PAP-Cap Short Review

SleepGuy · Post by **SleepGuy** » Thu Jul 24, 2008 5:58 am

Snoredog wrote:Shave your head, put a piece of velcro on your scalp, attach mask to it

The Ultimate Ergonomic Design!

ca_hosehead · Post by **ca_hosehead** » Fri Jul 25, 2008 5:02 am

My experience is exactly what DreamDiver so nicely illustrated. My noggin is 24 inches in diameter measuring at the widest point, just above the eyebrows.

Positioning the velcro attachements further back would not work for me. Then the chin strap would cross my ears as it comes up to the cap. My ears are pretty sensitive, they don't like anything to be rubbing or touching them.

echo · Post by **echo** » Fri Jul 25, 2008 5:35 am

Hi Bret - on the pap-cap for headgear replacement - if/when you decide to test it out - I would be a happy volunteer.

One of the biggest problems I have with the activa is that my head is too small (too short?) and the Activa headgear is too large... so what ends up happening is that the bottom strap ends up below my ears pulling the mask down, causing leaks at the top. (Maybe it's supposed to be worn that way but it just doesn't work for me).

If I pull the bottom straps up, then they hit my ears and that's bloody irritating, but that's the only way it will stop the mask from pulling down. And the other downside to that is that the headgear is no longer taut, so I have to reeeeally take the velcro as far as it will go on the top strap. maybe a pic would illustrate easier what I mean, if you're interested in this??

I'm not so interested in the pap-cap as a chinstrap because i don't really mouth breath, i mouth leak. My partner says that when i mouth leak, my mouth is completely closed except for a tiny small hole on the side where the air is escaping. Tape seems to work, but I always figured the chin-strap wouldn't.... comments?

BTW you're such a great businessman , i'm jealous

SleepGuy · Post by **SleepGuy** » Fri Jul 25, 2008 7:21 am

ca_hosehead wrote:My ears are pretty sensitive, they don't like anything to be rubbing or touching them.

I share the "ear" thing. One of the design issues that resulted in the smaller cap was to try to keep the cap above the ears. However, that also made the straps meet higher in the back.

The only way to make the cap larger resulted in moving the straps down a bit. However, it's easy enough for me to just roll the fabric up a bit around my ears so it doesn't contact the ear.

I will have larger cap size inventory by the end of next week (Voyager fabric only for now). Anyone wanting an exchange please send me an email (below).

SleepGuy · Post by **SleepGuy** » Fri Jul 25, 2008 7:26 am

I am working on producing a series of short narrated video pieces about the PAP-Cap and aromatherapy products and would love to get some input and feedback on the draft copy.

Here's the "How To" guide for the PAP-Cap:

To use the PAP-Cap™ Chinstrap, you simply put on the cap, make sure it’s even, and hook the backstraps below the hight point on the back of the head. That keeps the cap from sliding front to back. You want to achieve a fair amount of tension on the cap. If you don’t want the PAP-Cap™ to touch your ears, simply roll up the fabric a bit.

To install the chinstrap, grasp the ends of the chinstrap in each hand—making sure that the long cotton piece is on the inside—center it on your chin, and connect the soft elastic Velcro® pieces to the hard Velcro® just behind the temples. Adjust the angle and the tension so that the chinstrap comfortably closes your jaw and pushes up on the “fleshy” part of your chin just enough to seal the air escape through your lips. Your bottom lip may pucker a bit. A relatively light tension is all you need.
To test the angle and the tension, simply create a nice suction in your mouth by gently swallowing excess saliva and air, relax your mouth and jaw, and then try to breathe out of your mouth without consciously moving any muscles. If the only way to “mouth breathe” is by intentionally moving muscles, the angle and tension of the chinstrap should prevent passive mouth-breathing while you sleep.

Once the chinstrap is adjusted, simply install your CPAP mask on top of the PAP-Cap™. The cap provides a good amount of padding, keeps your hair down, and will work with any type of CPAP mask. The “tail” may be cut off and the new edge sewn up to keep it from fraying.

The CPAP hose can also be stabilized by mounting it to the top of the Cap using double-sided Velcro® Hose Clamp inserted beneath the product label. Hose movement during the night is then absorbed at the top of the cap instead of the tip of your mask, where even slight movements can easily cause the seal to blow out.

[The PAP-Cap™ may also be used effectively with full face masks. Simply use enough tension to keep the jaw slightly open. The chinstrap will gently support the jaw and cheeks to prevent blow-out from the full-face airflow.
The cotton PAP-Cap™ absorbs body oils and is easily hand washed and air-dried.]

I'm not sure about the last paragraph.... Any feedback on this would be appreciated.

DreamStalker · Post by **DreamStalker** » Fri Jul 25, 2008 7:30 am

The PAP-Cap™ may also be used effectively with full face masks. Simply use enough tension to keep the jaw slightly open. The chinstrap will gently support the jaw and cheeks to help maintain a good seal with the full-face mask.

sharon1965 · Post by **sharon1965** » Fri Jul 25, 2008 2:33 pm

SleepGuy wrote: I will have larger cap size inventory by the end of next week (Voyager fabric only for now). Anyone wanting an exchange please send me an email (below).

bret

i've decided to go ahead and purchase the pap cap, but before i place the order i wanted to check with you

do i need to wait till the end of next week to place the order? turns out i need the large (measured my giant irish noggin at 23 in.)

please let me know, cause if not i'm ready to go order one now

thx!

SleepGuy · Post by **SleepGuy** » Fri Jul 25, 2008 3:28 pm

sharon1965 wrote:
SleepGuy wrote: I will have larger cap size inventory by the end of next week (Voyager fabric only for now). Anyone wanting an exchange please send me an email (below).
bret

i've decided to go ahead and purchase the pap cap, but before i place the order i wanted to check with you

do i need to wait till the end of next week to place the order? turns out i need the large (measured my giant irish noggin at 23 in.)

please let me know, cause if not i'm ready to go order one now

thx!

It's looking like heads larger than, say, 22 inches are going to do best with the larger size. That said, you can give it a try at no risk because I'll send you a new one if it doesn't work like you want. That works for me because information is valuable before I get too far into this and because I can use demo caps in any event.

mulmer · Post by **mulmer** » Sat Jul 26, 2008 7:44 pm

I've had my PAP-CAP for about a week now, and all I can say is "this thing is flat-out wonderful." Most nights, leak rates were 0, which I had never seen before; when they weren't zero, there were well under .1 L/s--usually .01 or .02L/s. It's so much more comfortable and easy to use than the combination of chin strap and stretchy-bandage over my mouth that I used to use. It works very well with my Swift LT mask. The headgear follows right along the chin-strap piece and so is very comfortable and no more lines in the skin. The back headgear straps also rest on top of the cap and don't make "waves" in your hair the next morning.

I did have to do a little bit of surgery on the PAP-CAP though. It was too deep for my head, and the fabric tended to ball-up just above my ears. Once I attached the chin-strap piece there was quite a bit of pressure on the tops of my ears, which was somewhat uncomfortable. However, this was easily remedied by taking a scissors and cutting out an arc of fabric above my ears (about 2 in. wide and .5 in. high). Once this was done, the cap fit all the way down on my head with no obstructions. The pressure from the chin strap was evenly distributed across the cap and it felt great. I also cut off the "tail", since I am male with short hair and didn't need it.

I highly recommend this product.

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CPAPopedia Keywords Contained In This Post (Click For Definition): swift

SleepGuy · Post by **SleepGuy** » Sun Jul 27, 2008 9:06 am

mulmer wrote:However, this was easily remedied by taking a scissors and cutting out an arc of fabric above my ears (about 2 in. wide and .5 in. high). Once this was done, the cap fit all the way down on my head with no obstructions. The pressure from the chin strap was evenly distributed across the cap and it felt great.

I've been thinking about cutting out a bit of fabric around the ears in the design.... Did you finish / sew the cut edge to keep the fabric from fraying? Pictures would be extremely helpful.

Thanks for the review!

no_more_headaches · Post by **no_more_headaches** » Sun Jul 27, 2008 3:51 pm

I just got an arch shape as well above the ear area. It made a differrence sort of.

I have been noticing that the chin is firm when I got to sleep but late in the night when I arouse it seems there it is slack. I think the cap is slipping forward on my head.

I am thinking the cap defintely needs to lower in back.

The other problem I have is when I put my Swift LT on it seems to want to grab the top of the velcro straps.

If I put the mask on first then I have to take everything off to go to the bathroom.
On the other hand if I put the cap on first the mask has to be adjusted looser for it.

Life's a compromise.

mulmer · Post by **mulmer** » Sun Jul 27, 2008 5:16 pm

SleepGuy wrote:I've been thinking about cutting out a bit of fabric around the ears in the design.... Did you finish / sew the cut edge to keep the fabric from fraying? Pictures would be extremely helpful.

I just e-mailed you a couple of pictures, since (according to the FAQ) there is no upload capability on this board. Since I just did this in the middle of the night (2 nights ago) when my ears were feeling somewhat uncomfortable, I haven't finished the edge in any way yet. Looks like I will have to do something soon though as there is a bit of fraying. You'll see from the pictures that I actually cut a bit into the Velcro area where the chin piece attaches, but this doesn't affect its "holding power" any, since there aren't any actual fasteners right there. However, in my case this was critical to getting the fit right over my ears. In the pictures, I've sort of "peeled back" the chin piece about half way off the Velcro so you can see that clearly. But, when I'm wearing it, I still use the entire width of the fastener area to hold it securly.

mulmer · Post by **mulmer** » Sun Jul 27, 2008 5:40 pm

no_more_headaches wrote:I just got an arch shape as well above the ear area. It made a differrence sort of.

I have been noticing that the chin is firm when I got to sleep but late in the night when I arouse it seems there it is slack. I think the cap is slipping forward on my head.]

I haven't had that problem. Make sure that your ear cutouts are big enough so the cap can fit all the way down on your head without touching your ears at all. Then make sure that the cap straps in the back are tight enough. I have mine quite snug, but it's still comfortable.

no_more_headaches wrote: The other problem I have is when I put my Swift LT on it seems to want to grab the top of the velcro straps.

Yes, I've noticed that too, but it just takes a second or two to flick a finger up there and smooth everything out so that the LT headgear rests on top. If you've got a lot of excess chinstrap sticking out above the Velcro fasteners, you could try cutting some of that off. Makes a smaller target for your LT straps to hit. I cut at least a 1/2 inch off both ends of mine, leaving about 1/4 inch sticking up above the Velcro.

no_more_headaches wrote: If I put the mask on first then I have to take everything off to go to the bathroom.
On the other hand if I put the cap on first the mask has to be adjusted looser for it.

If I get up in the night, I just disconnect the hose from the mask, and leave both mask and PAP-CAP on. If I have to, I can even put my glasses on on top of all that! (That's one of the nice things about a very open mask like the LT.) Well enough for a few minutes, anyway.

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CPAPopedia Keywords Contained In This Post (Click For Definition): hose, swift

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CPAPopedia Keywords Contained In This Post (Click For Definition): hose, swift

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Tue Jul 29, 2008 6:50 am

I want to get one, and measured my head at 21 1/2. Do you have the larger size yet?

kest874 · Post by **kest874** » Tue Jul 29, 2008 8:29 pm

I too measured and found that I have a larger head....

When might you have the new "Standard" size ready, I'll order it asap!

PAP-Cap Short Review

My noggin

Re: My noggin

Re: My noggin

Re: My noggin

PAP-CAP - It's great!

Re: PAP-CAP - It's great!

Re: PAP-CAP - It's great!

Large size avaliable yet?

Machine	Mask

Mask	Humidifier