Government Will Mess with your CPAP

It is NOT the government's job to protect me from myself. No where in the Constitution is there that mandate.

They are starting to insist on what I can and can't eat - but - they keep letting their big business partners keep ruining our foods by what they can - and do- LEGALLY put in it. They keep helping agribusiness to squeeze out the individual farmers who grow healthier food stuffs not pumped up w/gas to keep them firm. They leave the individual farmers almost no choice in healthy seed but rather leave them no choice but to buy seed tampered w/to provide products such as tasteless tomoatoes w/skins so tough it takes a serated knife or an actual stabbing to slice them.

Now they wanna tinker w/my access to a fully data capable PAP device - HEAVEN FORBID I might learn how to understand the data and tweak my own therapy. Its too bad these politicians weren't all bucketed at birth! But then I suppose there'd just be more of the greedy sheisters to take their place. What honest, ethical, intelligent person would want to get involved in politics??? You lay down w/dogs, you get up w/fleas.

Uncle_Bob wrote:
I'm hoping they self regulate.

Like the Banking industry did? We all know how that turned out.

I guess after reading the political diatribe left and right on this subject I realize why I put cpap.talk on my back burner and left the building

Guest wrote:Your subject line seems to want to invoke anger amongst a certain political party....nice try.

You read that into the title because you think in terms of Republicans and Democrats - its your mindset that helps you defy logic.

The FDA under the current Democrat administration is pretty much the same as under the former Republican administration.

I don't trust any one of them. I have been around long enough to know how great power corrupts many of the best of men.

And if we are ever able to elect a true liberal independent government, their every move should still be watched closely.

Froro wrote:

Uncle_Bob wrote:
I'm hoping they self regulate.

Like the Banking industry did? We all know how that turned out.

Wink means what? That you are failing to mention the biggest disaster was our two government-sponsered agencies - Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae which, under direction from our government, pushed ridiculous mortgages on the market that were the major factor in our housing collapse which is by far the single biggest factor in the economic recession?

That you are also failing to mention the cozy relationships between our legislators and regulators with the executives at Goldman-Sachs?

allen476 wrote: .... My point is where as a society do we draw the line. ....

That is a point worth debating. But the bigger point is who draws the line. There I fall on the side of the ultimate minority - the individual. Let the individual decide what service he requires and is willing to pay for.

I am having two large doors replaced next week. A friend who is a retired contractor will inspect the work for me (for free). I don't care to have the government building inspector. My friend will do a better honest job.

When I had this house built, I paid the same retired house builder to regularly inspect as the work progressed. Oh, the government building inspector had to come also - it is mandatory, you can't opt out. But I did not trust him to get me to the quality level I expected.

Now we don't know where we will end up in the CPAP market with the new FDA actions. However I expect it portends trouble; it is definitely moving away from the goal of OTC sales of machines, masks and ancillaries; and it will add cost to the system!!!!

The article quotes in part:

Partner with accrediting organizations to train home healthcare providers in device use. "Assuring that [home health] practitioners are adequately trained in the use of medical devices in the home can be daunting, given the wide variety of technologies that are used, on- or off-label, in the home," the agency noted in the white paper.

"Therefore, FDA is partnering with two major accrediting bodies for home health agencies, the Community Health Accreditation Program and the Joint Commission, to review and strengthen accreditation criteria that relate to medical device safe use practices for the home environment."

Do we really want DMEs training us to use our CPAPS? Do we want to bear the cost of this training? Do we want to see cpap.com regulated out of business? Do we want cpaptalk.com to disappear because the sponsor was regulated out of business?

NO!

BTW, what do you take in lieu of Vioxx?

allen476 wrote:Can we say "Vioxx" which Pfizer still claims is safe.

Pfizer made Bextra. Merck made Vioxx.

Some government regulation, or intervention, is necessary. No question. But what we are heading to is over regulation, over involvement of the government (especially at the Federal level). Please look at the states that have become "Nanny States" (NY, NJ, MA, CA to name a few). They are over-extended. The Federal Government is running deficits over 1 Trillion dollars a year. Our Federal Debt is going to be about 20 Trillion by the end of the decade (if it even takes that long). That is unsustainable. I am not for no government, but for limited government and empowered individuals. On the whole, we can make better decisions for ourselves and our loved ones than some government official.

We were founded under the premise of the inalienable right for the pursuit of life, liberty and happiness. Not a guarantee, but a pursuit. Life is a gamble to a great degree. No one can deem it to be different, no matter how all knowing and powerful they think they are. People make mistakes, governments are run by people, and as such, even governments make mistakes.

In MA, we enacted the model for Obamacare. Have premiums gone down in that time? No. Have they misjudged how much it was going to cost? Yes. Is it harder to find doctors taking new patients? Yes. Right now, we have a battle going on between the regulators and the insurance industry over rates. You know who is caught in the middle? The people.

What we have now, on a national level, is not free markets, but pro big business -- crony capitalism. The big are getting bigger -- big government and big business -- and the rest of us are getting squeezed. It has been going on for years. Not just with Democrats or Republicans, but by the both of them to great degrees.

Our hallowed institutions have come to show themselves as hollow. It is time to get back to our founding principles. It is not a perfect union, by any stretch, but a more perfect union than anything that has come before it, and most likely, anything that comes after it.

(Ok, stepping off my soapbox now, getting some dinner, and praying that tonight's cpap numbers will be good ones -- not just for me, but for all us hoseheads -- liberal, conservative, republican, democrat, white, black, yellow, brown, rich, poor, straight, gay and whatever else you want to throw into the mix.)

howkim wrote:

allen476 wrote:Can we say "Vioxx" which Pfizer still claims is safe.

Pfizer made Bextra. Merck made Vioxx.

Sorry on painkillers today. Head has been a little foggy but I do remember reading on this and that they fried there own goose by not giving the FDA the study. Further compounding the problem is that they didn't even think to warn doctors that it was for short term use. I took Vioxx for 6 months, maybe I should sue.....but then I am back to the prior medical history.

Allen

That is a point worth debating. But the bigger point is who draws the line. There I fall on the side of the ultimate minority - the individual. Let the individual decide what service he requires and is willing to pay for.

I'm all for that. But I favor that there is no standard for the manufacturers to follow. Literally as the market stands right now, some Chiwanese company could start making xPAP machines tomorrow and there is nothing to stop them from making it a danger to anyone.

I am having two large doors replaced next week. A friend who is a retired contractor will inspect the work for me (for free). I don't care to have the government building inspector. My friend will do a better honest job.

I am not taking issue to having things repaired but rather the building as a whole. If you were having major renovations done, whether you like it or not, the building inspector is there to insure that the contractor is not cutting corners and making the house unsafe. I have in 15 years of electrical work seen some really crappy jobs that wouldn't pass anything. But since the contractors knew how to play the game, they got away with it.

When I had this house built, I paid the same retired house builder to regularly inspect as the work progressed. Oh, the government building inspector had to come also - it is mandatory, you can't opt out. But I did not trust him to get me to the quality level I expected.

But is he up to date on new building codes and products?

Now we don't know where we will end up in the CPAP market with the new FDA actions. However I expect it portends trouble; it is definitely moving away from the goal of OTC sales of machines, masks and ancillaries; and it will add cost to the system!!!!

The article quotes in part:

Partner with accrediting organizations to train home healthcare providers in device use. "Assuring that [home health] practitioners are adequately trained in the use of medical devices in the home can be daunting, given the wide variety of technologies that are used, on- or off-label, in the home," the agency noted in the white paper.

"Therefore, FDA is partnering with two major accrediting bodies for home health agencies, the Community Health Accreditation Program and the Joint Commission, to review and strengthen accreditation criteria that relate to medical device safe use practices for the home environment."

Do we really want DMEs training us to use our CPAPS? Do we want to bear the cost of this training? Do we want to see cpap.com regulated out of business? Do we want cpaptalk.com to disappear because the sponsor was regulated out of business?

I am not going to pass judgment on this yet. There is nothing in writing as to what the "training" will be. Do I want to see our host be pushed out? No, as many DME's are about as trustworthy as a used car salesman. But I do believe that machines and masks should be better scrutinized before release to the general public. As an in home medical device, xpap really isn't regulated beyond just having a prescription. What happens if Resmed releases a new mask and due to a poor design, someone dies due to it. Resmed still keeps making the same poorly designed mask, settles with the family, and answers to no one. Then 5 people die, it keeps going all the while no one is held responsible because there is no accountability and the public not informed. If there is a third party that regulates the industry, then we can hold the third party and the manufacturer accountable. The government's role is because it is the only power to act for the people. An evil necessity, yes it is.

BTW, what do you take in lieu of Vioxx?

Nothing now, Due to the Coumadin, I can't take anything.

Allen

allen476 wrote:What happens if Resmed releases a new mask and due to a poor design, someone dies due to it.

I know what will happen. All the sleep forums, especially this one, will recognize the piece of crap before anyone dies. The word will rip through the forums and spill over into the social media and the doctors' and DMEs' offices.

Meanwhile the FDA will be sleeping. Two years later they will issue a recall.

I notice you have a pressure of 16 cm. Is that for backsleeping? Have you considered retitrating yourself for tummy or side sleeping? I need 19 cm on my back and a mere 7.5 works for tummy or side.

Froro wrote:

Uncle_Bob wrote:
I'm hoping they self regulate.

Like the Banking industry did? We all know how that turned out.

True but i've always been able to have a bank account

When the government gets more involved and tries to mess with my cpap, i'll stockpile them in my closet like i have with my weapons.Power to the people !

I notice you have a pressure of 16 cm. Is that for backsleeping? Have you considered retitrating yourself for tummy or side sleeping? I need 19 cm on my back and a mere 7.5 works for tummy or side.

Well my original titration I slept mostly on my side. I use the auto mode all of the time. Some nights it is in the 19-20 range and some nights I don't move past 14. Leaks are minimal and my ahi is around 1.5 in 8 hours of sleep. Since switching to a pillows mask, I have been sleeping on my back a lot more but the pressure swings are still there. I have found that playing with the apnea/hypopnea settings on the machine, I have really lowered my AHI by making the machine more sensitive to hypopneas and apneas. That way the machine is not chasing them.

Allen

Birddog wrote:When the government gets more involved and tries to mess with my cpap, i'll stockpile them in my closet like i have with my weapons.Power to the people !

Now your talkin' my kind of language! "I'll give the Feds my CPAP when they pry it from my cold, dead face!"