Pressure of 4 cm - Subtherapeutic?

Elsh wrote:I wonder if just one night could have made a difference already!

For some people one night makes a huge difference..others can take much, much longer.

Congrats on the S9 Elite. It will serve you well. There is software available to enhance the on screen data.
Forum member Uncle_Bob has it and the clinical manual links in his signature. Search the forum for one of his posts.

Software use tutorial here.http://montfordhouse.com/cpap/resscan_tutorial/

Pugsy, you type pretty good with one ahnd!

Pugsy wrote:Congrats on the S9 Elite. It will serve you well. There is software available to enhance the on screen data.
Forum member Uncle_Bob has it and the clinical manual links in his signature. Search the forum for one of his posts.

Software use tutorial here.http://montfordhouse.com/cpap/resscan_tutorial/

Thank you so much for all the info! Now I'm just hoping they'll actually follow through... they were supposed to call me right back to make an appointment to bring it over, and they didn't call back today. I wonder if they'll charge me anything additional for the S9 Elite.

Elsh wrote:Thank you so much for all the info! Now I'm just hoping they'll actually follow through... they were supposed to call me right back to make an appointment to bring it over, and they didn't call back today. I wonder if they'll charge me anything additional for the S9 Elite.

I hate to suggest something else for you to do but you really need to find out what your equipment is going to cost you. That's going to depend on whether you have insurance or not and what the terms of your insurance are if you have it. The company that provided the machine can and should tell you that. (You will have to figure out any insurance deductible yourself).

There's a huge price difference between so called "brick and mortar DMEs" (the ones who come to your house or have offices for you to visit) and online ones. It can amount to thousands of dollars if you are paying the cost yourself since you will almost certainly be charged a higher rate as an individual.

I so sympathize with hating to make phone calls and I think it's great that you called to get a different machine. I didn't make that call four years ago and I'm still regretting it.

Midnightowl

MidnightOwl wrote:I hate to suggest something else for you to do but you really need to find out what your equipment is going to cost you. That's going to depend on whether you have insurance or not and what the terms of your insurance are if you have it. The company that provided the machine can and should tell you that. (You will have to figure out any insurance deductible yourself).

There's a huge price difference between so called "brick and mortar DMEs" (the ones who come to your house or have offices for you to visit) and online ones. It can amount to thousands of dollars if you are paying the cost yourself since you will almost certainly be charged a higher rate as an individual.

I so sympathize with hating to make phone calls and I think it's great that you called to get a different machine. I didn't make that call four years ago and I'm still regretting it.

Midnightowl

They have been up front with me about what things cost me, so far. I have good insurance and for my 'brick' I paid a $24 copay. From what I read online, with the insurance you don't necessarily get charged more for the better machine... but we'll see. I'm not going to ask, because they don't bill (and they told me when the last one was going to cost me $24), and if they get to my house and try to charge me a lot of money without warning, well that will be their problem, and I guess I'll be stuck with the 'brick'. I'm not going to ask, because I feel like that may prompt them to charge me extra if I do, and that it could be in error (since I have good insurance).

Lizistired wrote:Pugsy, you type pretty good with one hand!

Thanks. It takes me forever to get just a couple of sentences put together. So everyone is in luck, no novels from me for a while.

Pugsy wrote:They gave you a ResMed Escape?? No meaningful data gathered by that model. It will tell how many hours you use it and that is all.[/url]

Hey, I don't know if you are still reading, but I got a question that I didn't really know how to answer when I was on the phone asking for the data capable machine... They asked me why I wanted it. They told me the doctor is never going to ask for the information it will gather, because my doctor ordered the other one for me. I told them I'm going to see another doctor, and I'm not sure if that doctor is going to want the data. That's not entirely true. I think the new doctor I will next see (a sleep specialist) is the one who ordered my machine. So, I don't know what to say or even think about that. I mean, I want them to want the data, and I want to know how effective this treatment is. But if the doctor wanted me to have the other one, what can I do? Is there still reason to get this other machine?

The fact that YOU want the data is sufficient reason. Geez, it is not unreasonable for a person to want to at least monitor leak. These DMEs act like this stuff is classified nuclear secrets. I detest these people who talk down to us. I fired my first DME for this very reason.

I would bet my last dollar that the doctor's order was for cpap machine, heated humidifier, pressure at so and so, and maybe mask of patient choice. Doctors rarely state a specific machine. DME supplies the cheapest model that satisfies the RX.

BTW DME might try to lock you out of data on the Elite but the unlock key is widely known.

Please don't let them stick you with a brick. You may not feel the extreme need for data now but it is worth its weight in gold later if problems come up. My prescribed pressure was 8 cm. With that pressure I still had AHI 8 to 10 range.
Upped it finally to 10 min and since my machine is APAP I use a range max of 20 because I sometimes need more than 10 cm.
My AHI is usually below 2. If I had not had data on my machine and software it would have been much more work to get things sorted out.

I believe the Elite will show you things the Escape won't on the display.

For instance, average AHI and leak rate.

Can someone more familiar with Elites and Escapes confirm or clarify?

Escape.... compliance hours of use only.

Elite
AHI
Obstructive Apnea and duration in seconds
Central Apnea and duration
hypopneas
Leak
pressure average if EPR used
Flow graph when using software
some other stuff on reports that slips my mind

Elsh wrote:
They asked me why I wanted it.

They probably will NEVER want the data the Elite provides - so don't rely on that to convince them.

Tell them you plan on losing a lot of weight in the next few months & therefore your pressure requirements will change as you do so.
You need the elite to be able to vary the pressure as you lose weight.

StevenXXXX wrote:

Elsh wrote:They probably will NEVER want the data the Elite provides - so don't rely on that to convince them.

Tell them you plan on losing a lot of weight in the next few months & therefore your pressure requirements will change as you do so.
You need the elite to be able to vary the pressure as you lose weight.

How does your pressure change if you lose weight? Because I'm already at the lowest pressure possible, so if losing weight makes your pressure go down, then that wouldn't be a helpful argument. Either way, I'm curious because I do plan to lose weight if I can get up the energy and motivation.

Your pressure is likely to change for a variety of reasons (1) possible inaccurate pressure prescribed (one night in time does not always yield an exactly accurate pressure that works well for ALL nights--they only captured a cross section... Not to mention that I would bet you're in the vast minority if 4cm is actually therapeutic and not subtherapeutic), (2) weight changes can affect pressure needs, (3) you're going to age over the course of time that you'll have the machine, (4) you may have other variable conditions that will require tweaking of pressures, such as seasonal allergies, etc.

Knowing what I know now, I would NOT accept anything except the top of the line data-capable, Auto-PAP.

My motto: Never leave your fate entirely in the hands of someone who cares less about it than you do. Ya' know, I think I'll change my signature to that.

Skimmed this thread... I don't know why you're on a pressure of 4 if you were prescribed a higher pressure, unless you mean that ramp starts at 4cm.

This is sounding very familiar... Did we have this conversation already? (See what a pressure of 4 does to someone?! Just kidding.) A pressure of 4 is not going to harm you (relative to NO CPAP, which is what you've been using), but it may not help you (enough) if you really need a higher pressure. Then again, maybe you've just won the CPAP lottery! I wish someone would prescribe me a pressure of 4. Or 6. I'll even take 8.

StevenXXXX wrote:
They probably will NEVER want the data the Elite provides - so don't rely on that to convince them.

Tell them you plan on losing a lot of weight in the next few months & therefore your pressure requirements will change as you do so.
You need the elite to be able to vary the pressure as you lose weight.

Elsh wrote:

How does your pressure change if you lose weight? Because I'm already at the lowest pressure possible, so if losing weight makes your pressure go down, then that wouldn't be a helpful argument. Either way, I'm curious because I do plan to lose weight if I can get up the energy and motivation.

I see that Sleeping Ugly provided you with arguments (reasons) why you would want an Auto CPAP - besides just the weight loss / gain argument.

When I suggested weight loss as a sole argument, I failed to remember that this topic was about your pressure of 4. You were right, you can't get any lower than that.

In fact, when I had my Sleep Study done 12+ years ago, 8 was the lowest pressure they would prescribe. They may go lower today, but I do not know what that is.