gluing the mask on

[OldLincoln]

I know the instructions say to avoid petroleum products around the seal because of deterioration, but I remain a tad skeptical. In my experience, silicone gaskets are used around petroleum instead of rubber because it can stand up to it whereas rubber cannot. So, has anybody actually used petroleum on seals? If so what happened?

I have tried pretty harsh things on older seals to see what the damage is, but so far have not seen any. This includes, lye hand soap, putting it in the dishwasher, and currently using liquid Joy with antibacterial stuff. I guess I can take an old seal and put axle grease on part and motor oil on another and let it sit for a few weeks, but I suspect it will be just fine.

[nobody]

I've been searching for hours now for a type of adhesive that is non toxic and will not damage the mask. I can't find anything. Someone ought to invent something for us. How many of us have these mask leaking problems?

[LoQ]

If Mack's didn't work for you, you didn't do it right. It seals great for me!

Somehow I don't think you are open to a non-gluing solution, but I'll toss this out there, anyway, for you and any lurkers that might be interested. Right now I'm using the T-shirt mask liners (knock-offs of remzzzs) instead of the silicone ear plugs. It may not be sealing quite as well, I suspect, but there is definitely no air blowing any more anywhere. The T-shirt may be acting more as a diffuser, though, than a sealer. I'm sorry I do not hve a data-capable machine that would give us leak data. Sorry about that. Maybe someone who has a data-capable machine would do the T-shirt mask liner as an experiment and give us some data on leaks with and without.

T-shirts are more comfortable than Mack's, too. I'll probably continue to prefer them.

[nobody]

Ok then please enlighten me on how to do it right because I truly have no clue!

I don't know what a t-shirt mask liner is? Do you mean to say you are lining your mask with an old t-shirt? I'm not sure how that would work to create a better seal?

If Mack's didn't work for you, you didn't do it right. It seals great for me!

Somehow I don't think you are open to a non-gluing solution, but I'll toss this out there, anyway, for you and any lurkers that might be interested. Right now I'm using the T-shirt mask liners (knock-offs of remzzzs) instead of the silicone ear plugs. It may not be sealing quite as well, I suspect, but there is definitely no air blowing any more anywhere. The T-shirt may be acting more as a diffuser, though, than a sealer. I'm sorry I do not hve a data-capable machine that would give us leak data. Sorry about that. Maybe someone who has a data-capable machine would do the T-shirt mask liner as an experiment and give us some data on leaks with and without.

T-shirts are more comfortable than Mack's, too. I'll probably continue to prefer them.

[SleepyRose]

So is this eyelash glue basically liquid latex? It kinda smells bad, does the smell get into your mask?

I dont mind the smell. I suppose you'll smell some of it in your mask. Just put it on the leak part if you want, i usually do the whole mask.

Like I said, I have no idea what damage it does to the mask.

[SleepyRose]

If Mack's didn't work for you, you didn't do it right. It seals great for me!

Somehow I don't think you are open to a non-gluing solution, but I'll toss this out there, anyway, for you and any lurkers that might be interested. Right now I'm using the T-shirt mask liners (knock-offs of remzzzs) instead of the silicone ear plugs. It may not be sealing quite as well, I suspect, but there is definitely no air blowing any more anywhere. The T-shirt may be acting more as a diffuser, though, than a sealer. I'm sorry I do not hve a data-capable machine that would give us leak data. Sorry about that. Maybe someone who has a data-capable machine would do the T-shirt mask liner as an experiment and give us some data on leaks with and without.

T-shirts are more comfortable than Mack's, too. I'll probably continue to prefer them.

I'll bet the T Shirt thing is way comfortable but my problem is leaks and I dont think that would work too well, dont know really. If I get a leak I hear it so I wake up and adjust. I dont know if Id hear it with a T Shirt.

[LoQ]

Ok then please enlighten me on how to do it right because I truly have no clue!

I don't know how you did it, but you said "it didn't help at all." That sounds to me pretty much like you really didn't think much of that suggestion and gave it perhaps a less-than-100% try, but hopefully I'm wrong in that impression. Here's what I do. I flatten out a lump of the Mack's (inside a ziplock bag) by placing a cutting board on top of the bag which is on top of the counter and mashing it down firmly. I mash it pretty much as thin as possible, maybe 1/16" thick or so. You may wish to stop before you get it as thin as possible, as you can probably get it thinner than I can. Then I remove it from the bag with a butter knife and set it on top of the bag. I never touch it with my fingers. Then I use the butter knife to cut it into 1/4" wide strips, and then transfer them to the mask around the seal. Takes one lump for my petite comfort-gel nasal mask; your FF mask may require 2 or more lumps. I use the knife to sort of mash it to the seal. I try not to touch it ever with my skin.

I don't know what a t-shirt mask liner is? Do you mean to say you are lining your mask with an old t-shirt? I'm not sure how that would work to create a better seal?

I'm really lining my face around my nose where the mask makes contact with my face. Search the forum for remzzzs. jules had a post suggesting how to make duplicates of these with a T-shirt. Basically, I take a rectangle of cloth, slightly bigger than my mask, cut from a T-shirt, then I fold it in half along the vertical axis and make 2 snips to create a hole for my nose. Then I open it up and have sort of a triangle shape that just fits over the lower half of my nose and presses against my skin when I don my mask. I keep it very simple. After I put on the mask, I fold over the corners by my eyes onto the mask and use a dot of Mack's silicone to stick the corners to the mask so they won't be in my eyes.

[SleepyRose]

Ok then please enlighten me on how to do it right because I truly have no clue!

I don't know how you did it, but you said "it didn't help at all." That sounds to me pretty much like you really didn't think much of that suggestion and gave it perhaps a less-than-100% try, but hopefully I'm wrong in that impression. Here's what I do. I flatten out a lump of the Mack's (inside a ziplock bag) by placing a cutting board on top of the bag which is on top of the counter and mashing it down firmly. I mash it pretty much as thin as possible, maybe 1/16" thick or so. You may wish to stop before you get it as thin as possible, as you can probably get it thinner than I can. Then I remove it from the bag with a butter knife and set it on top of the bag. I never touch it with my fingers. Then I use the butter knife to cut it into 1/4" wide strips, and then transfer them to the mask around the seal. Takes one lump for my petite comfort-gel nasal mask; your FF mask may require 2 or more lumps. I use the knife to sort of mash it to the seal. I try not to touch it ever with my skin.

I think Ill try the Macks. Where do you put it on your mask so it doesnt touch your skin? I roll mine in my hand and use it for eye leaks and I havent had any skin or mask or Macks problems but I think Ill do the whole mask tonight and see what happens.

[LoQ]

I'll bet the T Shirt thing is way comfortable but my problem is leaks and I dont think that would work too well, dont know really. If I get a leak I hear it so I wake up and adjust. I dont know if Id hear it with a T Shirt.

My problem is leaks, too, especially with air blowing into my eyes. The silicone sometimes solves that, sometimes not. You think it wouldn't work too well, but I would just challenge you to ponder this. YOU HAVEN'T TRIED IT. How could you possibly know that it won't work? If you have an old piece of material, preferably soft cotton like T-shirt, it would cost you nothing to cut out a square and cut a hole for your nose or nose+mouth, then put it on under your mask and fire up the machine. See for yourself whether you are right that it won't work. You don't even have to go to sleep to test this.

My one tip to you would be to refrain from making the hole for your nose too big. If you get it too big, you WILL get leaks because the hole for your nose may extend to the mask seal, and that defeats the purpose. I find it is easy to get the hole too big, so I make it smaller than I think I need it. If it truly won't go on, I snip just a tiny bit further until it just barely fits over the tip of my nose and makes contact with my face.

Each of us has to figure out what works best for us. If eyelash glue works for you, more power to you. I support whatever works for people. Frankly, the T-shirt is a lot simpler to install than messing with all that Mack's, so I'm happy to switch. Sleep has become a 2nd job, and I'm always looking for ways to save time.

[LoQ]

I try not to touch it ever with my skin.

I think Ill try the Macks. Where do you put it on your mask so it doesnt touch your skin? I roll mine in my hand and use it for eye leaks and I havent had any skin or mask or Macks problems but I think Ill do the whole mask tonight and see what happens.

Sorry, that didn't come across very clearly. I try not to touch it ever with my skin while making the seal. When I don the mask, of course it has to make complete contact with the skin of my face. Mack's becomes less sticky as you handle it and it picks up body oil. That's why I do not touch it ever until my face touches it. I want it to be as sticky as possible. Rolling it out in your hand is just a way of making it less sticky, in my experience, so I quit doing that and devised a method where I never have to touch it while making the seal ring.

[SleepyRose]

I'll bet the T Shirt thing is way comfortable but my problem is leaks and I dont think that would work too well, dont know really. If I get a leak I hear it so I wake up and adjust. I dont know if Id hear it with a T Shirt.

YOU HAVEN'T TRIED IT. How could you possibly know that it won't work?

I didnt say it wouldnt work, I said I didnt think it would but didnt know.

[LoQ]

Perhaps I was being too subtle. Let me get straight to the point. This is a dead easy, cheap thing to try, and it doesn't require sacrificing a night that you might have gotten more rest otherwise to find out if it works or not. When there is something like this that is easy and cheap to try, it is incredibly unwise to start imagining that it might not work when you can just try it and find out whether it does or does not work. But I must say, the only one you are hurting with that kind of thinking is yourself. You hurt yourself because you may be missing out on something that you'd really find solved a lot of problems, simply because you decided in advance that it might not work.

I don't see how you have anything to lose by trying it, but on the other hand, I also applaud choices. If you find a different solution that you are happy with, please share it. Lots of people here are trying to solve the leak problem. Your expertise in alternative solutions may be just the thing that helps someone else.

I really am not trying to persuade you to try something you think won't work; I'm trying to help you think in a different way that might be profitable to you. It makes no difference to me whether or not you try it. I am grateful to my father for passing on to me the knowledge of how important it is to at least consider other points of view. I sometimes try to pass that gift on to others; it is often a frustrating task. I bet my father often experienced the same frustration with me.

If you want to give the T-shirt liner a try, great, maybe you can share your experiences, good or bad, with us. If not, that's fine, too. Really, it is. Your judgment is based on a different set of experiences than mine, and for all I know, you are a better predictor than I am of whether little squares of T-shirt with nose cut-outs will help to control leaks when placed under the mask.

[kopoloff]

I have just noted the comments about use of petroleum based products with silicon mask items.

Silicon loves petroleum based products. It gets so excited about it that it turns into a quivering jelly.

In my automotive days (just a hobby when I was young, fearless, a lot richer, and had hair) we never used silicone products anywhere near fuel systems. The resultant mess could cause untold damage.

K

[nobody]

The eyelash glue definitely worked. I'm 99.9% sure it is the same thing as liquid latex, which can be bought much cheaper than the eyelash glue, just FYI.

I only put it on the part that had huge leaks and it stayed stuck there for about 7 hours. It came undone at 6:30am. Unfortunately the mask leaked a small stream into my eyes all night and they're very irritated. I was afraid to put that ammonia stinking stuff near my eyes.

I will try the silicone way that LoQ presented here. I have a wad of silicone but it's been rolled around in my hands a million times, it's not very sticky. LoQ do you have to put a new strip of it on every night? I don't see that as being a very cheap alternative unless you know of someplace you can buy silicone putty in bulk? The earplugs are not very cheap if you have to put a new strip of it on every night.

So I will be searching for another type of glue that is cheap, does not destroy the mask, does not stink, and is otherwise non toxic to put on my skin for 7 or 8 hours. I do love this mask, it is extremely comfortable otherwise. This is a FP432 full face mask. I don't know what the leak rate is supposed to be for this mask, but the line looks a lot better than my quattro ever did (that's with the stinky eyelash glue).

[SleepyRose]

Stinky eyelash glue,

I suppose if you just Google the eyelash glue ingredients you'll come up with other types.

I personally reuse my macks putty, I just leave it on the mask and wipe it clean like I do the rest of the mask. As far as eye leaks are concerned, I just wait till I'm laying down, take 2 small wads of Macks and smoosh them into the mask where the eye leaks are. Ive never had a prob with the putty losing stickiness but maybe it's a different putty. I always make sure my hands are squeaky clean. Also, when I use the eyelash stuff, I make sure the mask and my face both are squeaky clean and dry.

I realize that re-using the Macks may not be kosher but like you said, it's too expensive to use new every night. Mask leaks are such a huge issue it seems.

BTW, I had great success last night with the putty strip on the entire mask. Im going to check my stats here in a bit but Ill bet my leaks are way low. (I hope)

Checked my card...no data, ugh. I'll reformat it and see what happens tomorrow.