Losing weight really is the best long term solution

LisaEileen wrote: ..... Both of my doctors are pretty convinced that I will probably lose weight once I get my sleep problem under control. ......

Now there you have some exceptional doctors, Lisa. Hang on to them.

rooster wrote:...one renowned SDB doctor believes the jaw began to narrow in our population about 200 years ago for some unknown reason...

Thanks for sharing this Rooster! It ties in with info I've read that as grains became an increasingly larger portion of our diets, we became shorter and less strong, our faces narrowed, our dental arch narrowed, our immune weakened, and our overall health declined with each successive generation experiencing these effects a bit more.

The discussions about weight, not just here but most places, collapse many things in the same conversation. Not every fat person is unfit or sedentary. Not every skinny person is fit. And being fat is not "bad" and being skinny is not "good" (in a moral sense, at least in my books).

And not every fit fat person (that's me) loses weight on CPAP therapy. I've gained weight, but in my case I am clear it is all muscle. What I noticed after starting CPAP therapy is that my capacity to develop musculature has really increased, as has my capacity to train hard.

Untreated AHI is 91 events per hour. I have a resting heart rate of below 60. I exercise (bike to work + train in martial arts) 60-120 minutes per day.

I don't know whether IF I lose weight my OSA will be affected. My sleep doc says he thinks not. It frustrates me to no end the assumptions people make about me, my OSA, my level of activity and my worth as a person based on my WEIGHT.

And one more thing: both of my kids have cranio-facial anomalies. My older daughter's fontanel closed very early and she has a very narrow palate and a cross-bite. My younger daughter was born with overlapping skull plates which were separated over time with therapy (she was a surgical candidate but we were able to avoid surgery). Both kids have very narrow, fused skulls. I suspect both of my daughters' facial and cranial architecture sets them up for OSA, just like mine does for me.

Guest wrote:My sleep doc has always pushed weight loss as what I really need to do to treat my condition. I've always worked out, but still kept some weight on. I've been concentrating on losing it more lately and I've lost 10+ lbs. I've noticed an immediate change in my sleep and my memory card reader and software have backed it up. I've noticed a 40% drop in my AHI with no other changes.

Everyone here seems solely focused on their CPAP. What are each of you doing to lose weight to help the problem. It takes a lot more work than putting on a mask at night, but it really is the responsible thing to do. I know there are some slim people with apnea, but they are by far in the minority. What are each of you doing?

Guest wrote:"sleep apnea is a fat person's disease"

Those are your words. Not mine. I did address this in my original post. Odd that there's not one post here about how someone exercised, dropped some weight as requested by a doctor and improved their lot.

"Although I'm sure the extra weight hasn't helped any, losing it won't solve my problem."

That's sort of a defeatist attitude. You note that weight is adding to your apnea but you don't want to lose any as it won't cure it. It's like a diabetic saying that eating sugar is making my diabetes a lot worse, but I won't cut it out as I'll still be a diabetic.

It's odd that people don't talk more about fitness in general here. Google how to get better sleep and you'll always see exercise and eating well listed. I guess people are just happy to stick with the machine and hope for the best.

You haven't stated how long you've been on CPAP therapy. Nor, whether that 40% drop in your AHI from what it was in your sleep study or from when you started therapy (and over what period of time).

Along the same line........how long it has taken you to lose the 10 lbs?

This is a CPAP user forum, not a weight loss forum. However, if you'd have bothered to do some research (forum searching), you'd have seen that there are 175 pages of posts that have the word "exercise" in them.

I would strongly suggest that you do some more (like, A LOT MORE) research on sleep apnea AND diabetes.

Going back four years, I'd have had your "40%" beat (any way you'd want to measure it) and your 10 lb. weight loss. But, I haven't taken up "preaching to the masses" as you seem to be. I KNOW how the complications of this condition can affect the body and the ABILITY to exercise for many people.
By the way, age and physical injuries can also affect the ability to exercise.
Also, the neck (size) isn't the only issue. Nasal passage issues (turbinates and septum) can also affect the ability to to get enough air into the lungs.


Den

Hi

Loosing weight is important for many health issues

For sleep apnea it clearly be beneficial but airway anatomy also has a lot to do with the degree of improvement.

A recent study in the Journal of Clinical Sleep Medicine looked at bariatric pts before and after surgery and only about 60 % pts had AHI decrease below 5 and they had significant weight loss BMI from 50 to below 30

broy wrote:...only about 60 % pts had AHI decrease below 5 and they had significant weight loss BMI from 50 to below 30

That means 40% had significant improvements...I'm hoping I'm one of them <sounds of that song You gotta have hope, lots and lots of hope...>

Research consistently shows that there is no such thing as "long term weight loss" for the majority of the population. Proud weight losers come here trumpeting their weight loss when its fresh and new.

Nobody has had the guts to come back every 3 months for years to record their slow weight gain.

Did you hear what sleepguy said: 7 year ago he lost 60 pounds. And now - like most dieters - he's truying to loose them all over again.

And this isn't dsm's firt weight loss bout since he's been on the forum, either.

Guest - please ask you sleep doc for the peer reviewed studies that show successful long term weight loss - where longe term means 5 years later.

And when you get them, please post links to those studies.

Meanwhile, while we're all waiting (and waiting....)for yet another doctor to respond with scientific info, you may want to read some of the papers mentioned in Garry Taubes' book "Good Calories Bad Calories".

And how about concetrating on health at every size, and not weight?

http://www.lindabacon.org/HAESbook/excerpts.html

O.

You haven't been around long enough to have seen all the talk from people who have lost weight, who have felt better and/or at least had an easier time of it after losing some, so I don't think you should be making more of those sweeping statements just yet, and until you register or at least identify yourself in some more meaningful way I don't know that a lot of others here will give as much credence to your ideas as they might otherwise, which would be a shame, though you don't seem to really address what other people have said here either.

Hey, OP, nice way to enter a forum!

My BMI is <25. I eat healthy food and exercise regularly. I also have sleep apnea. Losing weight MAY help some, but it is not the best long term solution for all.

ozij wrote: Meanwhile, while we're all waiting (and waiting....)for yet another doctor to respond with scientific info, you may want to read some of the papers mentioned in Garry Taubes' book "Good Calories Bad Calories".

And how about concetrating on health at every size, and not weight?

http://www.lindabacon.org/HAESbook/excerpts.html

O.

Ozij, just wanted to say it's nice to see a fellow Taubes fan and HAES supporter out and about. I don't often see them out in the wild.

Cassandra

Guest wrote:"sleep apnea is a fat person's disease"

Those are your words. Not mine. I did address this in my original post. Odd that there's not one post here about how someone exercised, dropped some weight as requested by a doctor and improved their lot.

"Although I'm sure the extra weight hasn't helped any, losing it won't solve my problem."

That's sort of a defeatist attitude. You note that weight is adding to your apnea but you don't want to lose any as it won't cure it. It's like a diabetic saying that eating sugar is making my diabetes a lot worse, but I won't cut it out as I'll still be a diabetic.

It's odd that people don't talk more about fitness in general here. Google how to get better sleep and you'll always see exercise and eating well listed. I guess people are just happy to stick with the machine and hope for the best.

A little arrogant don't you think? Never did I say that I wasn't trying to lose the weight - I am. Still doesn't change the fact that I had apnea when I was likely in far better shape than you may ever be.

Maintaining a healthy weight is a struggle for many and in fact is different for most. From what I've read on this forum most members care very much for their health and are doing what they can to improve it. Why else hook yourself up to an air compressor and a mask?

For me, I destroyed my knee years ago and I'm not able to get the exercise that I used to. Between the physical changes and emotional changes due to my disabilities over eating became somewhat of a crutch. Which I'm making every effort to give up.

I would suggest that you try to gain understanding and perspective before just spouting off.

I probably I had severe sleep apnea when I was a teen ager. My mom took me to several doctors because I snored horribly, stopped breathing when I when sleeping, and I was falling asleep during the day; at that time nobody knew anything about sleep apnea. I lived with severe sleep apnea for many years before I was finally diagnosed about 14 years ago.

Up until about five years ago, my BMI was always comfortably below 30. When I was in my 20's, I was in excellent shape and easily lifted 250# equipment over my head -- I based upon complaints and reports from roommates, daytime sleepiness, and headaches; I also probably had severe sleep apnea. When I was diagnosed I was still in decent shape and had a BMI under 30.

My BMI is currently 32 (I lost fifty pounds in about four months) and according to the numbers from my autoPAP, my pressure and treated AHI is still about the same as it was a year ago.

I know that a number of people improve their AHI to some degree after losing a considerable amount of weight, and I know that some morbidly obese (>100% over ideal weight) people have been able to 'cure' their OSA (having an AHI < 5 without treatment) by losing a very large amount of weight. I believe that the morbidly obese people who 'cured' their OSA had OSA that was directly caused by their extreme weight, and that they represent a very small number of people with OSA.

Bearded_One wrote:I believe that the morbidly obese people who 'cured' their OSA had OSA that was directly caused by their extreme weight, and that they represent a very small number of people with OSA.

Or possibly they had OHS (obesity hypoventilation syndrome) instead of OSA or in addition to their OSA.

TSSleepy wrote:

Bearded_One wrote:I believe that the morbidly obese people who 'cured' their OSA had OSA that was directly caused by their extreme weight, and that they represent a very small number of people with OSA.

Or possibly they had OHS (obesity hypoventilation syndrome) instead of OSA or in addition to their OSA.

I agree.

Hi Cass.


O.