present Rx: EPAP: 8; IPAPlo:11; IPAPHi: 23; PSMin: 3; PSMax: 15
"I've had a perfectly wonderful evening, but this wasn't it." —Groucho Marx

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avi123
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Re: 1st 2 weeks ever on ASV-SleepyHead Data

Post by avi123 » Tue Dec 25, 2012 7:54 pm

Nate, you are doing great. By any chance do you know why ASV machines don't show Central events in the events graph, like here, or is it that they all been taken care off:



Image


Re-edit: Ok, I can see on the left of the Events graph that only Obstructive and Hypopnea events can be flagged. No Centrals.

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NateS
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Re: 1st 2 weeks ever on ASV-SleepyHead Data

Post by NateS » Tue Dec 25, 2012 9:45 pm

avi123 wrote:Nate, you are doing great. By any chance do you know why ASV machines don't show Central events in the events graph, like here, or is it that they all been taken care off:



Image


Re-edit: Ok, I can see on the left of the Events graph that only Obstructive and Hypopnea events can be flagged. No Centrals.
Avi, I don't know why but I think you will find the discussion I had with idamtnboy, and the comprehensive research he did on this topic for me, quite helpful. See:

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=74249&p=682719&hili ... sv#p682719

It appears that he has removed his graphics from their storage source, but can probably still provide them to you if you get in touch with him.

Nate

_________________
Mask: DreamWear Nasal CPAP Mask with Headgear
Additional Comments: ResMed AirCurve 10 ASV; Dreamwear Nasal Mask Original; CPAPMax Pillow; ResScan & SleepyHead
Central sleep apnea AHI 62.6 pre-VPAP. Now 0 to 1.3
Present Rx: EPAP: 8; IPAPlo:11; IPAPHi: 23; PSMin: 3; PSMax: 15
"I've had a perfectly wonderful evening, but this wasn't it." —Groucho Marx

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avi123
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Re: 1st 2 weeks ever on ASV-SleepyHead Data

Post by avi123 » Wed Dec 26, 2012 9:38 pm

OK Nate, I cut my post in the other thread moved it here, and simplified it.

You could also delete your post there showing all my graphs.

My question:

Why ASV machines don't show Central Apneas?

The following is my Stats report from my S9 Autoset and you can see that the remaining Central Apneas are clearly shown:

Image

_________________
Humidifier: S9™ Series H5i™ Heated Humidifier with Climate Control
Additional Comments:  S9 Autoset machine; Ruby chinstrap under the mask straps; ResScan 5.6
Last edited by avi123 on Thu Dec 27, 2012 2:29 am, edited 2 times in total.
see my recent set-up and Statistics:
http://i.imgur.com/TewT8G9.png
see my recent ResScan treatment results:
http://i.imgur.com/3oia0EY.png
http://i.imgur.com/QEjvlVY.png

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NateS
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Re: 1st 2 weeks ever on ASV-SleepyHead Data

Post by NateS » Wed Dec 26, 2012 10:38 pm

Yes, I displayed my stats page above. I agree that there is no breakdown of apneas.

Nate

_________________
Mask: DreamWear Nasal CPAP Mask with Headgear
Additional Comments: ResMed AirCurve 10 ASV; Dreamwear Nasal Mask Original; CPAPMax Pillow; ResScan & SleepyHead
Central sleep apnea AHI 62.6 pre-VPAP. Now 0 to 1.3
Present Rx: EPAP: 8; IPAPlo:11; IPAPHi: 23; PSMin: 3; PSMax: 15
"I've had a perfectly wonderful evening, but this wasn't it." —Groucho Marx

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Sir NoddinOff
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Re: 1st 2 weeks ever on ASV-SleepyHead Data

Post by Sir NoddinOff » Thu Jan 10, 2013 1:44 pm

NateS wrote: I have ordered Karen's solution to hold the back band down in place and am hoping this will solve the leakage problem.
Hi Nate, First off, sorry I didn't read every post on this thread, and there are some long ones. Anyway, I looked on Karen's website for the 'solution' you mentioned above, however couldn't find anything, plus I emailed her that same question with no results. Would you expand on this product? Also you said you hoped it would keep the back strap from riding up. How did that work out?

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I like my ResMed AirFit F10 FFM - reasonably low leaks for my ASV therapy. I'm currently using a PR S1 AutoSV 960P Advanced. I also keep a ResMed S9 Adapt as backup. I use a heated Hibernite hose. Still rockin' with Win 7 by using GWX to stop Win 10.

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NateS
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Re: 1st 2 weeks ever on ASV-SleepyHead Data

Post by NateS » Thu Jan 10, 2013 5:34 pm

Sir NoddinOff wrote:
NateS wrote: I have ordered Karen's solution to hold the back band down in place and am hoping this will solve the leakage problem.
Hi Nate, First off, sorry I didn't read every post on this thread, and there are some long ones. Anyway, I looked on Karen's website for the 'solution' you mentioned above, however couldn't find anything, plus I emailed her that same question with no results. Would you expand on this product? Also you said you hoped it would keep the back strap from riding up. How did that work out?
Hi - I don't see it on her website now either, but here is the description copied from her invoice of about a year ago:
Swift FX back strap stabilizer $14.00 1
It did work. Since then, however, I switched from the Swift FX standard to the Swift FX Bella Loops, and after that to the Aloha, and neither requires a backstrap stabilizer. I really now prefer the Aloha as being the most comfortable nasal pillow mask I have tried and the one most likely to stay in place. (However, I know there are other np masks which have come out since the Aloha but I have had no reason to try them.)

Hope this information is helpful and responsive to your questions.

Regards, Nate

_________________
Mask: DreamWear Nasal CPAP Mask with Headgear
Additional Comments: ResMed AirCurve 10 ASV; Dreamwear Nasal Mask Original; CPAPMax Pillow; ResScan & SleepyHead
Central sleep apnea AHI 62.6 pre-VPAP. Now 0 to 1.3
Present Rx: EPAP: 8; IPAPlo:11; IPAPHi: 23; PSMin: 3; PSMax: 15
"I've had a perfectly wonderful evening, but this wasn't it." —Groucho Marx