"Health Care" Debate

roster wrote:Oh, I see someone has taken it upon themselves to become the decision maker on what the rest of the members can read and not read by deleting some of my posts. That action would certainly fit in with someone who wants a central government to make decisions for individuals.

Nord, I am sure it wasn't you or Dreamstalker.

Wasn't me either there big bird!! Not only would I not delete/remove another members post, I'm kinda computer illiterate so I'd have to read up on how to remove a post. Again, didn't mean to ruffle your feathers.

Maple Leaf wrote: Again, didn't mean to ruffle your feathers.

No problem, a little ruffling keeps me fresh and increases HDL.

To whomever deleted them:

Roster... travel safely...

Stay away from cliffs even if far from your friend's reach... you never know when lightning will strike

Nord

The only relationship Roster's political rants have to sleep apnea is they induce one big yawn.

Jay K wrote:The only relationship Roster's political rants have to sleep apnea is they induce one big yawn.

Part of my nonprofit side. No charge for curing insomnia.

roster wrote:

Jay K wrote:The only relationship Roster's political rants have to sleep apnea is they induce one big yawn.

Part of my nonprofit side. No charge for curing insomnia.

You have a non-profit side... ??? Maybe its deductible as charity.

Nord

I assure you, between my wife and I, not a penny of deductions is missed. Everyone should do the same. More money left for charities.

roster wrote:Oh, I see someone has taken it upon themselves to become the decision maker on what the rest of the members can read and not read by deleting some of my posts. That action would certainly fit in with someone who wants a central government to make decisions for individuals.

Nord, I am sure it wasn't you or Dreamstalker.

I didn't delete your post.

I have no problem with you making an ass of youself the way you do ... stuffing your head with tea party nuts and then crapping it on the forum is typical for you.

And I forgot to add ... you and your government bashing tea revelers are not much more than just hypocrites.

Louisiana's governor on Sunday criticized energy giant BP and federal authorities for failing to act fast enough to protect the state's coastlines from oil from a massive undersea leak.

The U.S. Coast Guard and BP failed to take decisions quickly enough and delayed supplying necessary clean-up equipment even as oil washes onto the state's fragile marshland, said Governor Bobby Jindal.

"It is clear the resources needed to protect our coast are still not here: boom, skimmers, vacuums, jack-up barges are all in short supply," Jindal told a news conference in Venice.

"Oil sits and waits for clean-up and every day that it waits for clean-up more and more marsh dies," said Jindal, whose words were echoed by a series of Louisiana parish (county) presidents.

Oil from a blown-out BP well in the Gulf of Mexico has been gushing into the sea for over a month.

Jindal said he was "frustrated" by the slow pace and said the delays were "unacceptable". He called for the Coast Guard to delegate more authority to local leaders to protect their own parishes.

Already, oil had tarred 65 miles 100 km of the state's coast, he said.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20100523/pl_ ... _louisiana

You conservatives constantly bash the government that it is too big, it is too socialist, it is too intrusive on business, blaaa blaa bla ... free market! Aark!!

But as soon as they get into trouble with big unregulated corporate crap and they come running and whinning to government for help and/or bailouts ... that is what I mean by a bunch of crap!!!

You birds are all the same

I'm sure, DreamStalker, that you didn't mean to disparage an entire group of people. Goodness knows that every group of anything...liberals, conservatives, teachers, teenagers, hoseheads, next-door neighbors, pro-choice, pro-life, men...never has a subsection of that group that's nuts or hypocritical. Not saying tea party people or the like are nuts, as I have a very good, sane friend and her husband who have attended several. I don't agree with everything everyone does who is a conservative (or claims to be), but not agreeing with what some do or say doesn't make all conservatives idiots (hypocrites, etc.), as you apparently seem to think. (Correct me if I'm wrong.) I don't think liberals/Democrats are idiots, I just disagree with what a lot of them believe.

Hopefully we all know that the media in general tend to distort the facts if need be in order to sensationalize. I'm speaking in general here, not about any specific article, newscast, radio broadcast...

I just finished transcribing interviews for a person who is about as left-wing as you can get (the person says so, so I'm not making assumptions or assigning a label on my own). Although I found myself yelling at what was being said at times, as I could just not understand the thinking, I did learn a lot--they were interviews with mostly Democrats for a political project. It gave me a keen understanding of the liberal mind. Most of the people were those who had worked on Democratic campaigns, some very high up in the rankings, so to speak. (Obviously can't give details, as this is a client.) It was very interesting. There were some that I actually agreed with much of what they said, but unfortunately most were, IMHO, way off the mark.

Please, continue with the, a-hem, mud slinging and name-calling at those you disagree with if it makes you feel better. It really gets your points across well...and gives me more insight into the liberal mind...or at least one liberal mind.

WearyOne wrote:I'm sure, DreamStalker, that you didn't mean to disparage an entire group of people. Goodness knows that every group of anything...liberals, conservatives, teachers, teenagers, hoseheads, next-door neighbors, pro-choice, pro-life, men...never has a subsection of that group that's nuts or hypocritical. Not saying tea party people or the like are nuts, as I have a very good, sane friend and her husband who have attended several. I don't agree with everything everyone does who is a conservative (or claims to be), but not agreeing with what some do or say doesn't make all conservatives idiots (hypocrites, etc.), as you apparently seem to think. (Correct me if I'm wrong.) I don't think liberals/Democrats are idiots, I just disagree with what a lot of them believe.

Hopefully we all know that the media in general tend to distort the facts if need be in order to sensationalize. I'm speaking in general here, not about any specific article, newscast, radio broadcast...

I just finished transcribing interviews for a person who is about as left-wing as you can get (the person says so, so I'm not making assumptions or assigning a label on my own). Although I found myself yelling at what was being said at times, as I could just not understand the thinking, I did learn a lot--they were interviews with mostly Democrats for a political project. It gave me a keen understanding of the liberal mind. Most of the people were those who had worked on Democratic campaigns, some very high up in the rankings, so to speak. (Obviously can't give details, as this is a client.) It was very interesting. There were some that I actually agreed with much of what they said, but unfortunately most were, IMHO, way off the mark.

Please, continue with the, a-hem, mud slinging and name-calling at those you disagree with if it makes you feel better. It really gets your points across well...and gives me more insight into the liberal mind...or at least one liberal mind.

No. Not a single enitre group ... just the tea party, drill baby drill, government-hating, unregulated market, nut case groups.

Well here ya go then, slung with details ... view the spew (not like it was made up in some liberal mind ... oh wait, y'all are calling it the Obama spill now right? )









Comming to a conservative coast near you, whether you want to agree with it or not.

EDIT: Looks like that awful socialist coast of Cuba may get some too ... ok, now you have something to cheer for.

Continuing down the non-health-care-debate rabbit trail, I have one question...does every--or even most--oil drilling in the ocean result it this? I didn't think so, but I seriously could be wrong. Does all (or even most) oil drilling cause this type of catastrophe? What's the percentage of oil drilling that turns bad and causes environmental problems? Okay, sorry, that's actually three questions! Please enlighten me as to the correct, unbiased, factual answers. If it does, I may change my thinking. I really would welcome an honest, factual answer from anyone. I'm all for independence from foreign countries, but I'd like to know the facts on both sides of the issue. And unfortunately, I am woefully uneducated on some issues, which is not a good thing. (Sorry, Rooster, for taking this in another direction.)

WearyOne wrote:Continuing down the non-health-care-debate rabbit trail, I have one question...does every--or even most--oil drilling in the ocean result it this? I didn't think so, but I seriously could be wrong. Does all (or even most) oil drilling cause this type of catastrophe? What's the percentage of oil drilling that turns bad and causes environmental problems? Okay, sorry, that's actually three questions! Please enlighten me as to the correct, unbiased, factual answers. If it does, I may change my thinking. I really would welcome an honest, factual answer from anyone. I'm all for independence from foreign countries, but I'd like to know the facts on both sides of the issue. And unfortunately, I am woefully uneducated on some issues, which is not a good thing. (Sorry, Rooster, for taking this in another direction.)

Well just how often is it “Okay” with you to have oil catastrophes? … so long as it affects someone else (and not you of course as conservatives usually only care about themselves and to hell with everyone/everything else)?

Is it “Okay” with you so long as BP’s 2010 first quarter earnings were at least $73 billion (minus the multi-million dollar “green” rebranding marketing costs)?

Is it “Okay” with you so long as it is labeled an act of God or Obama's spill?

Is it “Okay” with you so long as only plants and wildlife are affected?

What difference does it make how many rabbits get killed on the trail or how often or what percentage of oil wells blow out?

The facts are that you can search for those stats yourself … but what good does that do for those affected by such catastrophes? How does that make deregulation of big corporations (oil, health, or others) “Okay”?

Yes, I can most certainly search for myself, but it's not on my priority list. Not everything can be #1 or even in the top 10. There are thousands, or more, things going on in the world, this country, local city, and a personal life that via for priority research in a person's day. I thought since you have such strong emotional feelings on the subject, you could provide some answers to my questions.

But you didn't answer my questions; maybe you didn't intend to, but rather try to divert attention from my questions with emotional questions in return. How much is okay, you ask in several different ways? I honestly don't have an answer for that. Some things need to be abandoned because they are too unstable, too dangerous, cause too much devastation; some things need to be improved before they are continued; some things need to be scrapped in their current state and replaced with another way to do the same thing....etc. (This can be said for a lot of things--like healthcare--not just oil drilling.) I'm certainly not defending what happened here.

As much as I love little animals, wildlife, sea life, nature in general, I also love independence from other countries, too. (Sidebar: Please remember that just because a person doesn't feel the answer to others' problems is the same as yours, doesn't mean they only care about themselves.) So, how do we achieve protection of nature AND independence from other countries that will really work. Where's the balance? Can there be a balance? Is there an answer that does little (or no) damage to nature ever and yet heads us down the road to greater oil independence? (I'm not being sarcastic here, but I just realized I was assuming you agree that oil independence is a good thing. Do you?)

I know this is about health care ...BUT. I am thinking if we had been on track for last 20-30 years .... creating wind farms and solar energy -alternate fuels plant like soybeans and rapeseed. SO many ideas out there. It keeps getting shot down as too expensive. As long as we just point fingers nothing will get done. We need to take this latest spill as a good way to wake up our nation.

Do we care or just want to say going green is another commie socialist idea?

WearyOne wrote:Yes, I can most certainly search for myself, but it's not on my priority list. Not everything can be #1 or even in the top 10. There are thousands, or more, things going on in the world, this country, local city, and a personal life that via for priority research in a person's day. I thought since you have such strong emotional feelings on the subject, you could provide some answers to my questions.

But you didn't answer my questions; maybe you didn't intend to, but rather try to divert attention from my questions with emotional questions in return. How much is okay, you ask in several different ways? I honestly don't have an answer for that. Some things need to be abandoned because they are too unstable, too dangerous, cause too much devastation; some things need to be improved before they are continued; some things need to be scrapped in their current state and replaced with another way to do the same thing....etc. (This can be said for a lot of things--like healthcare--not just oil drilling.) I'm certainly not defending what happened here.

As much as I love little animals, wildlife, sea life, nature in general, I also love independence from other countries, too. (Sidebar: Please remember that just because a person doesn't feel the answer to others' problems is the same as yours, doesn't mean they only care about themselves.) So, how do we achieve protection of nature AND independence from other countries that will really work. Where's the balance? Can there be a balance? Is there an answer that does little (or no) damage to nature ever and yet heads us down the road to greater oil independence? (I'm not being sarcastic here, but I just realized I was assuming you agree that oil independence is a good thing. Do you?)

I am not against drilling for oil. I am against unregulated business … more specifically, large corporations but also small business under certain circumstances. Regulations are sets of rules that are supposed to allow a level playing field for everyone but more importantly, safety for innocent bystanders.

I am not diverting attention away from your question(s). I am diverting attention to the root problem(s) that lead to the oil spill statistics you asked about. The answer to your question(s) is that it should never happen if proper regulations are implemented and followed. Oil spills occur everywhere … where it is drilled for, along where it is transported, where it is stored, and where it is used. It can be minor like when someone changes the oil in their lawnmower or automobile and afterwards go dump it down the street drainage system. It can be major like what is happening right now in the Gulf of Mexico.

After graduating with my undergraduate degree, my first job was as an exploration geologist with Shell Oil. The senior geologists would come back to the office from doing field work with national cultural treasures (Mayan figurines) from Central America that they had traded with the local children for a few bottles of coca cola and laughing at how stupid the locals were. Nine months later, I went back to school for graduate studies and towards a direction away from petroleum geology because of the greed mentality there in that office.

Later as a grad research student, I recall on a bus trip down into deep southern Mexico to do some field work, the bus stopped at a station to refill with fuel and at the same time the Mexican bus line workers changed the bus engine oil and change out used tires with other used tires (sorta like a NASCAR pit stop for buses). They just drained the oil right onto the dirt parking space and you could see the entire area was just a mud pit of used oil … a very sad sight.

Texaco has spilled millions of gallons of oil into the delicate rain forests of Ecuador. Columbia, Nigeria, Asia, and everywhere that oil companies drill there is pollution, some makes it into the news some does not. Some is not even actual oil spills but rather waste by-products like brine waters seeping into the local aquifers and ruining what was once a good productive drinking water supply. My point is that oil related spills occur all of the time everywhere on the planet, some nobody ever hears about and others end up on statistics tables/charts that you have no priority to search for yourself. In all cases, most could be avoided with proper regulations. But tea nuts and free unregulated market conservatives wish to have no part of that.

As for “independence” from other countries (regardless if you mean “oil” or “energy”), it is easy. It is called technology, the stuff that made this country a super power, also known as science and engineering. But why settle for just oil/energy independence when we can strive for leadership in energy technology. There is wind and solar energy (as already mentioned), tidal and geothermal energy (in applicable locations), nuclear (pronuonced: \nü-klē-ər … not newk-ü-ler) energy, and most importantly … energy conservation technology. Sounds like something one would call “balanced”. Again, I am not against drilling for oil so long as it is done responsibly, but unfortunately, due to unregulated greed, most of the drilling being done today and in the past is not adequately regulated or done responsibly.