OT: Multivitamins waste of money

There's a lot of misconceptions about vitamins and other supplements.

With most vitamins and other supplements, it depends on what you get through your diet and any supplements you take. Too little and you have problems. Increase your intake, and the benefits increase up to a certain point. More than that, and the benefit levels off and your body throws away what it can't use. With some supplements and vitamins, increasing beyond a certain point actually has a negative effect on your body. In some cases, a vitamin/supplement overdose has SERIOUS side effects, such as some forms of vitamin A.

If your diet is lacking some vitamin, and you don't know about it, you might be suffering from low levels of that vitamin. Reasonable levels of supplements may be a good idea.

Also, some people need more vitamins than others. Sometimes, it's just genetics or medical problems. Sometimes, its something else you eat or medications that make you lose more or not absorb the vitamins. I just recently heard that they have figured out that acid reflux meds and antacids may make you not absorb vitamin B12.

My great grandmother died from pernicious anemia, which is a medical condition where you don't absorb B12. I find that the corners of my lips crack if I don't take my vitamin B supplements.

The really bad thing is when someone thinks megadoses of some supplement is going to make them somehow healthier than the "normal" amount or cure some disease. Or gives up their CPAP and takes vitamin D instead.

I think REASONABLE levels of vitamin pills are a reasonable thing to take, just so you don't develop some deficiency.

I also think it's a good idea for someone with some sort of chronic complaint to take a good multivitamin/supplement for several months just to see if it makes a difference.

BTW, I DO think most of the things like "Take vitamin C to prevent a cold" are nonsense.

For my wife and myself, I get a giant jar of senior multi-vitamins about three times a year at Costco, super cheap in bulk. I know it's not the fountain of youth but hopefully it fills in a few gaps where I am deficient in certain vitamins and minerals (my diet is good, but not great). Hey, what's it cost? Maybe it's ten cents a day, plus I don't see it doing any harm.

This is a general question.

When you get your annual physical with standard blood work, does it check for vitamin deficiency, or do you need to ask for something special? I am due for that soon, and I Am wondering if I need to ask, or do they always check that and only mention if something is bad.

zoocrewphoto wrote:This is a general question.

When you get your annual physical with standard blood work, does it check for vitamin deficiency, or do you need to ask for something special? I am due for that soon, and I Am wondering if I need to ask, or do they always check that and only mention if something is bad.

if you are doing a full fasting workup , i would request just that ! & give you a copy so you know if all facets are in normal ranges. kinda like your health report card....& then hopefully he/she will go over it with you(in a perfect world)
i have to get liver function every 3 months because of meds. that being said when my primary wants blood i say to one or the other, let's do this one time ok ? most times i have one dr. office fax results to the other....

deerslayer wrote:

zoocrewphoto wrote:This is a general question.

When you get your annual physical with standard blood work, does it check for vitamin deficiency, or do you need to ask for something special? I am due for that soon, and I Am wondering if I need to ask, or do they always check that and only mention if something is bad.

if you are doing a full fasting workup , i would request just that ! & give you a copy so you know if all facets are in normal ranges. kinda like your health report card....& then hopefully he/she will go over it with you(in a perfect world)
i have to get liver function every 3 months because of meds. that being said when my primary wants blood i say to one or the other, let's do this one time ok ? most times i have one dr. office fax results to the other....

I need to make an appointment with a new doctor, so I will ask about this. I am not happy with the old doctor for several reasons. After my last blood work, and i had to ask for my results, and the nurse asked me what I wanted to know. Huh? They have always told me my cholesterol (3 numbers) and glucose. I have no idea what all they test for. I had to specifically ask her for those. I didn't know what to ask and was stunned that she didn't voluntarily tell me anything.

I am pretty sure I am low on vitamin D. I am a severe night owl, so most of my awake time is at work, or at night. My outdoor time is limited to walking to work, and errands. So, that is probably low. I did buy some liquid vitamin D awhile back, but I couldn't keep it under my tongue and not swallow for 30 seconds. So, I don't know if it was useful or not. I didn't try it very long. I pulled it out, so I will give it a try again. I struggle with pills, so I unless they are small, and I can see the size, I won't buy them.

I'm pretty much ih agreement with these findings. I stopped taking multi-vitamins years ago because they are expensive and I couldn't feel any benefit from them. They didn't make me feel better or worse. Now I only take vitamin D as I think it is a special case, not a vitamin at all, and not available in significant quantities in a normal diet. Certain vitamins are also prescribed therapeutically for macular degeneration, no question about that, but I don't know what value those vitamins have, if any, absent that condition. Typically you don't take medicines for ailments you don't have.

SleepyBobR wrote:Certain vitamins are also prescribed therapeutically for macular degeneration, no question about that, but I don't know what value those vitamins have, if any, absent that condition. Typically you don't take medicines for ailments you don't have.

No you do preventative care to avoid ailments, getting enough vitamins is one of those things. The studies focused on Heart and cancer. That is not why most people take them though. We take them for the dozens of aches and pains we get when we don't take them. Sleep deprivation also won't give you heart attacks or cancer according to some studies so why are you wasting money and cpap therapy?

Then they top it off with outdated dietary advice.

BlackSpinner wrote:

SleepyBobR wrote:Certain vitamins are also prescribed therapeutically for macular degeneration, no question about that, but I don't know what value those vitamins have, if any, absent that condition. Typically you don't take medicines for ailments you don't have.

No you do preventative care to avoid ailments, getting enough vitamins is one of those things. The studies focused on Heart and cancer. That is not why most people take them though. We take them for the dozens of aches and pains we get when we don't take them. Sleep deprivation also won't give you heart attacks or cancer according to some studies so why are you wasting money and cpap therapy?

Then they top it off with outdated dietary advice.

This is only the beginning of many studies to come on the importance (or not) of taking vits. I doubt that knowledgeable doctors will tell you to stop taking vits if blood tests show you need them. What will they gain??

CPAP, on the other hand, is a different issue. This doctor who suggested I stop taking multi vits (except for Vit D and Fish Oil) is the same one who sent me for a sleep study in the first place and asks me every visit if I'm using the machine.

And, dietary advice changes constantly. What is great for you one day will kill you the next. Prob sugar is the only constant.

From US News and World Report article:

"In the winter, it's impossible to produce vitamin D from the sun if you live north of Atlanta because the sun never gets high enough in the sky for its ultraviolet B rays to penetrate the atmosphere. But summer is a great time to stock up on the nutrient. When the sun's UV-B rays hit the skin, a reaction takes place that enables skin cells to manufacture vitamin D. If you're fair skinned, experts say going outside for 10 minutes in the midday sun—in shorts and a tank top with no sunscreen—will give you enough radiation to produce about 10,000 international units of the vitamin. Dark-skinned individuals and the elderly also produce less vitamin D, and many folks don't get enough of the nutrient from dietary sources like fatty fish and fortified milk.

The government's dietary recommendations are 200 IUs a day up to age 50, 400 IUs to age 70, and 600 IUs over 70. But many experts believe that these recommendations are far too low to maintain healthful vitamin D levels. They advocate for supplementation in the winter of about 2,000 IUs per day and a dose of daily sunshine in the summer.

The sunshine vitamin may protect against a host of diseases, including osteoporosis, heart disease, and cancers of the breast, prostate, and colon. What's more, sunlight has other hidden benefits—like protecting against depression, insomnia, and an overactive immune system."

Standard blood/lab tests do not check vitamin levels at all, only certain components in blood or other body fluids. Most doctors know very little about nutrition to begin with and vitamins are usually the last thing on their mind when they order testing.

Julie wrote:Standard blood/lab tests do not check vitamin levels at all, only certain components in blood or other body fluids. Most doctors know very little about nutrition to begin with and vitamins are usually the last thing on their mind when they order testing.

"Most doctors"... okay. That excludes mine, however.

BlackSpinner wrote:

SleepyBobR wrote:Certain vitamins are also prescribed therapeutically for macular degeneration, no question about that, but I don't know what value those vitamins have, if any, absent that condition. Typically you don't take medicines for ailments you don't have.

No you do preventative care to avoid ailments, getting enough vitamins is one of those things. The studies focused on Heart and cancer. That is not why most people take them though. We take them for the dozens of aches and pains we get when we don't take them. Sleep deprivation also won't give you heart attacks or cancer according to some studies so why are you wasting money and cpap therapy?

Then they top it off with outdated dietary advice.

Well, of course people take preventative measures to avoid health problems. That's why I get regular exercise and eat well and dress warmly in the winter and wash my hands. If I thought vitamin supplements would prevent all sorts of health problems then I would take them too. The issue here is that the studies are showing that multi-vitamins are actually not providing any health benefits and may even be harmful so why incur the expense if they aren't doing anything? That said, if they work for you, relieving dozens of aches and pains, then have at it. That just wasn't my experience with them when I took them every day.

As for CPAP, it's effective therapy for a diagnosed condition with proven short and long term ill effects. Completely different scenario than taking vitamins that have not been shown to have any benefit.

SleepyBobR wrote: As for CPAP, it's effective therapy for a diagnosed condition with proven short and long term ill effects. Completely different scenario than taking vitamins that have not been shown to have any benefit.

No there are no proven benefits for it protecting you from dying of a heart attack or cancer - which is what the vitamin benefits that were being checked. Most people do not use vitamins that way either. I wouldn't give up my cpap therapy because it makes me feel much better so does using vitamins.

Unfortunately there are no universal standards for vitamins in the way that there are for drugs. Price is no indicator. Manufacturer is no real indicator. You need to look at the standards they use, and the facilities they use to produce them. Look at the "studies" that show that this or that vitamin is good or bad, and see if you can find out EXACTLY what product from what manufacturer they used. In many cases the studies look at a single vitamin that is chemically produced. The reality is that many vitamins need other vitamins/minerals to be absorbed/work properly. You may not find out about those, but that is why it is very important to eat as balanced a diet as you can (lots of fruit and veges, with only grass-fed meat when you do eat it). Plant cells also contain some of those other "elements" that are needed to help the vitamins work. I take several vitamins a day; they cost a lot, but they have kept me healthy for many years without pharmaceutical products!

SleepyToo2 wrote:The reality is that many vitamins need other vitamins/minerals to be absorbed/work properly. You may not find out about those, but that is why it is very important to eat as balanced a diet as you can (lots of fruit and veges, with only grass-fed meat when you do eat it). Plant cells also contain some of those other "elements" that are needed to help the vitamins work.!

My biggest problem is that I live in Edmonton Alberta today the sun rose at 8:46 am and set at 4:16 pm. The ground has been snow covered since the begin of November and probably will be until the end of April. Fresh fruits and vegetables are anything but by the time they get here. Locally grown right now would be carrots, cabbage and turnips that have been in storage since October so it is frozen and canned for me. I am also in a very stressful situation which also affects my diet and other parts of my body.

I take my multivitamins and supplements daily.