New & Learning

My oxygen levels dropped to 73%.
I was waking up with some killer headaches from it...those went away immediately once I was on cpap. That alone was worth the price of admission for me. You may or may not have had the headaches but that low of oxygen puts major stress on the heart and other organs.
They will still monitor your O2 during the titration study...it is very possible that just adding cpap will resolve the O2 issues.

If you have never taken Ambien....don't take the other stuff with it or if you do make sure you have a driver the next morning.

Pugsy wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 22, 2019 1:16 pm

My oxygen levels dropped to 73%.
I was waking up with some killer headaches from it...those went away immediately once I was on cpap. That alone was worth the price of admission for me. You may or may not have had the headaches but that low of oxygen puts major stress on the heart and other organs.
They will still monitor your O2 during the titration study...it is very possible that just adding cpap will resolve the O2 issues.

If you have never taken Ambien....don't take the other stuff with it or if you do make sure you have a driver the next morning.

Since I use oxygen at night, maybe only a 1/4 of a months time do I awake with a headache and usually it is gone in 30 to 60 mins.

My husband takes me and picks me us as the parking is too far for me to walk, so not worried about it. Dr is giving me 3 so I can do a trial run at home before the study. I’m suppose to make things miserable by adding bands around chest and legs and head and instead of nasal canulas use a mask if I have one. Leave tv on or something that will irritate me.

When time for the overnight, bring as many extra pillows, or other things I might need to make sure I really sleep.

WhiteAngel wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 22, 2019 11:50 am

All of this is being done through National Jewish Hospital - leading lung place in USA. My pulmonologist is the one who said they would likely need to put me on the BiPAP so that carbon dioxide levels don't build up to high - severe asthmatics have trouble getting air back out, so it builds up and with a CPAP, the constant pressure would make it hard for most asthmatics to eliminate carbon dioxide.

If nothing else, I would take this part very seriously. I am currently watching my mother live with the carbon dioxide levels being high. She is completely confused, weak, trembling limbs, waiting on a room to open up in the local nursing home. She hasn't been able to care for herself for the past 2 years, and Dad can't maintain the level of care that she requires. She has been a severe asthmatic her entire life. She has aged 10 years in the last 2. Went from a active 75 year old to looking at her 2nd and last stay in a nursing. If all testing for stoke hadn't come back negative, you would swear that she must of had one. The CO2 issues are real. She tried a non-invasive ventilator (trilogy 1000) but could not tolerate it.

I can chime in about how REM sleep can be a game changer for Apnea and how it can get worse during that stage of sleep.

My apnea wasn't anything too interesting until I hit REM my O2 stats dropped as low as the mid 50%'s, when I was being tested.

I didn't have headaches when I was dealing with my untreated sleep apnea, but I was constantly hit with almost nightly vivid nightmares or sleep terrors, ranging from being chased to falling off of high places, to being chased and caught, and feeling the results... Lots of dreams were I'd die, then have like hallucinogenic abstract like light shows go off in my head culminating in a blinding bright light and a feeling of utter terror, then I'd wake up, heart pounding, breathing fast... etc. This went on for most of my childhood getting progressively worse as I grew older, but I'd kind of worked out it was normal somehow by then, (looking back I feel kind of stupid, I didn't fight to get seen by doctors who'd take me seriously)

I got a sleep test 10 years prior to my official diagnosis and experienced a very strange thing, about once or twice a year when I was younger I'd fall asleep and "To me" have a feeling that I'd instantly woken up later with no time having transpired, of course this would happen on the one night I was getting a sleep test. The results were "Inconclusive" no idea what that was supposed to mean. I was like 18ish "I forget" and was like, OK doctor knows best... time to see a shrink.

10 years later I got tested again and OMG!!! I had a split study and when they woke me up and put me on CPAP, I woke up hours later feeling light some one had slipped me drugs, I was so wired and "Alive" then I got the good news/bad news. Good news I had profoundly sever sleep apnea (Good because I wasn't crazy) bad news... I got my introduction into the wonderful world of sleep medicine were I had to wait almost a month to get my first machine.

Since I've been on PAP I seldom get night mares, when I do they're more like watching something scary on TV, with a sense of detachment, and they don't bother me really, No more dreams of death or falling and not waking up before hitting the ground, (Darn that was a creepy feeling)

I can honestly say that I'm a "Firm believer in CPAP" - my skepticism is more focused on the fact that getting professional help from Docs or Medical service companies that are "Supposed to know what they're doing" is like gambling in Vegas... who knows if your going to win or not... mostly not.

I've learned most of what I know about my own condition and how to best treat it from all the information and knowledgeable folks on this forum. Some of us can be a bit rough around the edges but still lots of good info to be found.

I wish you all the best with getting used to this and finding how to get the best machine and mask and make it work for you.

Your your own best advocate so get in there and learn and fight for what you need.

Restwell,

Gryphon

The MOST IMPORTANT thing your sleep study showed is that you are not getting adequate oxygen in your sleep. You also noted

I can actually feel my tongue sliding back and blocking my airway as I am dosing off

. THAT's obstructive sleep apnea. No question. No scam. This is not a moneymaking scheme, this is your life.

I assume you get your supplemental 02 either via nasal canula or face mask. Neither one is going to work unless the oxygen can get down into your airway, and it cannot if the airway is obstructed.

Honey, it's time to get real, before you really become a real angel! You have a serious and life-threatening issue with sleep apnea, there is NO doubt about it. You don't need a split study to tell you this. The most important thing is to get on a PAP machine ASAP. While it would be useful to know how severe your sleep apnea really is, the most important thing is to get treated and you have a better shot at a better titration with an all night study.

You may find it hard to lose weight, you may keep gaining because sleeping all night bathed in stress hormones like cortisol that are secreted when your body can't get enough oxygen mess with your hormones that control appetite, insulin levels and weight control. So don't fall for the "if you would only lose weight . . . ". The ONLY way you can hope to lose weight is to get on PAP and get adequate oxygenation during sleep. The rest will follow.

You note the need for radio frequency ablations--that's because of atrial fibrillation. A primary cause of atrial fibrillation is . . . SLEEP APNEA. So if you can get the sleep apnea under control, it may make a profound improvement in your atrial fib as well.

Look forward to the health improvements, they are going to be profound. Open your mind to new possibilities for health and kick the skepticism to the curb.

And BTW, please get your husband in too!!!

husband snores like a train and switches all night (yes, he needs to go in).

Don't engage in a race to see who ends up in diapers first.

Excuse me DS, but when's the last time YOU checked on vaping? I'm talking about days old info from very legit sites... I think you need to read more. This isn't about quitting smoking but staying alive - vaping IS very dangerous to many and you need to update your spiel.

WhiteAngel wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 22, 2019 10:18 am

Would start to hear myself snore and wake up. I am use to sleeping with a fan and the noisy O2 machine, lol.

Patient's sleep architecture revealed (I don't understand this one at all and would like someone to help me understand this better):
22.05% Stage N1
72.05% Stage N2
0% Stage 3
5.89% Stage REM

These two things tell me that your sleep apnea is worse than reported, but you didn't sleep fully enough to get the real results.

Basically, your airway closes down and wakes you up. Your brain is working hard to keep you awake so that you don't die in your sleep. So, instead of having lots of events, you simply stay awake. That is dangerous too.

You never reached stage 3 sleep, Barely any REM. Clearly you are NOT sleeping well. And not just because of the strange situation. You seem to know that you snort, gasp, and struggle on a regular basis.

As for the oxygen, as Pugsy said, it won't do any good if your airway is closed.

I did a split night study. My doctor prescribed a sleeping pill to help me since I have never slept well away from home. (Now, with cpap, I do).

It is very clear from the graphs when they put the cpap mask on me. You can see my sleep stages go from shallow sleep to going through all the stages. And you can see that my oxygen was dropping frequently before, but barely after.

Janknitz wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 22, 2019 2:51 pm

The MOST IMPORTANT thing your sleep study showed is that you are not getting adequate oxygen in your sleep. You also noted

I can actually feel my tongue sliding back and blocking my airway as I am dosing off

. THAT's obstructive sleep apnea. No question. No scam. This is not a moneymaking scheme, this is your life.

I assume you get your supplemental 02 either via nasal canula or face mask. Neither one is going to work unless the oxygen can get down into your airway, and it cannot if the airway is obstructed.

Honey, it's time to get real, before you really become a real angel! You have a serious and life-threatening issue with sleep apnea, there is NO doubt about it. You don't need a split study to tell you this. The most important thing is to get on a PAP machine ASAP. While it would be useful to know how severe your sleep apnea really is, the most important thing is to get treated and you have a better shot at a better titration with an all night study.

You may find it hard to lose weight, you may keep gaining because sleeping all night bathed in stress hormones like cortisol that are secreted when your body can't get enough oxygen mess with your hormones that control appetite, insulin levels and weight control. So don't fall for the "if you would only lose weight . . . ". The ONLY way you can hope to lose weight is to get on PAP and get adequate oxygenation during sleep. The rest will follow.

You note the need for radio frequency ablations--that's because of atrial fibrillation. A primary cause of atrial fibrillation is . . . SLEEP APNEA. So if you can get the sleep apnea under control, it may make a profound improvement in your atrial fib as well.

Look forward to the health improvements, they are going to be profound. Open your mind to new possibilities for health and kick the skepticism to the curb.

And BTW, please get your husband in too!!!

husband snores like a train and switches all night (yes, he needs to go in).

Don't engage in a race to see who ends up in diapers first.

No the ablation is for my back. I have chronic back pain and the regular steroid shots don't work because of the steroids I use for asthma. They go in, burn some nerves AFTER they have found the area that works. They did last time, but I haven't been able to go in because of the poor breathing. Interesting you mentioned the A-fib, since they did say a few years back I have this, though it only happens once or twice a year.

Told husband yesterday, he had to go in. Period. I wanted to sleep in our bed again and can't because of the racket and movement he makes when sleeping. He gave me the eye roll and said he would look into it when he ends his job next month. A big lay-off and he got stung this time.

Also, thank you very much for your response. I am actually looking forward to the machine after your post. To feel better would be heaven

Thumper68 - I am so sorry to hear about your mama! May God bless her and you!!!

Gryphon - The dreams sound so horrible. Have had my share of terrifying dreams but they are over a life time, not constant. Glad to hear the PAP took care of most of that for you. 50's for O2 is like death.....sheesh!!!!

I agree, we have to learn everything possible about OUR bodies and any problems it wants to send our way. We know our bodies better than any doctor and we have to be able to tell the doctors what is going on in a way they will listen and take us seriously!

zoocrewphoto wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 22, 2019 3:34 pm

WhiteAngel wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 22, 2019 10:18 am

Would start to hear myself snore and wake up. I am use to sleeping with a fan and the noisy O2 machine, lol.

Patient's sleep architecture revealed (I don't understand this one at all and would like someone to help me understand this better):
22.05% Stage N1
72.05% Stage N2
0% Stage 3
5.89% Stage REM

These two things tell me that your sleep apnea is worse than reported, but you didn't sleep fully enough to get the real results.

Basically, your airway closes down and wakes you up. Your brain is working hard to keep you awake so that you don't die in your sleep. So, instead of having lots of events, you simply stay awake. That is dangerous too.
You know, you actually hit on something that I haven't ever put to words - I hate going to sleep. Sleep feels scary but I honestly never thought of why that was the case, just figured it was because I hate waking up feeling like something the cat drug in.

The night of the sleep study, it was just too quiet in the room (good for most people, lol), but it kept me from going to sleep because I could hear myself start to snore, just a soft snore from my nose, just enough to keep me from falling to sleep. Being a very light sleeper (bad childhood that taught me to just at most sounds) this little bit of noise - snoring - was enough to keep me away.

You never reached stage 3 sleep, Barely any REM. Clearly you are NOT sleeping well. And not just because of the strange situation. You seem to know that you snort, gasp, and struggle on a regular basis.

As for the oxygen, as Pugsy said, it won't do any good if your airway is closed.

I did a split night study. My doctor prescribed a sleeping pill to help me since I have never slept well away from home. (Now, with cpap, I do).

It is very clear from the graphs when they put the cpap mask on me. You can see my sleep stages go from shallow sleep to going through all the stages. And you can see that my oxygen was dropping frequently before, but barely after.

Thank you for your reply - I greatly appreciate it.

WhiteAngel wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 22, 2019 4:26 pm

You know, you actually hit on something that I haven't ever put to words - I hate going to sleep. Sleep feels scary but I honestly never thought of why that was the case, just figured it was because I hate waking up feeling like something the cat drug in.

The night of the sleep study, it was just too quiet in the room (good for most people, lol), but it kept me from going to sleep because I could hear myself start to snore, just a soft snore from my nose, just enough to keep me from falling to sleep. Being a very light sleeper (bad childhood that taught me to just at most sounds) this little bit of noise - snoring - was enough to keep me away.

I became a severe night owl when I was in college. Looking back (since being treated for sleep apnea), I wonder if I had the beginning of sleep apnea back then. I know I didn't become severe over night, so it is possible. I do know that when I had a cold or asthma problems (before cpap), I would wait longer to go to bed because I knew I was going to have trouble. I think that over the years, I pushed my sleep back further and further in an effort to avoid unsafe sleep. One of those things where you have a bad feeling but don't really know why. Since that was about 30 years ago, it has long become a habit. So, even with cpap, I am still a severe night owl.

As we get worse with sleep apnea over the years, our brains learn ways to compensate. One is to avoid going to sleep. The shorter we sleep, the less our oxygen goes down. Unfortunately, lack of sleep isn't healthy either. Our brain tries to compromise with the short sleep.

Another way to compensate is to sleep lightly and wake up quickly. Basically, our brain doesn't relax enough to allow deep sleep because it knows how dangerous it is. So, we get crappy light sleep in an attempt to avoid lower oxygen.

I too, am asthmatic, but normally, not severe. I have chronic asthma that flares up once in a while. When I was in the hospital in 2014 for a knee replacement, the nurses noticed my blood oxygen would drop when I slept. The doctor that did the morning rounds saw their notes and had an oxygen concentrater sent to my house for me to use when I slept. This same doctor scheduled me for a sleep study and then a bilevel titration study. Medicare refused to provide a machine because he did not document a face to face meeting where we discussed sleep apnea before he scheduled the first sleep study. I ended up going though testing a second time. My blood oxygen dropped to 63% before they placed my on oxygen in order to complete the test. I had to go through a second titration study, and I used Ambien during both of these studies. I slept long enough for them to complete most of the testing, but they could not find a good pressure range for me, so they prescribed 20 - 25 IPAP and 15 - 20 EPAP. I had my first severe asthma attack this spring which caused me to go to the emergency room when I couldn't get it under control. I used so much albuterol trying to control the asthma, I ended up with AFIB. I ended up spending two nights in the hospital while they tried to get the AFIB under control. While I was in the hospital, the oxygen alarm would immediately start going off if I dozed off. However, when I slept with my machine on, the alarm never went off, which tells me the machine is keeping my blood oxygen at an acceptable level when sleeping. I also used my machine when I had surgery in 2016 and 2018 and the oxygen level alarm never when off when I slept while I was in the hospital either time.

Julie wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 22, 2019 3:22 pm

Excuse me DS, but when's the last time YOU checked on vaping? I'm talking about days old info from very legit sites... I think you need to read more. This isn't about quitting smoking but staying alive - vaping IS very dangerous to many and you need to update your spiel.

How about posting some links to peer reviewed studies to back your claim. I would love to see credible evidence one way or the other on vaping.

babydinosnoreless wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 22, 2019 7:40 pm

Julie wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 22, 2019 3:22 pm

Excuse me DS, but when's the last time YOU checked on vaping? I'm talking about days old info from very legit sites... I think you need to read more. This isn't about quitting smoking but staying alive - vaping IS very dangerous to many and you need to update your spiel.

How about posting some links to peer reviewed studies to back your claim. I would love to see credible evidence one way or the other on vaping.

There have been several stories on the news this week about vaping and serious problems. Nicotine is still a dangerous chemical and very addictive. It also varies how much nicotine and other chemicals are in the various batches that people buy.


https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-n ... s-n1044216

This first link was on the news a couple nights ago. They had several people (who have not smoked or vaped previously) have an mri before and after vaping.


https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nat ... 081792001/

https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/health/ ... out-vaping

A lot of younger people really think that vaping is safe, and they do not consider it smoking. I have recently been to several doctors. I went to the ER with severe pain, was diagnosed with gall stones, then went to the specialist and surgeon, had the surgery, then to a cardiologist since my blood pressure is high. Then recently to the prompt care with a bad cough. ALL of the various doctors and nurses asked me if I smoke. I do not. (I don't vape either). But none of them asked if I vape. I suspect that most doctors consider both to be smoking. But the younger generation considers them to be two different things. I wonder how many of them would tell the doctor no when asked if they smoke, and not bother to mention that they vape. That could really mislead the doctors and cause them to miss something important.

Just a bit of reading about sleep and weight... https://science.howstuffworks.com/life/ ... esity1.htm