Have to Stop

Have to stop removing the mask while I sleep. 119 days and I still can't get used to sleeping with a mask. I've done all of the comfort items I can think of to try aroma, hose hanger, padding etc. I have 3 different style masks - full, nose and pillows. Doesn't seem to matter, I can't seem to make it through the night with out taking the mask off in my sleep. Just looked at my stats and I had one unbroken 7 hour block of time the second day of therapy. I have one day where I didn't use the APAP but I've tried every other night. At some point during the night I will take off the mask and sometimes an hour or two later I will awaken enough to realize I'm not sleeping with it and put it back on.

My PCP put me on Ambien to help and it does at least since I've started I'm getting a couple of hours of therapy before the mask comes off, before that I was only getting about 1 hour at most.

Here is what happened last night after the mask came off.



Pretty much negates the 2.5 hours of good therapy I got

Thinking of getting a stronger sleeping pill but to be honest my pressure requirements after adding the ambien have gone up dramatically so it almost seems self defeating.

If anyone has any ideas, I'm open to suggestions
John

What pressure and humidifier settings are you using?


Den

Has anyone had success with hypnosis?

Some people have worn lightweight gloves (or even mittens) to bed to make it more difficult to remove the mask while sleeping.

Others have taped the mask to their face so that the pain from the removal of the tape awakens them when the mask is removed.

jdm2857 wrote:Some people have worn lightweight gloves (or even mittens) to bed to make it more difficult to remove the mask while sleeping.

Others have taped the mask to their face so that the pain from the removal of the tape awakens them when the mask is removed.

My suggestion in the past has been for the person to wear something like tube socks on their hands......same principle.


Den

slaaplekker wrote:.

My PCP put me on Ambien to help and it does at least since I've started I'm getting a couple of hours of therapy before the mask comes off, before that I was only getting about 1 hour at most

Have you tried the sustained release which is called Ambien CR? Ambien for a lot of people only puts you asleep for two or three hours, whereas Ambien CR for me lasted 5 or 6 hours.

Here is what happened last night after the mask came off.



Pretty much negates the 2.5 hours of good therapy I got

Thinking of getting a stronger sleeping pill but to be honest my pressure requirements after adding the ambien have gone up dramatically so it almost seems self defeating.

Do you take Ambien every night? If so you might be building a tolerance to it. My dr. recommended I skip two nights a week to avoid that.
I also sometimes take Klonopin instead on certain nights, instead of the Ambien, Again, if you haven't tried the sustained release zoplidem aka ambien CR, why not give it a shot? It's more expensive, but why not try it for a month? Because really, the generic ambien is very short acting for a lot of people, including me. In fact, for me I think it has a rebound effect, much like trying to drink alcohol to get asleep would. Sure you get to sleep, but then you get the rebound effect later in the night, where you keep waking up because your brain is overcompensating for the sedative affect.

Just a thought. Again, I AM NOT A DOCTOR!


If anyone has any ideas, I'm open to suggestions
John[/quote]

chunkyfrog wrote:Has anyone had success with hypnosis?

Interesting question. Are you from the UK by any chance? Because hypnosis is much more accepted there (I think), just like here in the USA we have kids and adults diagnosed all the time with Attention Deficit Disorder.

Here in the US mostly what we read is that hypnosis is a scam - in other words it's not really a separate brain state, and the hypnotic suggestions really don't work.

But what I do believe in is meditation. I guess it's a similar concept but much simpler - many techniques, but one example is to just simply relax as you're sitting in your car during lunch at work, or even while lying in bed and unable to sleep, and simply relax and concentrate only on your breaths. You can count them starting upwards from one, but personally I count them from 10 to 1 repeatadly, starting over each time I get to one (because it's less mental work). If it helps you can even visualize the numbers appearing in front of you as you count down, The trick is not to get upset when you lose the count because your mind drifts off to thoughts like "is this really meditation thing going to help", or "am I going sailing tomorow", or
"I have to call my DME tomorow" or whatever. - and your mind _will drift off like this - this is normal, so don't beat yourself up. When this happens, just acknowledge the thoughts with detachment once you become aware that your mind is drifting off,picture the thoughts like floating balloons that drift off.
And then simply and gently go back to counting your breaths.

Wulfman wrote:What pressure and humidifier settings are you using?


Den

TItrated in May at 8 my range is set to 8-15, lately it has been hitting 15 sometimes during the night. Tried running for a few nights at 10-15, I really didn't like starting out at 10 very much. My stats for the first 2 months showed that 10 was my 90% value, that is not the case for the last couple of weeks.

Humidifier is set to 2. That is pretty high for me. Depending on the mask I will turn it down to 1 or off completely. The 2 is my max high, I live in a desert so humidity around here is pretty low at least during the day at night it can naturally go up to around 50% humidity.

thanks
John

jdm2857 wrote:Some people have worn lightweight gloves (or even mittens) to bed to make it more difficult to remove the mask while sleeping.

Others have taped the mask to their face so that the pain from the removal of the tape awakens them when the mask is removed.

Tape might work but to be honest I have to remove it sometimes because of the itching so that is going to be a big problem re-taping it in the dark. I tape my mouth when wearing the pillows or nasal mask and just getting that re-taped in the dark and half asleep is a chore that doesn't always happen.

Tube socks wouldn't stop me from removing the mask most of the time I just push it straight up - I'm not un-doing the straps

Thanks for the ideas.

John

larry63 wrote:

slaaplekker wrote:.

Have you tried the sustained release which is called Ambien CR? Ambien for a lot of people only puts you asleep for two or three hours, whereas Ambien CR for me lasted 5 or 6 hours.

Do you take Ambien every night? If so you might be building a tolerance to it. My dr. recommended I skip two nights a week to avoid that.
I also sometimes take Klonopin instead on certain nights, instead of the Ambien, Again, if you haven't tried the sustained release zoplidem aka ambien CR, why not give it a shot? It's more expensive, but why not try it for a month? Because really, the generic ambien is very short acting for a lot of people, including me. In fact, for me I think it has a rebound effect, much like trying to drink alcohol to get asleep would. Sure you get to sleep, but then you get the rebound effect later in the night, where you keep waking up because your brain is overcompensating for the sedative affect.

Just a thought. Again, I AM NOT A DOCTOR!

Asked for the CR release to begin with since I knew about the short half life not look talking him in to that. I have RLS and PLMD both pretty bad - I've not had much success getting treatment for those except Requip which had caused its one set of problems and no longer works correctly. I'm off to the Neurologist this week to see if he is willing to prescribe me something that will work for those problems. Ambien or other sleeping pills don't help with those problems so I will likely need to get something along the lines of Klonipin which would do the trick I'm sure. Dr's are so worried about prescription drug abuse around here that it is hard to find anyone willing to prescribe any of the traditional meds.

Thanks for the suggestion
John

Nebraska; Whatever hypnosis is, the end result depends on your confidence in it.
Hence the reported 'success' of chiropractors and acupuncturists.
I am more reliant on conventional science, so none of these disciplines is likely to ever have an effect for me.
But I have an open mind in that I believe that other people may benefit if they are so inclined.
I have had some luck with creative visualization--it's free, and no side effects.

My thought is the tape as well. The idea isn't that you have to retape, it's that you have to wakeup to get it off with the tape on and then since you're awake you DO NOT ALLOW YOURSELF TO TAKE THE MASK OFF. Even if you're half awake. You gotta own this. It's your brain and making excuses doesn't cut it.

What is your pressure? The only acceptable reason I can see to push off the mask would be if you were suffocating in which case you need to work on your pressure. Or throwing up or coughing badly.

Depending on your hair situation, tape all the way around the head might not work (though surely would hurt if you tried to remove it). But find something that does. And doesn't itch. How about an ace bandage? A shoelace? A head band?

Videotape yourself and analyze what you're doing and what are the precursors.

But you're right...you HAVE TO STOP. Good luck!

Thanks Rubymom - I will give the taping a try and see. Really it is the itching that is an issue that is forcing me to play with the mask at all. I have really awful Rosace - it is tough at my age to have pimples etc. and my skin is always very red and irritated. The meds help a little with the Roscae but anything touching my face for very long causes a reaction and then I have to relief the pressure. I'm so used to being able to just rub my face or push away what is bothering me in my sleep that I do it with the mask(s).

The taping could stop me from removing the mask but I'm going to be wide awake at that point. I guess that is better physically then the hypopneas and low O2sats. Just going to be difficult to hold down a job if I waking up every couple of hours and then needing to wind down to get back to sleep.

Can't use benadryl since it causes my Restless Leg Syndrome to go off the deep in.

I guess at this point taping is going to be worth a try, since I probably can't do much worse then I'm doing.

My pressure right now is set from 8-15 in the last two weeks it has been hitting 15 every night for at least 30 minutes. The good news are my stats look great for the time I have the mask on my AHI is usually less then 2.

thanks again
John

slaaplekker wrote:Have to stop removing the mask while I sleep. 119 days and I still can't get used to sleeping with a mask. Thinking of getting a stronger sleeping pill but to be honest my pressure requirements after adding the ambien have gone up dramatically so it almost seems self defeating. John

John..I am in the exact same boat as you. No matter what I do I cannot get used to having a mask on my face. I will try to use it and always end up taking it off during the night. I have tried some of the things you have tried..Hopefully we can figure this out so we can start to feel better. Terri

slaaplekker wrote: Tape might work but to be honest I have to remove it sometimes because of the itching so that is going to be a big problem re-taping it in the dark. I tape my mouth when wearing the pillows or nasal mask and just getting that re-taped in the dark and half asleep is a chore that doesn't always happen.

Tube socks wouldn't stop me from removing the mask most of the time I just push it straight up - I'm not un-doing the straps

Thanks for the ideas.

John

Maybe try staples?