battery power?

Just got off the phone with the Flex operator.
She says my flex plan covers ANY CPAP accessories; meaning proprietary DC power supplies, not general.

archangle wrote:

avi123 wrote:BATTERY ELECTROLYTE FUMES

The problem with those 12 volt DC batteries is that they emit toxic fumes from the electrolyte inside, while running, and especially during charging.
So placing the battery, with or without the box, near the XPAP could be a health hazard.
Placing the Battery and the Inerter or Converter inside an insulated box on the porch and running a standard 112 volt AC three prongs exention cord to the XPAP in the bedroom could be a solution. Do the charging also while the battery is outside and well ventilated. If the extension cord is longer than 50' then all the components need to be a bit on the higher ratings.


The fumes produced during Equalization can be very destructive to fabric and upholstery if the batteries are located in the living area of a boat. The area needs to be well ventilated.

Source:

http://www.emarineinc.com/pages/Batteries-101.html

p.s. sorry Archangel about bringing up this issue.

I'm sorry you brought it up because you're absolutely, unequivocally, 100% wrong.

The emarine quote is about a process called "Equalization." You'll never equalize a battery used in the home. It requires specialized equipment and any charger you are likely to have in the home won't do equalization.

Unless you have some kind of monster battery charger, you won't be producing any significant fumes from your battery. If the battery were producing fumes, it would quickly use up the water and acid in the battery, and your battery would be dead within a few weeks. Fumes are matter. The matter fumes are made from have to come from somewhere.

If you aren't rapidly boiling away the water in your battery, you can't produce hydrogen fast enough to matter unless you've sealed your battery in a big ziploc bag or something. It takes a lot of amps for a lot of hours to produce much hydrogen from a battery. You simply can't supply enough electricity to a battery in the normal home setting fast enough to matter.

squid13 wrote:I use an AGM battery and don't worry about fumes.

AGM batteries produce fumes exactly the same way a lead acid battery does. AGM batteries have a sealed case and some chemicals to recombine any hydrogen and oxygen produced. They can only handle a very small rate of hydrogen production. If you're producing hydrogen faster than that, the battery will vent and release the excess hydrogen. Hydrogen is non-toxic and is only dangerous if you get a high concentration in the room.

If an AGM battery is producing some kind of fumes besides hydrogen and oxygen, it will build up in the case until the battery vents.

AGM batteries are no safer than unsealed batteries in terms of fumes. They might even be more dangerous because they will release the fumes all at once when they vent, instead of as a small, steady stream.

ArchAngel, for you, special delivery:

Source:

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=49115&st=0&sk=t&sd= ... p&start=60



OMG - - Most of these posts are great, but I missed where someone warned about using lead-acid batteries in the house. Or any confined space for that matter...and probably where the warning for using a charger while running an xPAP came from. Yes, I have an EE degree, but working on cars should be enough to heed this warning. LEAD-ACID batteries give off EXPLOSIVE HYDROGEN GAS WHEN THEY ARE charging, and is not breathable. That is why they come from the factory with that warning on them. Also why Battery Backups come only with sealed GEL cells. The hydrogen gas is not leaked into the air, but contained in the sealed GEL CELL unit. That was what they were designed to do. Oh and if your wondering, yes, I have had a small explosion occur because of a battery. No major damage, probably because it was in the garage, but I can just imagine the effects in a bedroom. Also, I am a CPAP user since Nov. 2001, eleven years and can not stand it without my humidifier. And believe me when I say, without heat it might as well not be there at all. PLEASE - PLEASE - PLEASE *****DO NOT USE LEAD ACID BATTERIES INSIDE THE HOME*****!!!!!!!!!!

So are you going to attack now this EE engineer's post, as you attacked my post on it, see above.
And don't worry about nanwilson b/c she has iron lungs allowing her to be taking those fumes, for 2.5 years without any damage!

If it makes you happy, avi, you can keep posting incorrect information.

You can even use color, bold, large fonts, underlines, etc. Maybe italics will help. Saying it more often won't help.

No matter how often you state something that's wrong, you're still wrong.

If you'll bother to read a couple of posts lower in that same thread, you'll see where I calculated the amount of hydrogen a home CPAP battery backup could generate and disproved those ideas. Any reasonably sized home battery charger can't produce hydrogen quickly enough to be a serious hazard.

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=49115&p=638347#p638166

And I'll say it once again. I'll try to type slowly so maybe you'll understand. Gel cell and AGM batteries will vent hydrogen into the room if the battery produces it too quickly. They are sealed, but they have a pressure vent to release it if they produce it too quickly. Not only will it vent hydrogen, but it will blow it out all in one burst, instead of slowly like an unsealed battery.

Yes, if you have a large number of batteries for a solar power system, or a large backup power system, or a bunch of forklift batteries with fast chargers, you can get a hydrogen explosion if something goes wrong with the charger or ventilation.

archangle wrote: And I'll say it once again. I'll try to type slowly so maybe you'll understand. Gel cell and AGM batteries will vent hydrogen into the room if the battery produces it too quickly. They are sealed, but they have a pressure vent to release it if they produce it too quickly. Not only will it vent hydrogen, but it will blow it out all in one burst, instead of slowly like an unsealed battery.

Yes, if you have a large number of batteries for a solar power system, or a large backup power system, or a bunch of forklift batteries with fast chargers, you can get a hydrogen explosion if something goes wrong with the charger or ventilation.

Last week I charged, load tested, and equalized an APC RBC#4 Sealed Lead Acid battery using a benchtop power supply with variable current and voltage controls. I can personally attest that an SLA (or gel-cell) vents gasses while overcharging just like a flooded cell battery. For the record, it took about 5 minutes at 15.1Vdc 0.25Adc to bring the last two cells up to full charge and I was checking the temperature and pinhole vents constantly.

archangle wrote:If it makes you happy, avi, you can keep posting incorrect information.

You can even use color, bold, large fonts, underlines, etc. Maybe italics will help. Saying it more often won't help.

No matter how often you state something that's wrong, you're still wrong....

I like when he uses:

Comment:

or

Reply:

It makes his posts seem so professional and sexy.

Forget it guys...he won't give up. Arguing with him is pointless..you are always wrong
Nan

https://www.cpap.com/productpage/respir ... eviews#tab

Arch, this is the battery I just received from cpapdotcom to use with my PRS1Auto. I asked for one to be used with the S9 Autoset but when I mentioned that I also had a PRSOneAuto, he suggested this one because it was less expensive and didn't need a converter/inverter,blah,blah, you know what I mean! It was easy to figure out with a little help from a neighbor, charged nicely for about 6hrs until the green light came on. Fortunately, the power came back on last night and I didn't have to use it. My question is how long will the charge last or do I have to "top it off" every month or so even if I don't use it? My other MOST important question, is this thing SAFE to use, what's his name is scaring the H**L out of me!

@Nan, so glad you're still alive and kicking! Maybe it's the fumes! Can you send some my way!:lol:

Poor Avi; it must be horrible to live with so much fear.

chunkyfrog wrote:Poor Avi; it must be horrible to live with so much fear.

i think he is reacting to all the negative thoughts posted by the famous angle monster
no matter what you say he sees the dark side

archangle wrote:No matter how often you state something that's wrong, you're still wrong.

archangle wrote:Here are the potential cons I see.

DoriC wrote:https://www.cpap.com/productpage/respir ... eviews#tab

Arch, this is the battery I just received from cpapdotcom to use with my PRS1Auto. I asked for one to be used with the S9 Autoset but when I mentioned that I also had a PRSOneAuto, he suggested this one because it was less expensive and didn't need a converter/inverter,blah,blah, you know what I mean! It was easy to figure out with a little help from a neighbor, charged nicely for about 6hrs until the green light came on. Fortunately, the power came back on last night and I didn't have to use it. My question is how long will the charge last or do I have to "top it off" every month or so even if I don't use it? My other MOST important question, is this thing SAFE to use, what's his name is scaring the H**L out of me!

@Nan, so glad you're still alive and kicking! Maybe it's the fumes! Can you send some my way!:lol:

Should I use color and highlight to make this response so I can look earnest, too?

Looks OK. A reasonable compromise for the size, weight and convenience. I'm guessing one night's PAP on a charge. YMMV.

Unless you somehow abuse it, it's probably pretty safe. It looks like a Gel Cell or AGM battery. It's a lot like a car battery, but a lot more leakproof and spillproof and designed to not need water added.

I don't know the details of your charger, so read the instructions if any. Once a month is probably good enough. Unless the instructions say otherwise, I'd put it on charge, let the green light come on, and let it sit a few more hours. To maximize battery life, I wouldn't leave it on the charger all the time, but even if you did that, it's not likely to do anything drastic, it just might not last as long. Even topping it off weekly and leaving it plugged in a few extra hours probably won't do much harm.

If another hurricane or other outage is likely, don't hesitate to top it off ahead of time.

Run the CPAP off of it for at least a few hours every few months, then recharge.

Look inside the zipper case and become familiar with what the battery looks like. It's got the same chemicals inside as a car battery. If you find liquid or goo on the outside of the battery, get rid of it, but don't panic. Don't get it in your eyes, and wash it off your hands if you get it on you.

Sit it so the side of the battery with the terminals is up especially when charging. That's not absolutely necessary, but it's a good idea.

Does the charger plug into the cigarette lighter plug, or is there a separate connector? A closeup pic of the charger would be interesting, including the label.

All batteries of this type eventually die on you, just like car batteries do. Keep your eye out for when it becomes hard to charge or when it won't run the CPAP for a long time. Write the date you bought it on it somewhere. After 5 years or so, there's a real strong chance it will go bad. The battery itself is probably replaceable. Take a picture of it and make note of the manufacturer and model number, if convenient.

Other than that, just don't be stupid.

• Don't damage the battery case.
• Don't hook up to a different charger.
• Don't let it freeze.
• Even though it's sealed, keep fire away from it, especially while charging. No big deal, but don't set a candle on top of it, bend over close to it with a cigarette, etc.
• An acid leak is unlikely but possible. I'd keep it in one of those marine battery boxes or a plastic storage box with no lid if it's practical to do so.
• Don't put it inside something airtight like a ziplock baggie or a sealed container, especially while charging.
• Do NOT eat the battery or the charger. It may look tasty, but it isn't. The state of California has determined that eating the battery or chewing on the cables is bad for your health.
• For extra safety, unplug the charger from the wall and the battery, and unplug the DC cord from the battery and CPAP when not in use. Be sure you can find the DC cord in the dark. Putting a flashlight in or near the box might be a good idea.

chunkyfrog wrote:Poor Avi; it must be horrible to live with so much fear.

Thanks chunky for your understanding. Notice that I have reached a nice old age of 83 with that "fear" phobia.
Looking forward to reaching 100.
When is your spouse going to try that small gasoline generator, as shown below?




Please ask your spouse about the benefits in a small diesel generator like this:

http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/29897 ... rator.html

Hey AVI! Did you know that more people are injured every day by hydric acid than by battery acid in a year???

Thanks Arch, I printed out your instructions and will put it with all my "important" papers! The manual said the first charge needs 10hrs and should last for 2nights at 12cm pressure. Mike just uses passover HH. It came with 2 chargers, one for the car cigarette lighter too. I'll take the extra precautions and tips you mentioned. I feel better now, thanks.