Need help, suspect UARS. Want to try APAP - need advice and guidance.

[ChicagoGranny]

And, over the years, the vibrations from "benign" snoring can damage the nerves that connect to the airway muscles. The signals from the brain no longer get through clearly ... and ... apnea.

[palerider]

And, over the years, the vibrations from "benign" snoring can damage the nerves that connect to the airway muscles. The signals from the brain no longer get through clearly ... and ... apnea.

Yup, snoring, in and of itself is bad.

[canyouhearmeaya]

Well to update, still no progress at the moment. I've re-ordered the Airsense 10 For Her, and this time I'm going to be persistent and stick with it as last time I gave up far too easily.

I'm also going to not use sleep aids (i.e. Benadryl) as the few nights I managed to sleep with it for a short while, I'd used Nytol (UK equivalelent to Benadryl.) I suspect this drug doesn't sit well with me. I used some the night before last (with no cpap etc, just a regular night as was having some insomnia weirdly) and yesterday I felt the worst I've felt in ages. I was flat out miserable and feeling crap, and now I suspect this might be the effect Benadryl has on me. So in hindsight, even if there had been an improvement in quality of sleep the nights I used the CPAP, that might have been entirely masked by the side effect / hangover of the Benadryl.

Question: How detrimental to therapy are small mouth leaks when using P10 Nasal pillows? Will you lose pressure/air if the mouth is open ever so slightly, even if you're still nasal breathing?

To update on the NHS, i'm seeing another ENT in 2 weeks, and in a month they are going to do their own sleep study, however it will be another home one - however they feel it will be more comprehensive and detailed than the one I did privately. I sent them the report I have for the existing study, and the sleep doctor said he felt I was having short hypopneas, but will wait for their study to confirm.

[prodigyplace]

You can train yourself to use your tongue to seal the back of your mouth.
I occasionally lose some air if I need to cough, but otherwise can open my mouth without air escaping unless my tongue relaxes too.

[canyouhearmeaya]

You can train yourself to use your tongue to seal the back of your mouth.
I occasionally lose some air if I need to cough, but otherwise can open my mouth without air escaping unless my tongue relaxes too.

This is what I've been doing after the last 3 weeks haha! I discovered my tongue posture was entirely wrong, and my tongue never rested on the roof of my mouth!

I was hoping fixing the tongue posture might fix my sleep breathing issue, but so far it doesn't seem to have but equally I suppose it's early days. None the less I did wonder how this might benefit CPAP.

[mtnguyen]

good luck

[ChicagoGranny]

I am the same as you, foolishly followed buteyko method, that forces you to breathe through your nose meanwhile if your nasal airway is narrow or short, breathing through your nose is not enough, reason why people open their mouth to breathe is either because of prolonged nasal congestion or their nose just sucks at breathing. mouth breathing is an innate adaptation to get more air, "a behavioral adaptation to increase air intake and hence supply more oxygen to the muscles" wiki of "mouth breathing", if you have some problem with your nasal breathing and not breathe through your mouth, you are even worse than a mouth breather. I shouldn't have listened to so called revolution doctors who spread "genius" health practices that saying everyone doing their innate adaptation to the environment is wrong, by doing so you are actually doing natural selection process on yourself. You should see an orthodontist, take a cephalometric analysis to see if you have any malocclusion, or misaligned jaws, get your teeth and jaws realigned, see ENT doctor, see if your airway is narrow( which I am 90% sure you have) and do something about it.

Good advice.

[canyouhearmeaya]

So I got my Airsense 10 Auto 'For Her' back yesterday, and used it last night. Whether it's the machine that's different, or me, it definitely feels easier to breathe with this time. I managed to wear it all night last night. Wasn't a great nights sleep, I had my mouth taped to prevents leaks but somehow it was still leaking into my mouth? Woke up with a VERY dry mouth, and I think it kept waking me up when this was happening. It's as if the air was leaking INTO my mouth but not OUT due to it being taped. I also decided to run in regular Auto mode with Comfort on last night, rather than 'for her'. Still using p10 pillows.

Here's last nights data. Any thoughts? Does it look like it might be worth trying to bump my initial pressure up from 7 closer to 10? Was surprised to see all those clear airway events, especially during the early hours of the morning. To me it felt like that would of been caused by the mouth leak stuff, but I understand people on here say it wouldn't show that as a clear airway?

[mtnguyen]

great

[Cpapian]

Canyouhearmeya!

What are you allergic to? Have you seen an allergist to determine the root cause of your problem?

Failing seeing a specialist, you could narrow it down somewhat. I guess, in a broad sense, there are 3 types of allergies, 1 things you consume, 2 your inside home enviroment, and 3 the outside environment.

For the 1st, I don't see nose stuffyness as arising from food, but you could keep a food journal and correlate to levels of stuffyness.

For the 2nd, you could thoroughly clean your home environment, specifically your bedroom. Thoroughly clean all your bedding, washing it in as hot water, as hot as the bedding will allow (without ruining it). Vacuum your mattress, wash your pillows (after 3-6 months - 50% of your pillows weight is attributed to dust mite feces!!!!) or buy new. Pets ...... much as I love them, evict them for a few days after cleaning to see if it helps. Floors, sweep, dust, wash. Carpets .... vacuum or better yet evict them. Stuffed animals wash and/or evict them along with any other chuchka. Shower before bed, fresh pjs. Go to bed in a sterile environment. Don't keep any worn outdoor clothes in the room.

Outdoor allergies, not a lot you can do except remove outdoor clothes and shower on returning home, wear a mask when outside.

If these measures work, expand to your entire home. If they don't work, you still get to enjoy your clean home, but then I would recommend seeing an allergist to find out what exactly you are allergic to so you can either eliminate it from your life or get shots for it.

Maybe if notexactly this, you might get some ideas from this.

[Cpapian]

Canyouhearmeya

SWJ = Sleep/Wake Junk

When looking at Sleepyhead, SWJ is something that can be ignored. Your machine is not Santa Clause, so doesn't not know when you are sleeping, doesn't know when you're awake.

Coupled with that, awake breathing that is perfectly normal, is not normal for a sleeping person. If I stop breathing for 40 seconds when awake, it's nothing. If i stop breathing for 40 seconds when asleep, it is labelled a clear airway. The problem arises because the machine, assumes your are asleep if you are hooked up to it so flags the event.

Everytime I rollover, move the covers, look at something I stop breathing. No idea why, just do. So early morning clear airways are often just that.

If you zoom in on the clear airway, you will more information about it. You could compare it to your flow rate. For me, my flow rate is higher when awake.

Also, the machine and it's algorithm is limited in its accuracy. Like your home study, not as accurate as a sleep study with numerous hookups and a belt around your chest. So sometimes, the machine will flag an event as a clear airway, but if you drill down on it, you might see it is practically the same as an obstructive event. So, it might just be mislabeled.

I believe the machines manual shows the different wave forms. A central has a certain shape to it, kind of like a mountain with it's reflection underneath. If you click on the events tab, you can look at each event in detail. Compare it to the manual to determine for yourself what it looks like.

If you want opinions from forum members, give them a zoomed in version (maybe 5 ot 10 minutes of wave forms), because the whole night version is too compressed for analysis.

[canyouhearmeaya]

I barely get allergies anymore, certain foods will cause me to get allergy symptoms, but I avoid them. If I avoid these foods, my allergies are virtually nil.

I am seeing an ENT again in under 2 weeks. However as the first one observed, my inferior turbinates are moderately enlarged, which is likely the cause of my nasal issue, I will see what the second ENT says, hopefully he will do a more in-depth investigation. However I don't get a dry mouth at all normally, it was only last night with CPAP. It's due to the CPAP air going into my mouth, it doesn't happen at all normally, I think you may have misread my post.

I can get enough air through my nose as it is, I've used a pulse oximeter to check, and my oxygen saturation (waking) sits steady typically 96-97%. Mouth breathing doesn't bring it any higher, if anything it lowers it a % or 2 (which is to be expected, as mouth breathing encourages over breathing, reducing CO2 saturation for O2 exchange.)

I USED to get really bad allergies, that's why I mouth breathed. My congestion used to be way worse, infact it was when I started nose breathing my allergies actually improved a lot. Mouth breathing encourages allergies, as your nose is designed to filter out pollutants/airborn allergerns, mouth breathing doesn't do that. I have no malocclusion, my bite is good and my wisdom teeth came through perfectly, so I certainly don't have a particuarly crowded mouth. Infact I'd say my teeth are straighter than most people I know! (I did have braces at a younger age, probably 11/12, and then they've stayed good since.)

The reason I wanted advice on my pressures, is because the machine 95% reading was 10.04 last night.. So is 7 probably too low a starting pressure?

[canyouhearmeaya]

Oh yeah you're right about the sleep wake times, I wasn't even looking at that lol. That simply marks the time you turn the machine and switch it off, literally nothing else lol. Totally pointless stat for them to label lol!

The bit that's confusing me is, you know if you wear nasal pillows and then breathe through your mouth (or attempt to) the air rushes into your mouth. That was happening to me last night, even with my mouth taped, and that is what I think is happening when the centrals are marked. So what I wonder is, is that happening as the RESULT of a central apnea (i.e. i'm not breathing by my own accord) or am I attempting to mouth breathe momentarily, the airs rushing into my mouth and therefor it breaks the nasal breathing rhythm and as a result I stop breathing momentarily, and it registers a central. It just seems bizarre that was happening when my mouth was taped lol!

[ChicagoGranny]

air rushes into your mouth

If your mouth is sealed with tape, air cannot "rush" into your mouth. You could, and most likely, do, get a pressure buildup in your mouth at times. Do you feel the pressure in your mouth? Do your cheeks want to bulge out (like a chipmunk)?

[canyouhearmeaya]

air rushes into your mouth

If your mouth is sealed with tape, air cannot "rush" into your mouth. You could, and most likely, do, get a pressure buildup in your mouth at times. Do you feel the pressure in your mouth? Do your cheeks want to bulge out (like a chipmunk)?

This is where I'm confused! Unless there was a leak in the tape? I'm using Microporous tape which didn't stick as well as surgical tape I'd used previously, so although it kept my lips together I wouldn't exactly say it was a totally air tight seal. I don't recall my cheeks puffing up either, which is what you'd expect right? But the air must be going in my mouth, because I never ever wake up with a dry mouth anymore, and my mouth was BONE dry this morning.. How do I explain that? I 100% know full well the CPAP caused it, and it was not some anomoly. I've never ever had a mouth that dry in my life lol. And again, in the early hours I kept waking up and hearing the noise of the air going into my mouth.. How do I avoid this 'pressure build up' you mentioned? What's causing it to happen?

Also chicago, any comments on pressures based on last nights data?