OT:Good Calories, Bad Calories....

-SWS wrote:...I have a question for the low-carb dieters. What were your biggest barriers to starting up a low-carb diet? Fear of fats? Not wanting to give up sweets? A generalized fear of side effects? Fear of giving up favorite restaurants?

I wanted to lose weight back when Akins was first popular in the 70s. Loved that way of eating: lots of meat & fibery veggies, little fruit. Then, I fell for the govt hype that low-carb is bad *sigh* I was young & dumb, what can I say. So, I developed an intense love affair with pasta and artisan breads. Because I was exercising, I didn't re-gain for a long time. By the time I wised up that Id been sold a bill of vapor, I was obese & addicted to grains. Considering the extent of the changes I'd need to make was, to say the least, overwhelming so I thought about it for months. Then, I tried to ease into reducing the amt of carbs. I struggled along for years but grains were my downfall time after time. Sears, he of the Zone, explained a lot of the biochemistry in a way that made sense. Then, the doctors Eades' Protein Power approach helped me, a lot, in getting back to a healthier way of eating...for me. Still, I had to come smack up against the damaging effects of grains on my health before I found the resolve to resist them. In desperation, I enlisted all my loved ones and co-workers I ate lunch with to remind me that I chose not to eat grains. When reading Davis' Wheat Belly I realize my thinning hair is from small amts of wheat sneaking back in *sigh*but now I have much stronger resolve. I was wheat-free for 3 months last fall and my hair was noticeable thicker and then came the holidays and I bake for friends...for me, impossible not to taste. Now I'm back reading labels on everything. I have tried the einhorn wheat pasta and have not had my usual reactions but the rest of my household doesn’t like it. The 1st 2 wks one might feel less than wonderful to bad until the body adjusts its enzymes from carb burning to fat burning (like switching from burning jet fuel to gasoline)…some have no probs. Not everyone overproduces insulin and those will feel slightly to really ill on a low(er) carb eating plan…but ya gotta get past those 1st 14 days or so. There are delicious new tastes to explore. Bread and pasta as you’ve been accustomed to eating have got to go…tho I will admit I lost 25#s (4-5 sizes) in 6 wks eating a la Zone (pre-apnea) but eating 1 slice of toasted dark seeded rye every weekday. I was able to make good choices at all of my favorite restaurants, most will accommodate requests for changes.

-SWS wrote:I have a question for the low-carb dieters. What were your biggest barriers to starting up a low-carb diet? Fear of fats? Not wanting to give up sweets? A generalized fear of side effects? Fear of giving up favorite restaurants?

I had no barriers. It made sense. The next morning, I pulled all the starches out and put them in a box. After 1 month I gave the open stuff to my Mom and the unopened stuff to the food bank. I didn't eat alot of sweets before so that wasn't an issue. I was sold on the whole grain pitch.
I have always loved vegetables and believe the more I eat, the better I feel. If I could afford a chef to cook them for me all the time I would eat mostly vegan. But really, that's alot of work and you wind up throwing alot of food away when you are cooking for one. Not to mention you have to eat all the time because you are hungry. This works. I still eat alot of vegetables. Sweet potatoes instead of white potatoes. I dropped carrots and peas. But I eat broccoli, brussel sprouts, cauliflower, kale, avocado, green beans, snow peas, spinach, bell peppers, okra, onions, scallions, garlic, chickweed, dandelion greens, zuccini, cucumber,..
I'm just not afraid of fat anymore. So I don't need to eat as much.

-SWS wrote:Thanks for that link, Kira. Have you noticed whether particular diets affect your fibro symptoms for better or worse?

I haven't consumed any grains, potatoes, other starches, etc. in eleven years. I'm following the Specific Carbohydrate Diet, which is not necessarily a low-carb diet, although it can be. It's about specific carbs -- getting rid of the hard to digest complex carbs. The science on it goes back over 60 years -- Dr. Sidney Valentine Haas received world recognition for his work in celiac disease in 1951.

I legitimately feel that it saved my life back in 2001, because my weight had spiraled out of control -- didn't matter how little I ate, I gained weight. On SCD, I lost 180 pounds.

I eat as much pastured meat and dairy as I can afford because it's higher on Omega 3s. I also do some supplementation. If I am traveling, and I'm eating regular corn-fed meats, I'll start hurting. (I will note that CPAP solved my hip pain, which was apparently a result of low oxygen at night.) But the general, all over muscle pain has taken the Omega 3s, and the LDN (low dose naltrexone) to solve. BTW, there have been some studies out of Stanford on the use of LDN for fibromyalgia.

As one further note on my eating style -- my oncologist said she wished she could put all her patients on my diet. Because before the surgery, I was told, "It's not if you have infection, it's how much. It's not if you have wound separation. It's how much. It's not if you have (fill in the blank with a dozen different things), it's how much...." and I had NONE of it. No infection. No wound separation. Nothing. Just straight healing. The plastic surgeon had different interns in every week to look at my incision and see "how an incision of this type SHOULD heal, not how it typically heals."

So it's taken several factors to handle the muscle pain, but I think that a healthy diet must, first, and always, be the foundation on which one's other healing strategies are built. And I do not think it's an accident that in the last 60 years we have seen skyrocketing rates of cancer, gut diseases, heart disease, and etc. when we've left traditional eating styles.

<g> I bought some pemmican from Grasslands Beef to try to see if I like it and to have on hand for emergencies. It's amazing stuff.

12 years ago I saw an endocrinologist when I read in a Dear Abby column that there were new treatments for poly cystic ovarian syndrome (PCOS) and that, if left untreated, PCOS could cause diabetes. The endo told me to read Protein Power and put me on Metformin, an insulin sensitizing drug. He told me that I could get pregnant with that treatment and I laughed in his face because I was over 40, had to go through two in vitro procedures to conceive my only child, and I ws working two jobs while attending a doctoral program at night.

Well, the diet was great. I effortlessly lost 40lbs, felt wonderful, and six months later to my utter surprise and delight, was pregnant with my second daughter. I had to stay out of ketosis during the pregnancy, and somehow I just could not get myself to get back into it after (with some legitimate fear of another pregnancy since my failsafe birth control method (infertility) had failed.

I'm mortified it took me 12 years and severe damage to my body to get back to it. I took too much comfort in oatmeal and ice cream and could not get myself to make the leap until I realized this summer that I was going to live a very disabled life and die soon if I didn't do it NOW.

So I did, and it wasn't anywhere near as hard as I thought it would be. I feel fantastic!! I've got so much energy. I couldn't walk across the room last June, now I walk miles, do aerobic exercise and resistance exercises, and I recently started tai chi (I LOVE it!). I'm eating delicious food and I never experience that gnawing hunger that plagued me several times each day beefore. I don't have blood sugar lows that caused me to be cross, confused, and shaky. My constant skeletal pain is gone, my heartburn and reflux are no more. My lipids are envious, my blood sugars are normal, and my blood pressure is goood. Weight came off rapidly at first, but now it's agonizingly slow (but I recently realized I wasn't eating enough, and since I've upped my calories and fat I seem to be losing again).

My only regret is that I waited SO long! When I was doing this beforre thatt pregnancyy, I felt like I could do it for life, but the pregnancy derailed that. This time, I'm using birth control, and it absolutely is for llife--I never think about "when I lose the weight I can eat X again." I can't, ever, but that's OK. It's not abouut the weight, it's about life, and NOTHING is worth a few minutes of dubious pleasure when my health is at stake.

Amazing amount of information.
How about a thread on willpower?!
I believe that the majority of people know when they are blowing it, diet wise, but they do it anyway. I do.
I know damn well that I shouldn't eat an entire bag of popcorn, or snag a few free cookies from from the sample tray at the grocery store. But I do it anyway.
I know I won't lose weight when I drink my calories, my 16 oz chai latte with whole milk. But I do it anyway.
Do I want to lose weight? Hell yes...for the last 40 years.
Really, what idiot doesn't know that they'll lose weight if they stick to eating vegetables and lean meat?
I know damn well that my life would flow easier if I lost weight...and I know how to do it...and I do it for a day, then push it aside for a week.
The "screw it" factor. The real culprit.
How does one get control of the "screw it" factor?
Is it a form of depression?
Probably.
Can I fool myself into behaving?
Can I talk myself into behaving?
Haven't done it yet.
I think I'll start a new thread.
Coming soon...like now.
Please share your thoughts.
thanks
evan

I'm on SOUTH BEACH DIET. It is neither a low carb or low fat approach. Instead, he focuses on Good Carbs and Good Fats and you eliminate Bad Carbs and Bad Fat.

Bad Fats are saturated fats and trans fats.

Good Fats are mono and polyunsaturated and found in nuts, seeds, olives, avocados. I'm allow low fat and non-fat dairy products (milk, feta cheese, cheddar cheese, provolone, yogurt, sour cream, cottage cheese, cream cheese, etc.). Also have two eggs for breakfast every morning, turkey bacon. Bad carbs are starches, grains, and most fruit. No potatoes, pasta, bread, cereal.

Some veggies aren't allowed like corn, carrots, and peas. I'm allowed tomatoes (6oz of V8 or tomato juice every morning) plus fresh tomatoes on salad, canned diced tomatoes with salsa over chicken or turkey breast. I have all kinds of lettuce, spinach, cucumber, onions celery, bell peppers, broccoli, cauliflower, zucchini and summer squash.

For desert I can have a "No sugar added" Fudgsicle or Popsicle. Also can make a variety of desserts with ricotta cheese, lemon zest, and Splenda. I also enjoy Nonfat Greek yogurt with vanilla and Splenda. Tastes very much like Dannon Vanilla yogurt.

I never get bored as I always have new ways to try things or mix things together. I really like his "roll-ups" for snack. Put a slice a fat free smoked turkey breast with slice of low fat provolone. Roll them up in 3 leaves of red leaf lettuce. Another snack I like is low-fat Laughing Cow cheese spread on slices of cucumber and zucchini. Or 30 pistachios with a cup of skim or 1% milk.

Protein includes meats but also legumes and dairy.

So it's not low fat in the sense that I'm allowed "Good fats". In phase I, it is low carb but I gradually add carbs back into diet.

I can't see how I'd be missing any vitamins and minerals with such a variety.

WHY didn't know that LARD is 40+% monounsaturated fat? Lots cheaper than olive oil and it tastes better and lasts longer.

My Grandmother was telling me how to cook something... dandelion greens I think, and when she said to use bacon grease, I said, I didn't have any. She said WHAT? I said "Grandma, I don't eat bacon, It's all fat".
A week later I visited and she gave me a peanut butter jar full of bacon grease. Now I have a hard time keeping it full. I miss her, but I still have that jar with the masking tape label on it where she ran out of room writing "Bacon Greas".
She also told me "Chicken breast doesn't taste like anything, I like dark meat". She was right, it doesn't and now it's OK for me to like dark meat again.
She's still the smartest woman I have ever known.

Do you really think that just a few bad choices are what make people fat and unhealthy?
I don't think people are overweight simply because they use bread for their sandwich or like their steamed vegetables on white rice or enjoy a plate of spaghetti pasta now and again.
I believe that most people who are overweight, or have type 2 diabetes, and such diseases, because they eat a whole bag of chips at night while they watch tv...or a pint of ice cream...or they eat fries for lunch...and candy bars throughout the day...or go out to eat instead of stay in...or a whole host of other such things.
People know when they're blowing it. But they do it anyway.

nmevan wrote:Do you really think that just a few bad choices are what make people fat and unhealthy?
I don't think people are overweight simply because they use bread for their sandwich or like their steamed vegetables on white rice or enjoy a plate of spaghetti pasta now and again.
I believe that most people who are overweight, or have type 2 diabetes, and such diseases, because they eat a whole bag of chips at night while they watch tv...or a pint of ice cream...or they eat fries for lunch...and candy bars throughout the day...or go out to eat instead of stay in...or a whole host of other such things.
People know when they're blowing it. But they do it anyway.

I think that all depends on whether they burn it off during the day or not. That depends alot on individual metabolism, level of activity and fitness.
I think many people I know easily burn 6000 calories a day. I don't, so I know where that bag of chips would end up.

Lizistired wrote:

-SWS wrote:I have a question for the low-carb dieters. What were your biggest barriers to starting up a low-carb diet? Fear of fats? Not wanting to give up sweets? A generalized fear of side effects? Fear of giving up favorite restaurants?

I had no barriers. It made sense.

Same for me. It made so much sense healthwise.

Since you mention sweets, here's a tip from personal experience:
You can train you tastebuds (well, actually, brain and tastebuds) to become far more sensitive to the sense of sweetness. When I dieted (in my 20's and 30's) I would gradually use less sugar in my tea or coffee - the gradual reduction made things much easier for me. Those diets failed, and eventually I did add sugar to my drinks again -- but only half a teaspoon sugar or a bit more. Dropping that this time around was not too difficult. I don't use artificial sweeteners -- my (cold) drink of choice is water - I stopped diet sodas years ago when I realized aspartame made me break out in rashes. I think you gain a lot from letting your tastebuds discover the natural sweentess of the food you eat. And probably the rate of cell regeneration is relevant - so three weeks of gradual reduction would be a mimimum for letting new tatebuds learn new things.

When reading about low carb, you'll find some who use lots of artificial sweetners (the Atkins people for example, some of the low carb recipe sites, etc.) others who avoid them (the "Primal" people -- e.g. Mark Sisson of http://www.marksdailyapple.com) - I find the primal approach more convincing on this - it is better to regain your sense for natural sweetness of things than to attempt to fool yourself with artificial sweetners. And while I know of no research testing it as a general rule, I'm pretty sure that for some people, a response to the taste of sweet can be similar to Pavlovian salivation - insulin secretion in response to a conditioned stimulus - what they call a "cephalic" insulin response. I would rathen not risk it in myself.

Marksdailyapple has many recipes - worth looking at.

nmevan wrote:Do you really think that just a few bad choices are what make people fat and unhealthy?
I don't think people are overweight simply because they use bread for their sandwich or like their steamed vegetables on white rice or enjoy a plate of spaghetti pasta now and again.
I believe that most people who are overweight, or have type 2 diabetes, and such diseases, because they eat a whole bag of chips at night while they watch tv...or a pint of ice cream...or they eat fries for lunch...and candy bars throughout the day...or go out to eat instead of stay in...or a whole host of other such things.
People know when they're blowing it. But they do it anyway.

I guess you really believe in the "blame them and shame them" approach to fat people, or as Taubes calls it "the greed and sloth" approach to obesity.

It's terrible to feel like that about yourself and about other fat people.

Even though I have talked about Atkins a lot, I also never did any of the artificial sweeteners. Aspartame just messes with me and always has, first time I had a can of "diet" Soda with it I ended up spending a lot of time in the bathroom. Having allergies as kid taught me fast when something messes with me and to me the "Diet Soda" thing never made me want to drink it and get past the reaction if I could.

So when I did the Atkins thing I never used any sweetener. Even today I use only 2 sweeteners, regular sugar for my coffee and honey for PB and Honey sannys, and I don't drink even a pot of coffee a day. The thermal carafe we have holds 10 or 12 cups and lasts me 2 days when I do make a pot.

Whoops, I forgot Real Maple Syrup, I buy a small jug of a high quality real maple syrup about once a year and it lasts me about that long as I don't get into making pancakes or waffles, but do like French Toast every now and then when I feel like cooking. It normally holds about the same or a few ounces less then a regular sized Log Cabin or Mrs. Butterworth bottle. Never liked Ego Waffle type junk ether.

I am very skeptical about sweeteners in general and never would recommend using them.

As far as a barrier goes I would agree my weakness stems from Bread as well. I would dream about breads and pasta when i did Atkins. But then again I was adding Dark Pumpernickel whole grain rye and as i am now finding this was most likely the cause of the Wheat cravings.

I guess you really believe in the "blame them and shame them" approach to fat people, or as Taubes calls it "the greed and sloth" approach to obesity.

It's terrible to feel like that about yourself and about other fat people.

Blame and shame...bizarre semantic negatives. Not what I'm talking about.
I give people more credit. I think people are more intelligent and aware of what they are doing...and yet they still do unhealthy things to themselves. You can't tell me that if you know that you need to lose weight, that every time you eat a scoop of ice cream you don't realize that you're blowing it. No one is that out of it. And is it really because you've made previous bad choices and so your body is demanding more sugar and other junk? I don't buy it. I think that it has more to do with deep psychological issues.

nmevan wrote:Do you really think that just a few bad choices are what make people fat and unhealthy?
I don't think people are overweight simply because they use bread for their sandwich or like their steamed vegetables on white rice or enjoy a plate of spaghetti pasta now and again.
I believe that most people who are overweight, or have type 2 diabetes, and such diseases, because they eat a whole bag of chips at night while they watch tv...or a pint of ice cream...or they eat fries for lunch...and candy bars throughout the day...or go out to eat instead of stay in...or a whole host of other such things.
People know when they're blowing it. But they do it anyway.

Wrong. Even before I crashed with OSA and my life fell apart, I was eating less the 1300 calories and putting on weight slowly. Because I ate mostly carbs.

Janknitz wrote:I'm mortified it took me 12 years and severe damage to my body to get back to it. I took too much comfort in oatmeal and ice cream and could not get myself to make the leap until I realized this summer that I was going to live a very disabled life and die soon if I didn't do it NOW.

I see this a bunch on the BTVC-SCD list. Until people are last-ditch desperate, they're not willing to give up their beloved carbohydrates.

Janknitz wrote:My only regret is that I waited SO long! When I was doing this beforre thatt pregnancyy, I felt like I could do it for life, but the pregnancy derailed that. This time, I'm using birth control, and it absolutely is for llife--I never think about "when I lose the weight I can eat X again." I can't, ever, but that's OK. It's not abouut the weight, it's about life, and NOTHING is worth a few minutes of dubious pleasure when my health is at stake.

Here's an irony. My diet, which is grain free and starch free, though not necessarily low-carb (carbs come from fruits and vegetables, and how much carb is personal choice... I do fairly low carb) is one which can do an amazing amount for gut issues -- Crohn's, UC, IBS. The lady who kept it alive after its creator died used to say that if she had publicized it as "The Pregnancy Diet" instead of "The Gut Diet," it would have taken off like wildfire, because many women, eliminating grains and starches from their diets, and eating only foods which are easy to digest (and which can have, if tolerated, a significant amount of good fats), frequently find it easy to get pregnant. I know one lady who was told that because of her thyroid and other issues that she would never be able to get pregnant without major medical assistance, or that if she did, she would be unlikely to carry to term without assistance. Six months of SCD, and she was pregnant. Ten years later, she had three healthy children.

I had the same thing you did -- the infertility. I have often wondered what different turns my life might have taken had I been able to find SCD when I was 25, instead of when I was 49. ALthough I also wonder whether I would have been willing to go on it if I hadn't had 25 years of misery.

NOW, I say that there is no food so delicious that it is worth being sick in order to have. But I wonder if I would have said that then.