Thanks CPAP'ers for all the help....I'm curious about titrat

Thanks for all you helpful posts. You guys are much more helpful than Doctors who probably don't have sleep apnea anyway.

I'm curious about titration. I haven't gotten the Encore Pro Software and I googled Titration on Cpap but I'm so sleep deprived that I can't understand exactly what it is.

Any simple explanations? Is the encore pro software hard to use.

I'm really nervous about installing it and getting it right.
Thx victoria

vdol52 wrote:Thanks for all you helpful posts. You guys are much more helpful than Doctors who probably don't have sleep apnea anyway.

I'm curious about titration. I haven't gotten the Encore Pro Software and I googled Titration on Cpap but I'm so sleep deprived that I can't understand exactly what it is.

Any simple explanations? Is the encore pro software hard to use.

I'm really nervous about installing it and getting it right.
Thx victoria

Victoria, here's a high-falootin' definition for titration that I found somewhere: The systematic noninvasive process of inducing finite pneumatic pressure through the nasal passage to develop and maintain a pneumatic splint in the upper airway, resulting in near normal breathing while sleeping.

In other words, it's the process of establishing the pressure at which your obstructive sleep apnea is minimized. At least that's my understanding of the term.

As for the Encore Pro question, the best overall set of installation instructions, in my opinion, can be found HERE. Following Sleepy-in-AL's list made the whole process a breeze. The software itself is fairly easy to use, especially after you've done it a time or two.

Regards,

OCO

Victoria

CPAP (constant positive airway pressure) is what keeps your airway open and allows you to breathe. Titration is merely the adjustment of that pressure to its optimum.

Victoria,

I want to suggest that the Internet is not the best place to get advice regarding medical treatment but is a great place for support. I appreciate the support this site offers, I'm very sincere about that, but I remain sceptical about taking advice from those without the appropriate sleep therapy expertise for the treatment of my OSA.

I am thrilled that you have an excellent CPAP machine. That you're curious about how it works and options for achieving the best possible therapy. But I think it would be a mistake to pursue the best possible therapy in the absence of a trusted sleep doctor. Let your interaction here help you explore new depths in your treatment with your doctor. Heck, let it reveal any shortcomings in your doctor's training and commitment. But, to suggest that because a doctor doesn't suffer from OSA means he/she is lacking in compassion or ability in treating this condition is akin to suggesting that only a doctor suffering from cancer could effectively treat cancer patients. I agree that empathy is often lacking in the medical profession but many of those that have explored the nature of practicing medicine effectively in this country have concluded that many doctors are stretched to the breaking point.

The software that is made available was never intended for patient use. That doesn't mean it can't be used by patients such as yourself, but it might not be designed to give you information in a way that you can clearly interpret. There are those on this forum with a great deal of experience and they can help you interpret what your sleep machine is reporting. But please note that this data is not a guide to treatment, it is just a report of past events. Arriving at the correct conclusion regarding how your treatment should proceed is something that only you, and possibly your doctor, can determine.

I do wish you well but remain concerned that others that should read these posts will conclude that obstructive sleep apnea (OSA) is something that can be treated effectively in the absence of trained medical personnel.

Cale

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vdol52 wrote: Is the encore pro software hard to use.

I'm really nervous about installing it and getting it right.

No, it is not hard to use. To be blunt, however, one of its failings is that it is difficult to get installed properly. Nevertheless, nearly every one here that has purchased Encore Pro seems to have gotten it working. Somewhere on this forum there are detailed step-by-step instructions for installing it (nearly fool-proof instructions, actually). So, if you decide that you do want to monitor your own therapy, it's a pretty good bet that you'll be able to get the program installed and running properly.

A picture's worth a thousand words . . . Here's a sample of an Encore Pro chart so you can judge for yourself whether you are interested in using it.



The main pieces of data here are:
1. OA - Apneas (You can count eight apneas which snuck through.)
2. H - Hypopneas (There were at least thirteen hypopneas.)
3. Pressure (You can see that the pressure ranged from about 5 cm to about 10 cm through the night.

Hope this is some of the info you were looking for, Victoria.

Regards,
Bill

Hey Bill, in looking at your chart, I would guess that's what you guys mean when you refer to "chasing snores". Your pressure definitely when up in relation to your snores.

Linda3032 wrote:Hey Bill, in looking at your chart, I would guess that's what you guys mean when you refer to "chasing snores".

I've heard that term as well, Linda, but never really thought it applied to my own data. If it did though, a good example would be from two nights ago:



The reason I don't think the machine was "chasing snores" is because apneas show up at lower pressures but don't show up when the machine is at the higher pressures. You can see plenty of apneas in this chart at the lower pressures, particularly after the first time after I woke up briefly, knocked the pressure down, fell right back to sleep, and experienced a string of apneas until the pressure rose back up to where it had been. In my data, snores and the need for higher pressures seem to coincide. That's just my opinion though, and I'd actually love to hear other interpretations as I'm still building my understanding of my own apnea patterns. Take for instance the following chart from the night before last where my pressure stayed quite low for most of the night until the hour or so before I awoke.



Not sure what to think about the possibility of "chasing snores" in this chart though.

Regards,
Bill

sleepinginseattle wrote:but it might not be designed to give you information in a way that you can clearly interpret.

See below. Looks pretty clear to me. I thought you didn't use the software...

sleepinginseattle wrote:But please note that this data is not a guide to treatment, it is just a report of past events.

And a sleep study includes a 5 day forecast? The only tools we have to go after OSA are recording of events. If you're saying the software isn't perfect because it doesn't tell you what to do next, then I'd go with "talk to your doctor".

sleepinginseattle wrote:Arriving at the correct conclusion regarding how your treatment should proceed is something that only you, and possibly your doctor, can determine.

So...her doctor should definitely possibly maybe but always be involved? I think everyone should take control and keep close ties with their doctors. I think we actually agree in a general sense on this one, but I'm confused by your wording.

sleepinginseattle wrote:I do wish you well but remain concerned that others that should read these posts will conclude that obstructive sleep apnea (OSA) is something that can be treated effectively in the absence of trained medical personnel.

I'll say it one more time. Home titration doesn't mean absence of medical personnel. I don't know why you always lump us all in one boat. You can take the reins while your doctor defines what road you should be on. I don't believe people should get diagnosed and then wander off on their own into the wilderness. Talk to your doctor. Tell your doctor what you want to do, why, and if circumstances permit and they're what I would consider a good doctor, they'll be more than happy to supervise. If not, ask them why. The answer is probably a very good one. If it's not, then perhaps a different doctor is in order.

I told my doc I wanted to titrate at home because I had such a hard time sleeping in the sleep lab and didn't think it'd be representative of the actual pressure I'd need. He agreed. I've checked in with him twice now, and he's perfectly happy with how things are going, as am I.

Blarg and SIS,

I would pay good money to attend a debate between the two of you. Maybe we could do it as a charitable event to raise money for OSA awareness or something.

Please note, I am not being flippant here (no smileys above intended or implied). I really think it would be a great event.

Greg

simple definition?

finding your ideal pressure that results in the best sleep and lowest AHI.

The software is very useful-and I'm not a PC computer person. Just followed the installation instructions from Sleepy in AL. Once glitch caused by a file having a different name-but found one that sounded like the right one and it was. Once the program was working-I quit updating my software figuring that it worked-why update? Maybe I'm wrong on that one.
The software is not too useful when you feel great-and essential (I think) when you don't feel great--and feel like the treatment isn't working--software helps to figure out why. It can guide you and your physician in making treatment choices.
Think about a person with diabetes who has no idea what his/her blood glucose is for months between doctor's appts--NOT GOOD--why should we accept not knowing how our treatment is going.

Linda3032 wrote:Hey Bill, in looking at your chart, I would guess that's what you guys mean when you refer to "chasing snores". Your pressure definitely when up in relation to your snores.

The machine does chase snores but more over the excessive leaks, allows more snores, which then get chased. It's the old "Chicken and the Egg Business", as in which came first. It really doesn't matter which comes first, if the problem is corrected all is well. Jim

Goofproof wrote: The machine does chase snores but more over the excessive leaks, allows more snores, which then get chased. It's the old "Chicken and the Egg Business"...

So these baby chickens do snore inside their eggs! Thanks for confirming my suspicions, Jim...

Note to self: Buy even more baby chicken snore sensors. These snoring baby chickens just may be the next "break through" in sleep science.

krousseau,

I agree with what you're saying but not the analogy that you draw with glucose meters.

Glucose meters are consumer products (in other words, designed for patients). They are designed to give information to diabetes sufferers and to be used after the patient has received training from a diabetes educator.

CPAP software, on the other hand, is not a consumer product. It is sold with the explict warning, "Software is intended for use by Sleep Labs and DMEs. We do not provide technical support for software purchases." The conclusion I draw from this warning is that the publishers don't want to market their software to patients. That's reason enough for me to avoid it.

Cale

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-SWS wrote:

Goofproof wrote: The machine does chase snores but more over the excessive leaks, allows more snores, which then get chased. It's the old "Chicken and the Egg Business"...

So these baby chickens do snore inside their eggs! Thanks for confirming my suspicions, Jim...

Note to self: Buy even more baby chicken snore sensors. These snoring baby chickens just may be the next "break through" in sleep science.

It's hard for them to cross the Road, before the Egg's hatch, unless the mother chicken lay's the Egg's on a road with a Hill. Jim