Keeping Our Wonderful Forum a Great Place to Be

[NightHawkeye]

I kinda like Mile High Sleeper's suggestions for posters.
I'd whittle 'em down for brevity though. (More folks are likely to actually read it if it's brief!)

1. Focus on the content, not on the person.
2. Support the person.
3. Make things better.
4. Lead by example.

These simple suggestions could be included in the message board home page to serve as a constant reminder for everyone. A simple reminder is all it takes for folks who are inclined to want to do the right thing here.

Regards,
Bill ( . . . believing this thread is, ironically, an example of group think)

[rested gal]

Perhaps I'm too easy going. Plus, I kinda' like seeing peoples' personalities and emotions showing from time to time. Not saying that I like what I see in some instances, but it can sometimes be revealing about "how" the person thinks. Gives me more to weigh when I look at some of the stuff they put forth as "fact" from their perspective.

I understand the concern that some people might get offended to the point of leaving. Message boards in general are not for the thin-skinned, imho.

The problem I see with having a moderator assessing posts for what is or isn't a personal attack, what is or isn't "playing nice", what is or isn't offensive, what is or isn't "polite".... the line is different for each person. Some people regard even mildly expressed disagreement as a personal affront (not talking about you, CG!!) Others can shrug off the most outrageous comment directed toward them. I've seen peer pressure simmer things down, too.

I like the mix we see here - lots of information and occasional soap opera all rolled up together. I think it would be an awfully bland place if a moderator started stepping into hot debates with "play nice" admonitions. It's one thing for other posters to say that...and a good thing to say it. It's quite another thing for a moderator to butt into emotional discussions saying that, because the moderator has a big stick to back it up. I'd rather see just other posters doing the "play nice" reminders.

[dsm]

Wow. something on which RG and I disagree.

I agree that the strength of this forum is its freedom. However, since it has been proven over the last couple of weeks that people just can't play nicely (even when asked politely to do so) I feel there needs to be a system of checks and balances.

I'm sorry, but personal attacks cannot be allowed to continue. Some wonderful contributors to this site have already been run off because of them, not to mention countless newbies who probably saw them and ran the other direction. This forum cannot fulfill its primary purpose of helping people when a) regulars are being run off, b) new people are being run off, and c) people are afraid to post. It's just ludicrous.

If anyone can think of a way to hold people accountable for their actions without a moderator, that would be fine with me. I just don't see any other way.

I know Johnny is technically a moderator, but I have never once seen him intervene. He's incredibly busy, and just doesn't have time to step in when adults act like children. We need someone who can. I WISH we could all play nicely, but some people apparently can't.

CG,

I tend to agree with you on this although I also understand where RG is coming from.

For me there are 2 issues

1) Foul language. This is just not needed & if repeated it drags the forum down to the gutter. The use of foul language directly offends the person on the end of it and indirectly offends others participating in the forum. It seems to me to show an unhealthy attitude to everyone.

If someone is a repeat offender, what does the forum do, let them carry on knowing they will not be held to any account ?, or apply some unfortunate rule such as - sorry xyz, you are banned for a week. Policing is a painful exercise that then attracts its own challenges.

2) Making false claims or statements, either out of malice or for some other purpose. Doesn't matter if the remarks are directed against a brand of equipment or a person participating in the forum.

But all in all, this forum is a dream compared to some more public ones (usenet has many sad examples). To that end I can appreciate RG's perspective. But, I do believe this forum took a quantum leap forward in quality when the guesting position changed & ids were displayed based on posting recognition. I think that before that change there were a lot more unpleasnt situations here.

DSM

[Rabid1]

Perhaps I'm too easy going. Plus, I kinda' like seeing peoples' personalities and emotions showing from time to time. Not saying that I like what I see in some instances, but it can sometimes be revealing about "how" the person thinks. Gives me more to weigh when I look at some of the stuff they put forth as "fact" from their perspective.

I understand the concern that some people might get offended to the point of leaving. Message boards in general are not for the thin-skinned, imho.

The problem I see with having a moderator assessing posts for what is or isn't a personal attack, what is or isn't "playing nice", what is or isn't offensive, what is or isn't "polite".... the line is different for each person. Some people regard even mildly expressed disagreement as a personal affront (not talking about you, CG!!) Others can shrug off the most outrageous comment directed toward them. I've seen peer pressure simmer things down, too.

I like the mix we see here - lots of information and occasional soap opera all rolled up together. I think it would be an awfully bland place if a moderator started stepping into hot debates with "play nice" admonitions. It's one thing for other posters to say that...and a good thing to say it. It's quite another thing for a moderator to butt into emotional discussions saying that, because the moderator has a big stick to back it up. I'd rather see just other posters doing the "play nice" reminders.

I'm a person who speaks his mind. Read my posts. You'll see the gamut from pure venom, to pure love & empathy.

The great thing about that open forum, is, like RG said, "it can sometimes be revealing about "how" the person thinks". Rested Gal is a very smart lady, both socially & technically.

CG, just curious, why do you call this a "wonderful forum"? It's been doing just fine so far without much supervision. Perhaps you are looking to be the moderator?

[Goofproof]

My vote, not that we're voting... .... is that the forum not have a moderator. Actually, it already does. Johnny Goodman of cpap.com can step in any time.

To his credit, imho, he pretty much lets the forum operate in a laissez faire manner. I think that's one of the biggest strengths of this forum, compared to other apnea boards I've participated in.

That's basically what I think, most of us are adults, or supposed to be. Time would be better spent making our shells thicker if need be, or in other terms, "Don't wear your feelings on your shoulder if you can't protect them."

Johnny, can step in if need be, it's his show. Some here are bias at different things, that's ok too. We all have reasons for what we think, some are correct some aren't, most people can make up their own minds. Jim

[blarg]

Has anybody watched the presidential debates? They are full of "personal attacks".

Presidential debates are specificially and pointedly not newbie friendly. Would you like a presidential debate atmosphere here? I'm confused.

You want vanilla? Stay in college.

Perhaps we can all agree on Rocky Road? Sometimes I feel like we're serving each other skunk smell ice cream.

[CollegeGirl]

Wow, Rabid, thanks for proving my point by attacking me personally with zero provocation.

I'm curious as to why you thought I was being sarcastic with the word "wonderful." I wasn't at all. I DO sincerely think this is a wonderful forum.

And as for your kind nomination of me as moderator, I would have to turn it down. I'm afraid having to read 1500 pages a week and write 40, work part-time, be the co-chair of a student organization, copy-edit the school newspaper, write for the school newspaper, tutor people in Spanish and help people in the chat room precludes me from having spare time to do that.

I don't want "vanilla." I love that this forum has differing opinions. I want courtesy, and for people to act like adults. I'm 28 years old - I returned to college after having worked in the 'real world' for several years. I worked at a trucking company for three years, and I can tell you that those men were ALWAYS polite to me. If expecting you to be courteous is too much to ask, then apparently you have quite different standards for yourself and your behavior than the people I choose to associate with.

Perhaps RG is right. I had a different opinion of you up until this post. I will certainly be reevaluating everything else you say from here on out.

[dsm]

Rabid / CG

Thanks for the points made - nuf said.

Cheers

DSM

[Guest]

Having been involved in running, moderating and visiting MANY internet forums for 10 years now, I must say...... All public internet forums should be well moderated. I have hundreds to stories and examples of why, I'll spare the details.

On a side note: This forum already has a major flaw, just a single topic section. It needs to be divided up into sections. I'd also like to see that happen, especially considering the volume of posters/members.

[rested gal]

On a side note: This forum already has a major flaw, just a single topic section. It needs to be divided up into sections. I'd also like to see that happen, especially considering the volume of posters/members.

Looking through just one forum (not divided into sections) is a major attraction of this one to me.

[dsm]

On a side note: This forum already has a major flaw, just a single topic section. It needs to be divided up into sections. I'd also like to see that happen, especially considering the volume of posters/members.

Looking through just one forum (not divided into sections) is a major attraction of this one to me.

Amen RG !

Yes.

DSM

[WearyOne]

I have to kind of laugh at myself for my naivete. Although I think I'm more technologically savvy than the average Joe (or Josephine), I only became a member of my first forum last summer when I discovered I have Graves disease (Thyroid board). Searching for the right forum for that, and looking at other forums related to OSA in the last several months, I thought all forums were moderated. During what, IMHO only, have been some rude and childlike posts in the past several weeks, I started thinking: "Where's the moderator? Why isn't he/she doing something about this?"

The posters that can't make a good argument, discussion, or state a POV without resorting to rude, childish or just downright mean comments aimed at individuals, I will not look at those posters with the same respect and will probably end up not reading any of their posts in the future. Personally, I just don't like debating in that way and lose respect for people who do. Disagree with the point, not bash the one making the point.

But there are people who really do like being a part of that type of heated exchange, and if I or anyone else don't, we can just stay away from those threads or posters who do. If someone else is getting personally blasted, the rest of us can step in and admonish. I know I've posted the "Play Nice" type of comment myself. As well as something like, "Enough on the ___________, man. " when an over-debated subject ended up in a thread totally unrelated.

Moderator? No moderator? So many people here have been a God send to me that I won't be going anywhere whichever way this goes. (Just hope this discussion about having or not having a moderator doesn't start some of the comments for which the thread was started!! )

Pam

[felineperson3]

There's probably as many different opinions on this subject as there are posters. My 2 cents worth about it, even if not important, is to keep the forum free and open for the expression of ideas and experiences for all of us to learn from if the post applies to whatever problem we're having and trying to resolve. From familiarity with the forum we begin to learn and recognize if the negative poster is just having a "bad" day or displaying a certain personal trait in their posts such as being argumentative or always on the attack with someone. Those we can learn to control with not adding fuel to the "fire" by just ignoring and letting the fire die out from the lack of fuel (response). That seems to always work in all facets of life.
I treasure this forum for all the valuable help it has provided me and I think even with all the "flare-ups" that occur intermittently it is providing a great service to all that need help with a "new way of sleeping."
Johnny does a great job and deserves a big "thank you" for all the behind the scene type of responsibility he has.
May God bless each of you and wishing you all success and sweet dreams!

[jpd23]

I'm a newbie - eight days on the hose. I think this forum is fantastic and it has really helped me learn about OSA and xPAP. It has also given me a tremendous emotional boost as I adjust to a new sleeping lifestyle to know that there are so many knowledgeable, wise, compassionate, generous and well-spoken folks in the same or similar boat as myself working together and supporting each other. Thank you.

So, I am not discouraged or dissuaded by the posts that have caused so much concern. In any community of this size there is going to be disagreement and sometimes the discourse may veer from the accurate, productive, or even mature.

That's OK, I'm a grown up and can sift through the dross to find the gems. I also know that is my responsibility to independently evaluate (perhaps with the help of my doctor) the advice, facts, and opinions offered about how to treat a medical condition.

From what I have read over the last three weeks, the ratio of folks behaving well far outweighs the opposite so I don't think you need a moderator to keep the newbies from being scared. I personally prefer a discussion policed only by the participants.

That's my two-cents (which is way more than I have earned in three weeks of lurking and now a single post).

[meister]

Keep an open mind and let everyone express their views. Do we
really want to steer everyone to the same machine and same mask?
In reality, we are all unique and can add tremendous value by sharing
our experiences with others.