Periodic Breathing

I have Cheyne-Stokes respirations during sleep, treated with a Bi-PAP AutoSV. My sleep doctor likened the problem to a thermostat in your house that is late to react to a temperature change. Our respiratory system has a CO2 detector that determines CO2 levels and adjusts our breathing accordingly. It keeps CO2 levels within a specific healthy range; not too high, not too low. With CSR, the CO2 levels are allowed to rise higher than they should, then drop lower than they should. When the CSR patient's brain realizes that CO2 levels are too high, they will hyper-ventilate (over-breath) to bring CO2 levels down. But the CO2 level will actually drop too low. Then the patient will hypo- ventilate (under-breath), allowing the CO2 levels to rise too high again, beginning the cycle again.

Tony

pardon my ignorance (or laziness) in asking, but what determines if it is apena or something else?

I am on cpap, (well an apap actually), been for about a year now. Im no stranger here, just more of a sit back and watch type as of late.

Every so often I get this wild stick up my bottom and question why am I on cpap... Sure I used to snore, it is a long standing family trait. 2 sleep studies (without and then with cpap) told me I had OSA and had to be on a cpap, since I would not consider surgery. I found this site, asked questions, did my own homework, and then asked for the apap instead, and was given one.

I did a search for holding + breath, because I think that is what I do. Even when awake, I find myself at tome (subconsciously) holding my breath. I do not realize I am doing it, but do catch myself. Pardon my ignorance, but would that be like a central or the chyenne stokes thing?

Earlier reading may indicate heart conditions? I am young (41) and not obese, in relatively decient shape... Just wondering (out loud) if I have OSA or something else and I am chasing ghosts by wearing a hose every night...

I have episodes of CSR respiration every night. They usually are clustered around the time I go to sleep and in the hour before awakening.

Usually I know what the report will say before looking at it. There is a high correlation between remembered dreams (and the amount of them) and CSR respiration. The more the CSR, the more the dream rememberance.

My average CA is not too high because of the tight clusters. For example, last night my CA was 2.6, OA was 2.2 and H was 0.8 for an AHI of only 5.5.

However, in one 25 minute period, I had 19 recorded events (CSR during the entire time). 2 were listed as H, 4 were listed as OA, and 13 were recorded as CA.

I don't know where I should be concerned or not. The averages are not so bad, but the tight clustering seems a little high. Any ideas, anyone?

Since the supply company doesn't require me to send them the smart card any longer, can someone explain the following readings:

Periodic Breathing
1 day 34% Does the ''periodic breathing" mean, for example, 1 day @ 34% = in an 8 hr period I stop breathing 34% of that 8 hrs?
7 day 43%
30 day 34%

AHI:
1 day 10
7 day 13.1
30 day 11.3 Any help/answers are appreciated. I have only been at this for about 4 months. Thanks.

Average PS
1 day 1.0
7 day 2.1
30 day 1.9

90% Epap:
1 day 5.0
7 day 5.2
30 day 5.7

robpeet wrote:Periodic Breathing
1 day 34% Does the ''periodic breathing" mean, for example, 1 day @ 34% = in an 8 hr period I stop breathing 34% of that 8 hrs?

You might want to start a new thread with your questions instead of it getting lost in this old thread.
A lot of the forum members don't look at the old threads all that much.
Could you also please add your equipment to your profile?
It's one of the Respironics Bipaps with the PB being reported. On the bottom of the blower is the model number..
Either 650 or 660 or 750 or 760...might have a couple of letters before or after it.

I am short on time..so can't go into much detail.
Read this as it will help clarify some of your questions
EncoreGuide link this will show you examples of what you will see. For a different machine than yours but the basics are the same.
http://www.healthcare.philips.com/pwc_h ... _Guide.pdf

You need to get the software for your machine. SleepyHead will work with it and I have links for it in my signature line.
If you want Encore software..send me a PM and tell me what operating system is on your computer.

Periodic breathing is NOT where you stop breathing 34% of the time..PB is a general waxing and waning of your air flow..you may or may not have episodes where you stop breathing during this time spent in PB.
34% is very high...but more information is needed before we go and get all worked up.
Like...are you sleeping soundly through the night or do you have lots of wake ups..big or little?

Your AHI...also a little high...we need to know the event category breakdown that makes up that AHI...that's where the software comes in. The data given on the LCD screen doesn't go into the level of detail that we need to evaluate things.

Read this also.
understanding your data viewtopic/t88983/Pugsys-PointersSleepyH ... nding.html

That's a start. Do start a new thread though with what else you need clarified.
That way your problems or questions get the attention they deserve and you will get more responses.

Also...couple last questions..how are you feeling...how are you sleeping...and do you take any meds of any kind especially any meds that might impact respiration or air flow with the lungs?

I have been using a CPAP for about three months. I was diagnosed with mild sleep apnea. Most of my events were hypopnea. one or two a night were central rather them obstructive events. For the entire time I have never had periodic breathing. In the last few days I've had a bad cold and night before last I didn't use the CPAP. Last night I used it and for the first time I had an 8 percent periodic breathing. I have not been diagnosed with any long or heart problems. Do you have any idea what might cause that?

ninagrey wrote:I have been using a CPAP for about three months. I was diagnosed with mild sleep apnea. Most of my events were hypopnea. one or two a night were central rather them obstructive events. For the entire time I have never had periodic breathing. In the last few days I've had a bad cold and night before last I didn't use the CPAP. Last night I used it and for the first time I had an 8 percent periodic breathing. I have not been diagnosed with any long or heart problems. Do you have any idea what might cause that?

When we are ill (especially with upper respiratory illness like a common cold or sinus infection) our breathing isn't normal and the machine will often flag this irregular breathing as something other than it really is.
Not all PB means that there's a heart problem and not all PB means CSR is involved.
When we are ill...it's best to just ignore what the reports are showing because it really isn't an accurate assessment of the situation. Nasal congestion associated with the common cold will easily make out breathing irregular and the machine will notice and flag it but it doesn't mean anything bad is going on.

Wait until you are thoroughly over the cold symptoms and see if things return to normal. I am betting they will.

My periodic breathing began 4 months ago and is getting more frequent. I have readings as high as 25% but usually 6 To 15 %.
Do have cardiac problems. Most mornings I wake up feeling worn exhausted. Am tired all day. Can't see my pilmonologist for 2 months. Should I see my cardiologist as soon as possible?

By all means see your cardiologist, but you may also learn more if you have the type of machine that lets you use software (via an SD card in the machine) to read your results of overnight sleep on your computer. What machine and model do you have (the more info/names+# you provide the better)? We can help you with the the above (it's all free) so that if there is something that can be adjusted with your Cpap, you may do better on it and not necessarily have the problems you do now.

I have an autobipap and tonight woke up feeling quite braindead. I haven't yet had a full titration study because I've had problems falling asleep in the lab. Can I send someone my overnight data to someone that might be experienced enough with this stuff to help me? I'm wondering if just shallow breathing is a nissue. Thanks,

Dave

dkatcher wrote:I have an autobipap and tonight woke up feeling quite braindead. I haven't yet had a full titration study because I've had problems falling asleep in the lab. Can I send someone my overnight data to someone that might be experienced enough with this stuff to help me? I'm wondering if just shallow breathing is a nissue. Thanks,

Dave

Hi Dave,
Please start a new thread so your answers don't get mixed up with the original posters. Then if you register and tell us your equipment and settings, we can get started on helping you. There is a way to post data here but I want to reply to that in your new thread.

For the last 3 years my Periodic breathing has been 0 and my AHI has been 1 - 3. But in the last week things have changed a lot. My AHI last night was 8.9 and my periodic breathing was 31% For about a week or two my Periodic breathing has been on average at 13% Night before last was 0% Now 31%. What does this mean? Should I be concerned? I got a flu shot a year ago and had a very severe reaction where I went blind and deaf with severe inflammation throughout my body. But my sleep stayed normal until recently. I just don't want to ignore this if something dangerous is happening.

See a doctor! We can't do anything from here but guess, and not knowing anything about you (and not being MDs) or getting a look at software reports it's pointless to even speculate. One night may not mean a lot considering you could have moved the mask in your sleep, or had a stomach reaction to something you ate, or anything at all but it's up to you to follow up.