Correlation between Leaks & AHI?

I'm now using Biotene Toothpaste and shopping for the gel, but last night I tried something different.

I usually wear a size Large Ruby Chinstrap, based on my head measurements per Puresom ordering instructions, but even a brand-new Large one just purchased a week or two ago (when I thought my old Large one had maybe stretched out), wouldn't keep my mouth shut, so I purchased a size Medium. I had no trouble snugly pulling it over my head and under my chin, and it seemed to stay in place all night and kept my mouth shut.

However, when I got up this morning, I had a wide, deep crease across the front of my head! It didn't hurt at all, but it was deep enough that I could place the tip of my finger in the crease and trace a path across the front of my scalp from left to right.

Also, my 95% Leak was down to 8.4, but my AHI was up to 2.1, which is higher than usual. (My 6 month avg AHI is 0.6).*

I felt fine all night and all day today, but I'm afraid to repeat the experiment tonight for fear of reducing the blood circulation to my brain or causing a blood clot?

Am I over-reacting to what otherwise seemed like a slick solution to my mouth-breathing/dry mouth concerns?

Nate

* On the other hand, going back 6 months, my average 95% Leak rate was 25.2

Postscript: I forgot to mention that I also woke up with a very bloodshot right eye, in addition to the crease in my scalp from the pressure of the top strap of the tight chinstrap.

Nate

My Dentist strongly suggests Biotene . But he alao says to use listerine zero. It's alcohol free. In his opinion Biotene is not a replacement for mouth wash. Its to be included for good mouth care, for people with dry mouth.

Was your eye bloodshot red or did you have a bright red spot (eye vessel hemorrhage)? Even though, the blood spot eye looks awful, it is usually benign. Still I am worried about your strap is so tight, it increased the pressure on those nearby vessels leading to the burst, so I would not wear the medium strap again. Have you tried the cotton, not so tight PapCap? If I recall you're a pillow user. I found that using the lanolin and the pillow cozy decreased my leaks, sort of stabilizes the pillow into the nostril. Yes, I realize your leaks are from your mouth, but maybe you have to try all fronts.

Puzzled why your AHI increased, despite the low leak level. Could it be that you were uncomfortable during sleep, like I think your strap being too tight, so the AHI (more centrals, annoying awakenings) is higher?

Keep us posted if the Biotene helps the dry mouth problem.

Quick question: did you have the chin strap the right way around? Mine comes nowhere near my forehead unless I put it on wrong.

Bobby269 wrote:Nate

My Dentist strongly suggests Biotene . But he alao says to use listerine zero. It's alcohol free. In his opinion Biotene is not a replacement for mouth wash. Its to be included for good mouth care, for people with dry mouth.

Thank you for passing on that suggestion. What does your dentist recommend Listerine Zero for?
Decay prevention? General hygiene? Bad Breath? Does it taste as awful as regular Listerine?

Regards, Nate

PapCap

and

Dr. Katz PerioTherapy mouth wash

Supposedly, mouthwash with any alcohol further dries the mouth out, so Listerine Zero (zero alcohol) would not. Biotene markets that it contains salivary enzymes to lessen the dry mouth.

SleepyToo2 wrote:Quick question: did you have the chin strap the right way around? Mine comes nowhere near my forehead unless I put it on wrong.

Kitatonic wrote:Was your eye bloodshot red or did you have a bright red spot (eye vessel hemorrhage)? Even though, the blood spot eye looks awful, it is usually benign. Still I am worried about your strap is so tight, it increased the pressure on those nearby vessels leading to the burst, so I would not wear the medium strap again. Have you tried the cotton, not so tight PapCap? If I recall you're a pillow user. I found that using the lanolin and the pillow cozy decreased my leaks, sort of stabilizes the pillow into the nostril. Yes, I realize your leaks are from your mouth, but maybe you have to try all fronts.

Puzzled why your AHI increased, despite the low leak level. Could it be that you were uncomfortable during sleep, like I think your strap being too tight, so the AHI (more centrals, annoying awakenings) is higher?

Keep us posted if the Biotene helps the dry mouth problem.

Apologies for the long delay in replying. An unrelated family emergency called me away during which time I did not have access to my computer.

SleepyToo2, insofar as I know, I think I am wearing my Ruby correctly. I have the Puresom model, and I hold it in both hands so that the part with the white label is in my left hand, facing to the left, and the pouch for my chin is hanging down. Then I place my chin in the pouch, and pull the part held in my hands up over my head and down the back of my head. This leaves one strap over the top rear of my head and another strap over the top front of my head about an inch back of my forehead, and the part held in my hands down across the back of my head just above my neck.

Do you put yours on differently?

Kitatonic, I frankly don't remember whether my eyes were just bloodshot or also had a bright red spot, but I took your advice and put the medium Ruby away and have only worn the large one since. I have not tried the Papcap, and I have not felt the need to use lanolin except for the early days of using a Swift FX about a year ago. Since switching to an Aloha, I get a really good seal on my nasal pillows and for the most part it stays put and well-sealed all night. I check minutely by running my fingers around the edges of my nostrils to feel for even the tiniest air wisp and there is none. Also, I keep my VPAP set to alarm me for any leaks.

However, here is an interesting develoment - since I began using the Biotene gel every night, not only has the mouth dryness been substantially reduced, but my leak chart has dropped way down again! This makes me wonder whether, instead of the open mouth causing mouth dryness as we usually assume, perhaps the reverse was true - that the mouth dryness was prompting me to open my mouth during the night!

Regards, Nate

Pugsy wrote:If your leaks are below the red line then it is unlikely that the machine was missing some events.
From what I can tell the leaks need to be above 50 L/min before the machine has total loss of ability to flag events...normally they are flagged yellow as unknown before the leaks are so bad it misses the event entirely.
See my "Really really bad leak" thread I started today. Massive leaks from last night and the machine was able to flag them.

The variation you are seeing in AHI could just be a part of the normal varying that we see from time to time.
Some nights my AHI is below 1.0 and might stay there for a long time then I will have some AHI nights of 2 or 3 and not change anything. It happens sometimes.

Pugsy,
I can't find this thread, did it get lost? As you know, I've got a lot of interest in leaks right now & would like to read what you have there, just can't find it.
Jen

jencat824 wrote:

Pugsy wrote:If your leaks are below the red line then it is unlikely that the machine was missing some events.
From what I can tell the leaks need to be above 50 L/min before the machine has total loss of ability to flag events...normally they are flagged yellow as unknown before the leaks are so bad it misses the event entirely.
See my "Really really bad leak" thread I started today. Massive leaks from last night and the machine was able to flag them.

The variation you are seeing in AHI could just be a part of the normal varying that we see from time to time.
Some nights my AHI is below 1.0 and might stay there for a long time then I will have some AHI nights of 2 or 3 and not change anything. It happens sometimes.

Pugsy,
I can't find this thread, did it get lost? As you know, I've got a lot of interest in leaks right now & would like to read what you have there, just can't find it.
Jen

Isn't this it?:

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=85680&p=779849&hili ... k+#p779849

Regards, Nate

jencat824 wrote:Pugsy,
I can't find this thread, did it get lost? As you know, I've got a lot of interest in leaks right now & would like to read what you have there, just can't find it.
Jen

Nate found it. That one was just a couple of weeks ago.
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=85680&p=779849&hili ... k+#p779849

I also have another one
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=76445&p=698087&hili ... ne#p698087

Side note for all the people who will cringe when they see these ugly leak lines.... I don't do this all the time. Most of the time if I have any large leaks they are very short lived and most of the night my leaks are minimal to none.
Those minimal to none leaks are boring and not nearly as much fun showing off as these massive monsters are.