Sandman Info CPAP -- LCD Info and Software

Hello all,

I am about to purchase my first CPAP machine. I definitely want one that has full data capability. I may be limited to a CPAP (vs. Auto CPAP) due to insurance constraints. In an earlier post, I asked for information so I could compare machine LCD information and software for the Respironics M Series Pro and ResMed S8 Elite II. I received some very helpful replies!

I also would like to consider the SANDMAN INFO (not Intro) CPAP. It doesn't appear to have exhalation pressure relief like the other two machines do, but I suspect that my pressure is low (I'll find out this Wednesday) so that may not be a big consideration for me. Comments?

For the SANDMAN INFO, can anyone tell me if the following daily information (not only multiple-day averages) is available on the LCD screen? (Rested Gal, do you know?):

apneas
hypopneas
AHI
system leaks
pressure
snores
hours of use
length and time of apnea and hypopnea occurences
anything I may have missed in the list above

Also, I understand that the Sandman Info software is good. Is that "Sandman Series Therapy Software Version 1.4"? Does it have any useful features that EncoreViewer and ResScan 3.7 software don't have? Do any/all of the three software programs show length of apneas/hypopneas and exactly when they occur? I think that would be interesting information to know. Is a proprietary card reader required to get data from machine to computer? Or can a standard USB cable be used for data transfer?

Do you recommend Sandman Info's integrated humidifier, or would a stand-alone humidifier, such as the Fisher & Paykel HC150, be a better choice?

I'm trying to be as prepared as possible before I meet with the doctor on Wednesday. I have found such wisdom and encouragement here. Thanks very much for your help!!!

~ REMDeprived

REMDeprived wrote:Hello all,

I am about to purchase my first CPAP machine. I definitely want one that has full data capability. I may be limited to a CPAP (vs. Auto CPAP) due to insurance constraints (Tricare Prime). In an earlier post, I asked for information so I could compare machine LCD information and software for the Respironics M Series Pro and ResMed S8 Elite II. I received some very helpful replies!

I also would like to consider the SANDMAN INFO (not Intro) CPAP. It doesn't appear to have exhalation pressure relief like the other two machines do, but I suspect that my pressure is low (I'll find out this Wednesday) so that may not be a big consideration for me. Comments?

Correct--there is no EPR feature on the Info (or Auto). I don't have any problem exhaling against 11 or 12 (nor did I use ramp for more than a couple of days), but of course, it's an individual thing.

REMDeprived wrote:For the SANDMAN INFO, can anyone tell me if the following daily information (not only multiple-day averages) is available on the LCD screen? (Rested Gal, do you know?):

apneas
hypopneas
AHI
system leaks
pressure
snores
hours of use
length and time of apnea and hypopnea occurences
anything I may have missed in the list above

The LCD shows, per session, for the last five sessions, the obstructive (not central) AHI, average pressure, leak "OK" or not, and hours of use.

For anything else, you need the software. Unfortunately, the software does NOT tell you event duration. I really wish it did.

REMDeprived wrote:Also, I understand that the Sandman Info software is good. Is that "Sandman Series Therapy Software Version 1.4"? Does it have any useful features that EncoreViewer and ResScan 3.7 software don't have? Do any/all of the three software programs show length of apneas/hypopneas and exactly when they occur? I think that would be interesting information to know.

I believe some software provides event duration, but I haven't used anything other than Sandman Therapy, so I'm not positive and can't offer any useful comparisons.

REMDeprived wrote:Is a proprietary card reader required to get data from machine to computer? Or can a standard USB cable be used for data transfer?

You need their proprietary cable because of the non-standard connector on the xPAP end. You can reprogram settings over the cable, but not with the data card. The cable is also much faster than the card. The card/reader is only useful if the xPAP isn't near your computer.

REMDeprived wrote:Do you recommend Sandman Info's integrated humidifier, or would a stand-alone humidifier, such as the Fisher & Paykel HC150, be a better choice?

I have the integrated humidifier, and haven't encountered any reason to wish I had an external. The integrated one is certainly convenient and compact. It also seems to have plenty of capacity.

REMdeprived wrote

Do you recommend Sandman Info's integrated humidifier, or would a stand-alone humidifier, such as the Fisher & Paykel HC150, be a better choice?

I highly recommend the F&P HC150. I've owned mine for 5 months and am completely satisfied. As I will likely own different brand machines over the lifetime of a humidifier, a standalone humidifier of high quality looked to me like a very good investment (high ROI). The price was right as my F&P HC150 cost about the same as a brand specific humidifier. Also note that many forum members have reported problems with leakage for their integrated brand specific humidifiers. Being separate, the F&P HC 150 greatly lessens or completely eliminates that problem/concern. The only disadvantage that some mention to using a standalone is that it is "standalone" and occupies its own space on a nightstand, table, or floor. I have the space so this was not a consideration. One other plus to the F&P HC 150 is that it stores a lot of H2O, in most cases more than a brand specific humidifier.

Many other experienced forum members (RestedGal for one) use the F&P HC150 and also recommended it to others.

ResScan gives you time in apnea for each apnea event, and overall. You can also see when the apneas and hypopneas occur.
ResScan does not show you snores, which both Encroe and Slivelining do.

O.

REMDeprived wrote:For the SANDMAN INFO, can anyone tell me if the following daily information (not only multiple-day averages) is available on the LCD screen? (Rested Gal, do you know?):

I don't know. I haven't had an opportunity to use a Sandman machine. I'm glad to see that briank saw your thread, since he uses a Sandman and was able to answer your questions.

Mindy, who also has one, wrote here:
viewtopic.php?p=361696#p361696
I love my Sandman Auto (successor to Puritan Bennett). It has an LCD display that shows the basic numbers for the last few sessions (not averaged) and also has software for more detail.


In addition to briank and Mindy, you might want to look up posts by Mars, Mtnviewer, One Tired Puppy, and SpaceToast who also have Sandman machines. I started to write, "have Sandmen."

REMDeprived wrote:Also, I understand that the Sandman Info software is good. Is that "Sandman Series Therapy Software Version 1.4"?

That's my understanding, too...that the Sandman therapy software is very informative, like the Silverlining software used by the legacy machine (Puritan Bennett 420E) was/is. Silverlining is my favorite. I expect I'd like the Sandman sofware, too.

ozij, who is very experienced with the 420E and Silverlining software compared the Sandman and ResMed machines:
viewtopic.php?p=356191#p356191

DreamDiver helped One Tired Puppy get screenshots up from the Sandman software:
viewtopic.php?p=308676#p308676
http://www.montfordhouse.com/cpap/Sandman_Auto/

REMDeprived wrote:Do you recommend Sandman Info's integrated humidifier, or would a stand-alone humidifier, such as the Fisher & Paykel HC150, be a better choice?

Even if a brand/model's integrated humidifier is good, holds enough water, easy to fill, etc., I'd personally still get a F&P HC 150 stand-alone humidifier. It's just an extremely reliable, extremely good, and extremely useful heated humidifier to have since you can use it with any machine. You don't have to spend money on a different integrated humidifier should you add, or switch to, a different machine later. But that's just my own personal preference.

REMDeprived wrote:I'm trying to be as prepared as possible before I meet with the doctor on Wednesday. I have found such wisdom and encouragement here. Thanks very much for your help!!!

You're doing a GREAT job getting ready!

BrianK listed the Sandman features pretty well. The LCD only shows basic info, but after you've used the software for a while and figure out how you feel each morning, the basic info is enough to reassure that how you feel is how the machine recorded the sleep. I now look at the software about once per week unless the LCD AHI average is abnormal.

You don't need the cable to change the machine settings, you can do this from the LCD by being powered on, but not blowing and then pressing both arrow buttons at the same time and holding them down for 2 seconds or so, and then using the left arrow key to go into the (Clinician) Settings mode. I think that the cable option does allow changing one or two other minor things which I don't recall right now, but they aren't significant.

The manual is TOO basic and repetative and even the Clinician's manual isn't of great help and is hard to find, so try to demand that they include it like CPAP.com would. The v1.4 software is better than v1.2, so if you get the software, only get v1.4. It's worth getting and learning from. To use the software you will also need to buy the card key reader. I thought initially that the cable would be a better solution, but now I think that the key and reader is an easier solution for the average person, or at least for me, as this option is far easier to capture the data and take to a computer vs. taking the entire unit near the computer for the cable to reach and risk spilliing water.

It would have been near impossible for me to figure out my best settings without the software, but it took a long time to understand the data (I still don't understand it all) and the manuals are pretty horrible in giving insight to understanding the data. This forum is of the only real help. I'd also encourage getting and using the software before an oximeter, the the latter is of help, but I rarely have low desaturation levels in any but the worst apneas, so I don't use mine much anymore. The software reports and how I feel is my usual routine.

I have the humidifier and do put water in it, but in my location I don't need it to be On (heating). I only use the humidifier on a low setting in locations where the air is really dry and even then I don't notice any difference if I forget to turn it on in dry regions. If you don't normally sleep needing humidified air, then maybe you don't need to use the humidifier, as I don't seem to need it. So I can't comment on it's effectiveness vs. any other brand.

I still really like the machine. It's only fault IMO, is how the humidifier tank attaches to the body, which is a weak link but so far has survived ok, but I won't be surprised by a plastic tab breaking one day. It's also awkward to take apart. Do it on a large flat surface until you get used to it. Maybe all humidifiers are like this?

Mtnviewer wrote:I still really like the machine. It's only fault IMO, is how the humidifier tank attaches to the body, which is a weak link but so far has survived ok,

Mtnviewer wrote:To use the software you will also need to buy the card key reader.

I don't have one but when I saw the demo it was this proprietary card key reader thingy where I thought they should have used a standard USB memory stick to save money and provide for more data storage.

All in ALL tho - I think the Sandman has given the other manufacturers something to model after. Oh and "User Software"

Mtnviewer wrote:To use the software you will also need to buy the card key reader. I thought initially that the cable would be a better solution, but now I think that the key and reader is an easier solution for the average person, or at least for me, as this option is far easier to capture the data and take to a computer vs. taking the entire unit near the computer for the cable to reach and risk spilliing water.

Either way will certainly work. In my case, I have a copy of the software on my laptop, which generally resides in my bedroom when I'm at home, so it's close by. You can also remove the humidifier tank and take just the main unit to avoid spills, but I can also see people preferring the memory stick if they're patient.

The cable will let you configure some additional settings, such as interface language and storing patient and doctor information within the machine, but I doubt that most individual users will want to do such things. Possibly useful is the capability to download to the machine from a selection of previously saved configuration profiles (although I haven't myself quite figured out the interface for saving them). You can also erase the in-machine data.

I would not consider the software critical (or even important) for configuration, only for data analysis. (In other words, you won't miss much if you use the memory stick.)

Mtnviewer wrote:It would have been near impossible for me to figure out my best settings without the software, but it took a long time to understand the data (I still don't understand it all) and the manuals are pretty horrible in giving insight to understanding the data. This forum is of the only real help.

Mtnviewer,

I don't want to hijack this thread (I think we're going out of scope), but if you are interested in discussing interpretation of the Sandman Therapy software data, please start a new thread (or perhaps revive an old one, but not sure if there are any relevant ones because it's relatively new in the overall scheme of things) and I (and probably several others) would be happy to discuss it.

Thank you all SO much for your assistance!

There is a lot of information here to digest, and my mind isn't at its clearest right now -- brain fog. I'll try to make sense of it all within the next few days, before I meet with my sleep doctor on Wednesday. I still haven't decided which machine and software meets my needs best. My decision-making skills (and concentration!) aren't the greatest lately. I suppose I really can't go wrong with either M Series Pro, Sandman Info, or S8 Elite II if it's going to be a regular CPAP.

My CPAP machine will be right next to a computer, so it'll be in a good location for easy data download.

Seeing screenshots and reports for the Sandman Therapy software was very helpful. If anyone knows where I could find a side-by-side comparison of the features of each of the three programs -- EncoreViewer, ResScan, and Sandman Therapy -- that would be fantastic!

I need to go to sleep now. I'm about to nod off while typing.... I'll check in again tomorrow.

Best wishes to you all,

REMDeprived

Hi REMDeprived

There is some great information in the above posts, and if you follow Rested Gals advice and check out the posts of the members she mentioned that have Sandman machines, you will find out a lot more. Some of the headings of these threads do not mention the word Sandman, which is why you will have to look through the posters posts. That is, if you want to, because that will take quite some time.

To get a comparison between different machines you could print out samples of each machines analysis, and put them side by side. A search for each machine will bring up posts with these samples on. I know from looking at the different charts I find the Sandman charts much easier to follow than the others, of course that may be because I use the Sandman. But still, if you look at the different charts you will see for yourself.

My first machine was the Info, and I now have an auto. But truth to tell, after months of checking out different settings (both cpap and auto), when I have finished I may just use my auto as a cpap. They are light machines, and you will probably need an above head attachment for the hose. The design of the humidifier loses in positive closing what it gains in elegance. I can now usually close the humidifier on the first attempt, after 6 months of practice. But after closing you always have to make sure it is properly closed. One thing I like is that I can access all my data going back to March when I started, and I will be able to do this indefinitely.

The software 1.4 manual is inaccurate - see my thread

viewtopic/t45919/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=44 ... 63#p391763

If you use an oximeter with the same time set as your machine, then you can easily see if your apneas cause desaturation. And as having an oximeter is a good idea anyhow (especially if you like naps whilst sitting up) then the fact that the software does not show the duration of the apneas probably does not matter. According to my oximeter - a CMS-60D - I have never desaturated whilst on the machine.

To work out clusters on the software I use my own rule of thumb, more than 1 event in a five minute period I count as a cluster. This may be a bit harsh, especially as it is often difficult to tell if an event is an apnea or a hypopnea. But if desaturation is not occurring then knowing about clusters probably does not matter.

These are the only drawbacks to the software that I can think of. As Briank has said, maybe the above is too much information for this thread, but it may be useful to you in decision making.

I will soon be looking for a backup machine - either an Info or an Auto - and will be getting it from Cpap.com or Cpapauction.

And remember that all the machines you mention, and the F & P, work well. Make sure you get the best mask you can, and be prepared to swap and change masks until you get it right.

Good luck. Hope you will soon be changing your name to REMDeprivedNoMore

cheers

Mars