Mouth Taping Procedure 6/2/06

DaveMunson · Post by **DaveMunson** » Wed Sep 06, 2006 7:17 pm

I use 2" duct tape.

greyhound · Post by **greyhound** » Wed Sep 06, 2006 8:20 pm

Hope you don't have a beard.

TheWife · Post by **TheWife** » Sat Sep 09, 2006 9:46 am

My husband has small mouth leaks, even with a chin strap. Try clamping your teeth shut, and open your lips 1/8 inch while breathing out. That's what happens to him. He's VERY concerned about the safety issue (he tends to listen to medical professionals more than me and my research, go figure ). Not about the vomiting, but about the possibility of a power outage: how would he get any air. He's currently using nasal pillows. He's been on CPAP for about 10 weeks now, not much light at the end of the tunnel.

Theresa

roster · Post by **roster** » Sat Sep 09, 2006 2:26 pm

[quote="TheWife"].................. He's VERY concerned about the safety issue (he tends to listen to medical professionals more than me and my research, go figure ). Not about the vomiting, but about the possibility of a power outage: how would he get any air. He's currently using nasal pillows. .................

Theresa

buckeyered · Post by **buckeyered** » Sun Sep 10, 2006 3:15 pm

Shortly after starting to tape I developed painful large bleeding sores
at the corners of my mouth and I just thought it was due to shaving my
mustache off so I could tape, well months have passed I have stopped
using CPAP all together since the sores turned out to be "Angular cheilitis" http://www.webmd.com/hw/health_guide_atoz/sta123239.asp
and dealing with them is much more of a pain than CPAP, I went to a ENAT
DR. and after questioning me about my CPAP usage and leaks he asked me
if I had been taping my mouth and after I said yes he just shook his
head and said "now you will have to pay the price". They never go
away and now I cant eat anything that may get on the sores or it
burns bad, I have a prescription that I put on them to help with the
burning but it's 30.00 a week for a tiny tube so I go without
mostly. Hopefully I am just a freak case of taping and Angular
cheilitis because I don't wish this on anyone.

TheWife · Post by **TheWife** » Mon Sep 11, 2006 12:38 am

rooster wrote:Let him test it with the machine turned off. When you breathe in you will pull air through the tube and through the pillows exhaust port.

The bigger danger with a power outage, is that we are sleeping without therapy and the apnea episodes will return.

Thinking about this a little deeper, I'm getting worried. If he's using nasal pillows, and his mouth is taped shut, then over the course of the night his nose becomes stuffed up then plugged, he would stop being able to breathe, and it would be VERY dangerous. Using the argument that his instinct would cause him to rip off the tape is like saying no-one needs CPAP treatment because everyone's instinct is to breathe and nobody would die from OSA because they would turn over, or gasp, or sit up...

Have there been any documented cases of somebody dying as a result of mouth taping?

When people die because of untreated sleep apnea, is it because they stop breathing during their sleep and never wake up? Or is it because of a secondary problem like heart attack or...?

Wouldn't using nasal pillows alone in themselves be dangerous because if someone's nose got plugged, but their mouth was shut, even without tape, they too might not breathe?

Too many unknown variables. I think we'll put mouth taping on hold for now and look into a hybrid mask, or just put up with the small mouth leaks.

Theresa

John L NH · Post by **John L NH** » Mon Sep 11, 2006 5:22 am

Theresa,

If the two of you have that much fear of taping, with apologies to Nike, "Just don't do it.

The next time I am due a mask paid by the insurance company (November) I will try a Hybrid. From what I read on this forum, many people are having good success with the Hybrid and eliminating the need to tape.

Taping has been a good solution for me and I have no fear of continuing to do it. However, if the Hybrid works as well for me as for some others on this site, then I will be happy to be an ex-taper.

Good luck and let us know how your husband is doing.

John

oldgearhead · Post by **oldgearhead** » Mon Sep 11, 2006 6:52 am

When I taped my mouth, I had very little problems with congestion. While asleep,I would always use my tongue to first wet the tape and then 'punch' a hole through it. Also you cam expel air out through the paper
tape to relieve the 'blowfish' attack..

Last night, with the Hybrid, I battled congestion. I ended up breathing through my mouth most of the night. This morning, I felt like the entire Russian Army had marched through my mouth with their shoes off. Also, I feel bad (like crap actually). Summary: a full-face mask may not always be
'a bed of roses' for mouth breathing. I'll check the 'numbers' tonight, but
I think they will be bad.

TheWife · Post by **TheWife** » Mon Sep 11, 2006 8:36 am

John L NH wrote:If the two of you have that much fear of taping, with apologies to Nike, "Just don't do it.

Well, yeah, that's pretty much the conclusion we've come to. He's seeing his DME later today, and hopefully they can come up with some solutions. They've ordered the hybrid, but it hasn't arrived yet.

Luckily, I'm the one, not my husband, who generally suffers from nasal congestion, and I often wake up with a very dry mouth, with dreams of an unquenchable thirst. But my husband still isn't getting a good night sleep even though he is almost 100% compliant.

Theresa

UCFgrl · Post by **UCFgrl** » Mon Sep 11, 2006 1:46 pm

I am new to all this CPAP stuff like many that I have seen posting on here. I currently have a Remstar w/ C-Flex and humidifier set at 11. I use the Swift Nasal Pillows w/ it. I discovered I was a mouth breather when I used the humidifier b/c every time I used it, I woke up with dry mouth and ended up taking off the mask for that night. I have read many of the posts on this site and found alot of useful information. So, thank you to all b/c you have been a great help! After reading your post Rooster, I too, wanted to try mouth taping even w/ the warning of that one lady. I wanted to try it last night but did not have the tape, so I used the next best thing I could find. A large bandaid! One of those sports type ones that are about an inch wide. It worked fairly well other than being annoying, but now I believe now, more than ever, that I need a different mask. If anyone could make a suggestion for one who is a mouth breather and a side sleeper, I would be greatly appreciative. I've been looking at the Breeze, the Simplicity Nasal mask, or the Comfort Lite 2. It seems that it is a hit or miss for most when choosing a mask b/c some work better for certain people than others. Please help me!

CollegeGirl · Post by **CollegeGirl** » Mon Sep 11, 2006 1:59 pm

TheWife,

What you are overlooking is the fact that 100% compliance for your husband means nothing if he is not getting the full benefit of his treatment (which he is not, if he is mouth breathing).

I would imagine there is a much greater danger in undertreated apnea than in taping the mouth.

The majority of deaths attributed sleep apnea are from things like heart attack or from falling asleep at the wheel. I've never heard of someone dying because they happened to be congested and taping their mouth and the power went out and....etc.

There is a very real danger in undertreated apnea. The risk from mouthtaping is much smaller, in my opinion.

I'm not a doctor, but that's my two cents.

Maryb · Post by **Maryb** » Mon Sep 11, 2006 2:20 pm

UCFgrl-
If you are a mouth breather and don't want to tape, then you need to use a full face mask (i.e., a mask that covers your nose and mouth).
I used to use the Swift and I had a problem with mouth leaks. I tried tape unsuccessfully then I switched to the Hybrid. The Hybrid completely took care of the mouth leak problem and my leak rate decreased dramatically.
I would recommend the Hybrid.

Maryb

OwlCreekObserver · Post by **OwlCreekObserver** » Mon Sep 11, 2006 2:57 pm

buckeyered wrote:Shortly after starting to tape I developed painful large bleeding sores
at the corners of my mouth and I just thought it was due to shaving my
mustache off so I could tape, well months have passed I have stopped
using CPAP all together since the sores turned out to be "Angular cheilitis" http://www.webmd.com/hw/health_guide_atoz/sta123239.asp
and dealing with them is much more of a pain than CPAP, I went to a ENAT
DR. and after questioning me about my CPAP usage and leaks he asked me
if I had been taping my mouth and after I said yes he just shook his
head and said "now you will have to pay the price". They never go
away and now I cant eat anything that may get on the sores or it
burns bad, I have a prescription that I put on them to help with the
burning but it's 30.00 a week for a tiny tube so I go without
mostly. Hopefully I am just a freak case of taping and Angular
cheilitis because I don't wish this on anyone.

I checked out your link, along with several others after a google search, because I have no desire to cause some incurable condition just to get a good night's sleep.

Well, please understand that my medical degree came off the clearance shelf at Walmart, but I couldn't find anything that said this condition is incurable. It's commonly treated with antifungal creams. One source said that Chapstick can be used to help keep it from recurring once the sores have healed.

I do know that when I shaved my full beard a couple of years ago, after wearing it for almost 20 years, I often had very tender areas of skin and had to use various topical applications to ease the pain and inflammation caused by daily shaving. Maybe your condition was aggravated by your shaving again and once your skin is healed and toughened up a bit, all will be okay.

Hang in there.

OCO

roster · Post by **roster** » Mon Sep 11, 2006 3:04 pm

UCFgrl: I agree with Maryb. The Hybrid Mask is worth a try. I am very happy to be using one for 30 days now. More info on my experience: viewtopic.php?t=12378&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

UCFgrl · Post by **UCFgrl** » Mon Sep 11, 2006 4:25 pm

Thanks for the recommendations. I read the posts on the Hybrid and have done other research on it as well. I was just concerned with paying that much for a mask w/ only the hope that it might work. I have read several success stories but I've read some failures too. I'm not sure that my insurance company covers that one either. It was like pulling eye teeth to get the Swift. I'm going to keep trying with it until I have my follow up at the end of the month and if it comes to, then I'll break down and get the Hybrid. Thanks again!

Mask	Humidifier

Additional Comments: SleepyHead, ResScan 3.16, ClimatelLne Tube, Hosehuggie in Plaid (it's so cool)

Mouth Taping Procedure 6/2/06

My experience

Hybrid