benadryl?

Falcon1 wrote:.............

I've been seeing the signs for "Valkyrie," with Tom Cruise prominently featured, along the southbound lane of the 405 freeway here in Los Angeles, which I drive to work on.

............

Here is an excellent movie, currently playing, that is on a related topic: The Boy in the Striped Pajamas.

My eyes and ears were fully attentive for the entire movie. I highly recommend it.

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0914798/

Oh, and don't get excited about the title; it is not about a kid who sleeps prone.

Falcon, thank you for all this interesting information. This is completely fascinating to me. I'm printing out this thread, and checking your Rooster thread. I'm trying hard to get along with my CPAP and mask, but oh how I'd love to be someone for whom these methods are effective! I wonder how one can test their efficacy without having to go to a sleep lab? I was rarely tired before using CPAP, so simply feeling rested might not work for me.

We need to find you a grant and get a study going, and if the effects are replicable, word will spread and you will be a hero for those who have UARS or mild apnea that responds to this treatment. (I'm sure your patient load leaves you lots of time to conduct studies. )

I had gobs of hypopneas and RERAs, but unlike you, I did have 7 apneas -- but they were all when on my back. (Apnea-only index was 1.1.). I wonder if your suggestions could work for me? I have no known allergies except for horses, and last time Iooked there weren't any ponies in our bedroom, so it's encouraging that the Claritin worked for you even though you are also an allergy-free person. I wonder what the mechanism behind its sleep benefit could be?

I have a name for the position you describe: The Falcon Position.

san_fran_gal,

You've inspired me to get my photos of this sleeping position accomplished, as I promised.

Here they are below. Thanks for the nomination to give the 'partial swastika sleeping position' a new name...and call it the Falcon Position!

Actually, I can't take full credit for this sleeping position. I remembered seeing it a long time ago on a re-run of an old Merv Griffin show. A sleep expert (don't recall his name) was one of Merv's guests, and he told Merv and the audience about this position. He said that studies and surveys had been done, and this was found to be the most comfortable position among all other sleeping positions. (Personally, I found that it actually took a little time to get used to it, when I first tried it. Now I find it extremely comfortable.) The guest also said that this sleeping position was one of the best for alignment, as well, since the spine of your neck, torso, and hips stay lined-up with each other.

The mental image I saw on that talk show episode stayed with me, and about three years ago I started to experiment and use this position at night. I found that it really helped significantly with somewhat reducing my sleep-disordered breathing related symptoms, in conjunction with my other treatment approaches, especially compared with back-sleeping (with or without a pillow, neck roll, etc) or side-sleeping positions.

As I mentioned previously, with this sleeping position, the head is kept turned completely to the side, while it rests flat against the bed.

The body is not actually completely prone, since the chest and abdomen stay lifted up off of the bed somewhat, because of the bend in the hip of one leg, which keeps the torso/abdomen propped up a bit.

For added support and comfort, I like to keep a pillow under the half of my chest and abdomen which is lifted up slightly off the bed. You can see the pillow that I have under my chest/abdomen in the photos.


Left-facing position:



Right-facing position:




As I mentioned before, this sleeping position is also very compatible with cpap gear, in my experience. Back when I was using my cpap machine and facemask/headgear, I slept in this position very consistently and effectively each night, without any interference.

Today, I went and dug my cpap mask out of the closet where it's been for the past two years (since I no longer need cpap treatment), and took these photos, to demonstrate that this sleeping position is compatible with facemask/headgear usage.

Left-facing position, with facemask/headgear:



Right-facing position, with facemask/headgear:




With practice and conditioning, I found that I was able to become accustomed to being able to switch from the left-facing position to the right-facing position while asleep, without any interference to my facemask/ headgear, for a greater degree of variety and comfort during the night. At first, I practiced this switching from left-facing to right-facing several times, consciously, before falling asleep at night for a couple of weeks. Then, my subconscious took over and I was able to switch from left- to right-facing a few times during the night while asleep, without interruption of my sleep.

For those that didn't see it earlier on page 1 of this forum string, here's the excerpt again from my ebook, at http://www.uarsrelief.com, which I wrote on the topic of "Sleeping Positions".

Best regards!

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
SLEEPING POSITIONS - by Eric Falcon, MD

It is widely accepted that sleeping on your back tends to worsen all forms of sleep-disordered breathing, including UARS, sleep apnea, and snoring. Sleeping on the back allows gravity to pull the soft tissues of the palate, or the tongue, down into the back of the throat and cause airway narrowing, or as in the case of sleep apnea, complete obstruction.

Some doctors will even go so far as to advise patients with sleep-disordered breathing to sew a pocket into the back of their pajamas so that a tennis ball may be kept in it at night. After rolling onto your back at night during sleep and repeatedly experiencing the discomfort of the tennis ball continuously there, you soon "train" your subconscious mind to learn to avoid this sleeping position all together.

An easier alternative to sewing a pocket in the back of your pajamas is to just go out and buy a Dickies T-shirt or other type of T-shirt (which you can usually find in the men's section of K-mart) that has a pocket in the front upper left of the shirt. Simply put the shirt on backwards and place the tennis ball in the pocket, which is now in the upper right of the back. You get the same effect!

Sleeping on your side is preferable to sleeping on your back. When sleeping on your side try to keep your head, torso, and pelvis all in a straight line (when viewed from behind), which is a neutral anatomical position that will help to keep your spine in alignment. You can achieve this result by using a pillow of the proper height under your head and also by placing a flat pillow between your knees. Also, keep your knees and hips in a relaxed but flexed position and bent at 90 degree angles.

Many authorities feel that sleeping on the stomach, known as the "prone" position, is not a good idea. The reason for this is because it can lead to improper alignment of the spine, and because it can also place excessive pressure on the gastrointestinal organs throughout the night.

Yet doctors routinely advocate that patients with sleep-disordered breathing sleep on their stomach or side, however, and avoid sleeping on their backs. By sleeping on your side, or on your stomach with your head turned off to the side, this elicits the pull of gravity to cause the soft tissues of the palate and the tongue to fall somewhat forward and away from the back of the throat, preventing them from narrowing or obstructing the airway.

Believe it or not there actually is a PRONE sleeping position I have found which I believe retains the beneficial effects of gravity on the tissues of the back of the throat and tongue, as well as maintains some degree of proper spinal alignment, and also avoids excessive pressure on the internal organs.

This is often called the SWASTIKA SLEEPING POSITION (it's really only a PARTIAL swastika shape) because of the position of the arms, which are pointed in opposite directions away from each other, with the shoulders and the elbows bent at ninety degree angles.

Here's a complete description of the SWASTIKA SLEEPING POSITION: To start out with, first lay flat on your belly for a second and turn your head to the left. Now, bring your left arm up so that your upper arm is extending out at a ninety degree angle to the side of your torso, and your left elbow is bent ninety degrees, with your left hand pointing up away from your feet. (Your left hand ends up being next to your face, in this position.)

Next, extend your right arm out to the opposite side of your body at a ninety degree angle and bend your right elbow ninety degrees as well, with your right hand pointing down towards your feet. (You arms will now form a 'half-swastika' shape.)

Next, bring your left thigh up so that your left hip and knee are each bent at ninety degree angles. Keep the right leg extended straight downward, with no bend at the knee or hip. In this position you will find that your abdomen/belly and chest will be lifted slightly off of the bed, so that there is not a feeling of excessive pressure on your gastrointestinal organs. For added support and comfort, you can place a pillow under the left half of your chest and abdomen.

I find this to be an incredibly comfortable position which I can remain in all night long with no discomfort. By the way, no pillow is used under the head in this sleeping position. The side of your face rests directly on your flat bed and the spine of your neck, torso, and hips should all line up in a straight line.

You can also switch to the exact opposite side, using the swastika sleeping position, so that you're looking to the right instead, with your right hand now up in front of your face and your right knee and hip bent, and your left leg straight. Basically just use the same steps as I described above but replace the terms "left" with "right" and vice-versa.

Aside: Although this is my favorite sleeping position, I really DISLIKE the NAME that was given to it, for OBVIOUS REASONS! The image of a swastika however seems to help people who've never seen this sleeping position before to visualize it better, and so the term helps a bit when attempting to describe this sleeping position to others. Nonetheless, I sure hope someone comes up with a better name for it sometime soon!


12/4/08 PostScript: A nomination has been proposed to give this sleep position the new name of the "Falcon Position." I'm honored!

Thanks for posting those four photos! They're worth 4,000 words. It really helps! I just went into the bedroom and tried it out, and it's pretty comfy. (I hope my neck will cooperate. It doesn't like stomach sleeping, although I love it...) One of my "falcon wings" ran smack dab into my sleeping hubby, so I'll have to watch the wings!

Do you have any recommendations for testing the efficacy of this position + claritin on UARS/mild apnea?

Hi guys-

I did not try taking Claritin- I took one look at the price of one tablet and decided that I was going to go through my other options first! Instead, I turned up the pressure 2 cm's and that actually did the trick. I still do have a lot of sinus congestion and could definitely by dealing with the apnea better, but (hopefully!) Claritin's not the answer for me!

-Grace

ciounoi wrote:Hi guys-

I did not try taking Claritin- I took one look at the price of one tablet and decided that I was going to go through my other options first! ......

Ci, Check out the generics. Claritin is no longer protected by patent and there are reputable drug makers producing the identical product, Loratadine, at reasonable prices.

http://www.walgreens.com/store/product. ... prod387471

http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product. ... d=10324533

http://www.cvs.com/CVSApp/catalog/shop_ ... navCount=3

You can easily find it for $0.30 per 24-hour tablet.

BTW, Ci, your profile is similar to the profile of the technician who attended my first titration study. She was 24, slim, attractive and healthy looking. She has severe obstructive sleep apnea and uses cpap. She was hired by the sleep lab that diagnosed her.

Good luck,

rooster wrote: BTW, Ci, your profile is similar to the profile of the technician who attended my first titration study. She was 24, slim, attractive and healthy looking. She has severe obstructive sleep apnea and uses cpap. She was hired by the sleep lab that diagnosed her.

That's awesome! I told a nurse once that I had sleep apnea. Her response: "But you're thin!" Haha, people do break the OSA stereotype sometimes.

Thanks for the price information. I was looking at my local supermarket; maybe I need to get myself over to a drugstore.

San_fran_gal, Hi. Glad to hear you gave the sleeping position a try.

As far as your question: "Do you have any recommendations for testing the efficacy of this position + claritin on UARS/mild apnea?"

Sure. First of all, when it comes to medications (e.g., Claritin, any of the other non-sedating antihistamines, etc), please everyone discuss the usage with your doctors.

Of course, very few, if any, physicians will have heard of this technique of taking a non-sedating antihistamine tablet at bedtime, as I've described. It was something that I sort of stumbled onto on my own, since I had never heard this recommended by anyone before, including my own doctors. It was quite serendipitous, since I found that lo-and-behold it provided relief from all of my sleep-disordered breathing related symptoms (after nearly 20 years of suffering with terrible daytime tiredness & chronic fatigue, mild snoring, and recurring difficulty with arising out of bed in the morning).

Even though your doctor may not have ever heard about the technique of taking a non-sedating antihistamine at BEDTIME (since they are only familiar with the typical recommendations for morning usage to control day-time symptoms), nonetheless, if your doctor is reasonable, then he/she should have no objections to you trying this technique. You may explain to him/her where you heard about this (from a poster on this forum, who is a family practice doctor who discovered that this is what gave him complete relief from his own UARS symptoms), and your doctor will likely see value in my testimonial.

Of course, there should be some medical "indication" for taking a medicine. For example, my medical "indication" for being prescribed Claritin by my ENT doctor was that I had nasal inflammation, which he found upon performing a nasolaryngoscope during my office visit with him. (At that visit he gave me the usual recommendation to take the Claritin each morning, along with Flonase nasal spray. I still do in fact use the Flonase each morning, by the way; however I use the Claritin at bedtime, instead of in the morning, which was my own initiative. By-the-way, I've tried taking the 24-hr Claritin in the morning before, but found that this did not relieve my sleep-disordered breathing related symptoms the same way that taking a regular Claritin at bedtime does.)

Although I am not an ENT doctor (I'm an FP doctor), in my experience, it is quite common for me to find chronic nasal inflammation present in many different types of patients, even those who do not suffer from overt symptoms of allergic rhinitis or chronic rhinitis. I see this when I examine them and just use a basic nasoscope (not a full nasolaryngoscope, which also examines all the way down into the bottom of the throat in order to check for abnormalities with the vocal cords). My theory is that this chronic nasal mucosal inflammation which I find is so common, is due, at least in part, to the air pollution that is present in most non-rural parts of the US. Of course, Los Angeles, where I live, is one of the worst places, when it comes to air pollution/smog. However it's evident to me that there's significant air pollution present in many other cities and towns that I travel to in the US. Basically, anywhere that there are any significant numbers of cars and trucks driving around, there is going to be some degree of air pollution present there. Even though most of the time we can't see it, our gas-burning vehicles put out toxic by-products into the air that we breathe all around us. Even though air pollution is not an "allergen" per say, it can act as an inhalational irritant. And inhalational irritants can cause what is known as "inflammation" of the delicate mucous membranes of the nasal passages. This is what, I believe, happens to us as a result of air pollution, as we breathe in this largely invisible toxin throughout the day (and being indoors is not always an escape from it).

Therefore, even though a person might not be an "allergy sufferer" or even have any common symptoms of allergic rhinitis or chronic rhinitis, if a doctor examines a patient and sees evidence of chronic nasal inflammation, this would be an acceptable medical "indication" for the doctor to prescribe a non-sedating antihistamine for a patient. This was exactly my situation.

On the other hand, if you do have any common symptoms of allergic rhinitis or chronic rhinitis (those symptoms being runny nose, itchy watery eyes, sneezing, etc.) then a prescription for a non-sedating antihistamine is an automatic medical indication, regardless of whether chronic inflammation of the nasal mucosa is present or not (although it almost always is, in these cases).

Furthermore, for an individual who doesn't have any chronic rhinitis symptoms but who has sleep-disordered breathing related symptoms…and he hasn't been fully "scoped" yet by an ENT…and he STILL wants to try and give himself a trail of bedtime usage of Claritin or Zyrtec, to see if it will help to relieve his subjective symptoms of UARS or mild OSA…then he might just go and buy a box of Claritin or Zyrtec on his own, since these two meds are available over-the-counter. (I just checked Amazon.com, and saw that a box of generic Claritin, which is called Loratidine, costs $11.95 for a box of 300 tablets. The generic version should work the same as the non-generic version.) After a few nights trial of this, if his sleep-disordered breathing related symptoms are lessened or relieved, by doing this, then it would be evidence that this method works for him. If he decides to use the medicine long-term for control of his symptoms, he can then go and let his doctor know, and see if he can be given a prescription for the medicine that worked, so that he no longer has to pay for it out-of-pocket (that is, of course, if he has insurance or medicare coverage applicable to the particular prescription medication). [Sorry for the gender bias in my scenario, please substitute "she/her", as appropriate. :0)]

Regardless of how one goes about it, I still would always STRONGLY recommend that anyone with any sleep-disordered breathing related symptoms sooner-or-later (I advise sooner) go and get a thorough examination by an ENT doctor. An ENT doctor can examine you using a nasopharyngoscope and check for things such as "nasal polyps," which are sacks of fluid that can be present at the back of the nasal passageways and can cause nasal obstructive symptoms (such as a feeling of chronic nasal congestion). Nasal polyps have to be removed surgically, since they are not relieved or treatable with medications. There are other nasal obstructive conditions, as well, that an ENT doctor can find upon examination using a nasopharyngoscope, which include a deviated nasal septum or other congenital or acquired abnormalities of the inner nasal passageways, etc.

Going back to the subject of obtaining a medication via prescription versus over-the-counter….that's the nice thing about Claritin or Zyrtec - they can be obtained either over-the-counter (by purchasing them out-of-pocket) or by a prescription. Many, if not most, insurance plans cover these meds if they are obtained via prescription, I believe. (And again, the generic versions should work the same as the brand name versions.)

The third non-sedating antihistamine, Allergra, can only be obtained via a prescription. Also, the combination tablet known as Allegra-D (which is combined with the decongestant, pseudoephedrine) is only obtainable via a prescription. I find that Allegra-D works TREMENDOUSLY to provide complete relief of my sleep-disordered breathing related symptoms, when I take it at bedtime (even superior to the results that I get with Claritin at bedtime). I usually only need to take a HALF of a tablet of Allegra-D at bedtime, and I am in heaven the next day. Be aware however, as rooster pointed out on our other forum string, that the "D" part of Allegra-D, which is pseudoephedrine, can cause insomnia as a possible side-effect in some people who use it, even though I didn't experience this as a side effect. (Again, you'll need a prescription for it, so discuss it with your medical provider.) If you do decide to give Allegra-D a try, you may want to just start out with a half or three-quarters of a tablet at bedtime for a few nights, and see what results you get.

Now that all of that discussion is out of the way, I can go on to answer your question about the best way to "test" the efficacy of something such as the use of Claritin at bedtime, and/or a sleeping position, as far as its effects on symptoms related to a sleep-disordered breathing condition.

Well, there's a saying "the proof is in the pudding." If someone has typical symptoms of UARS or mild OSA, which are daytime tiredness, snoring, and/or difficulty with arising out of the bed in the morning, and if that person then goes and tries a particular remedy (such as CPAP, UPPP, or oral appliance…or even a medication at bedtime, or a different sleeping position), then the proof or the 'test' of whether that remedy is effective or not…is whether the person's symptoms the next day were relieved, or not.

Now, of course like many things, a particular remedy which we try out may NOT always work great the very first time we try it, and often a trial of several nights' usage needs to occur to really get an accurate gauge of its efficacy. (There often exists an "adjustment" period that's necessary, for a lot of remedies that we try, which don't always seem to work well at first; but then, over the course of a few days or weeks, with patience, and sometimes by making small adjustments here-and-there, we begin to see the efficacy of those remedies.)

In your particular situation, san_fran_gal, you mentioned that, quote, "I was rarely tired before using CPAP, so simply feeling rested might not work for me [as an accurate 'test' of whether or not a different remedy is actually effective or not]".

That's interesting that you DON'T have the typical UARS or mild OSA symptom of daytime tiredness. That makes me wonder how and why you were, then, ever even referred for a sleep study to receive a diagnosis, in the first place. Almost always, the way a sleep study is first obtained for a patient, is when a doctor hears the patient complain of either chronic daytime tiredness, and/or difficulty with morning arising out of bed, and/or chronic snoring related to these symptoms…and/or the report from the patient of his/her bed partner who describes episodes of "breathing cessation", or "breathing difficulties", and/or just "snoring" by the patient during the night…

If your only subjective evidence of UARS or mild OSA that you have (aside from the objective findings of your sleep study testing) is the report of a bed partner who describes episodes of your snoring or breathing cessation (or just breathing difficulty) during the night…then, your "test" of the efficacy of a new remedy that you may decide to try…might simply be to ask your bed partner to let you know if they observe any further such episodes in you at night. Additionally, you could check with your doctor and see if you could undergo another sleep study, after you've implemented the remedy/remedies, and then see if there exists any further objective findings on sleep study testing of the presence of your sleep-disordered breathing condition.

I hope that helps! Best of luck!

That's interesting that you DON'T have the typical UARS or mild OSA symptom of daytime tiredness. That makes me wonder how and why you were, then, ever even referred for a sleep study to receive a diagnosis, in the first place. Almost always, the way a sleep study is first obtained for a patient, is when a doctor hears the patient complain of either chronic daytime tiredness, and/or difficulty with morning arising out of bed, and/or chronic snoring related to these symptoms…and/or the report from the patient of his/her bed partner who describes episodes of "breathing cessation", or "breathing difficulties", and/or just "snoring" by the patient during the night…

If your only subjective evidence of UARS or mild OSA that you have (aside from the objective findings of your sleep study testing) is the report of a bed partner who describes episodes of your snoring or breathing cessation (or just breathing difficulty) during the night…then, your "test" of the efficacy of a new remedy that you may decide to try…might simply be to ask your bed partner to let you know if they observe any further such episodes in you at night. Additionally, you could check with your doctor and see if you could undergo another sleep study, after you've implemented the remedy/remedies, and then see if there exists any further objective findings on sleep study testing of the presence of your sleep-disordered breathing condition.

Falcon, thanks for the detailed response about Claritin, etc. The last two nights I've managed to get into the "Falcon Position" for a little bit (or actually a modified version of it), and it was pretty comfortable. What I found interesting was that I actually had dreams both nights -- or, more accurately, remembered dreams both nights. I haven't remembered a dream for ages! I wonder if it's coincidence, or if that position really helps facilitate getting into levels of sleep that are harder to attain in other positions.

As for how I came to get diagnosed, I had been waking up several times a night for the last few years -- since not being able to sleep on my stomach any more because of a neck issue -- with a terribly parched mouth. THAT was disruptive to sleep! I couldn't find any other reasons than possible apnea. My hubby says I don't snore and that I sleep with my mouth pretty darn closed, and I took one of those at-home hand monitor tests that turned out negative. But even though I wasn't really tired during the day, the night wakings were really hard, so I pursued it further, and was OK'd for an overnight study at the sleep center. Right around that time I bought a chin strap that seemed to take care of the nighttime dry mouth, and really helped me sleep. If I had bought that earlier, I probably wouldn't have pursued the sleep-test course.

As you can see there would be no acceptable yardsticks against which to measure my progress with sleep position and Claritin! Maybe remembering dreams and feeling extra alert?

I'm also dealing with major PLMs, but that's another story.

rooster wrote:

SuperGeeky wrote:I started seeing a correlation between the nights I took Benadryl and a substantial increase in 'Avg time in Apnea per Day'. Matter of fact, it was scary!

I would suppose it's harder for the brain to arouse during an Apnea while being sedated with Benadryl. Anyway, I ran it past the Sleep
Doctor's nurse, she confirmed as such.

Take care,

SG

In 2004 I had not yet been diagnosed with sleep apnea. On the Sunday night of Memorial Day weekend I was having a lot of trouble in bed. I knew a tablet of Benadryl would put me in a deep long sleep so I took one. The next morning when I awoke I had a big problem and my life had been dramatically changed for the worse.

Eventually I was diagnosed with severe osa, started cpap and got educated about the condition. SG, I am now convinced that on that Sunday night in 2004 I suffered significant brain damage for the reason you mention. The Benadryl prevented arousals while I experienced long, repetitive apneas that night.

This is precisely why I am so anxious to find an article in a medical journal that talks about how dangerous is to combine sleep medications with untreated apnea. I suspect much of the same dangers are present with commercial sleep meds when someone has severe OSA and is untreated. My stepfather sleeps like this EVERY NIGHT, and I think his doctor is killing him by knowingly allowing him to do this.

Falcon,

I find it really funny that this is a known position. I thought I was original! Whenever my back hurts at night, this is precisely the position I get into to go back to sleep. It's wonderful.

ciounoi,

Get your doc to write you an RX for generic claritin (loratadine) and have it filled at Walmart. $4 for 30 tablets, or $10 for 90. Hard to beat that!

Benadryl is like what Dristan did mainly sedate with a drying affect on conjestion. The problem causing the conjestion is not addressed. Sometimes they work to get to sleep and reduce conjestion but waking up at times groggy and still stuffy cancels out the benefits.

After reading about using loratine at night used the loratadine at night for 2 nights and it seemed to help as much as using Nasonex spray which costs lots more. Then tried Zyrtec at night and did not do anything. Bought Walgreens version of both loratadine and zyrtec when they were buy one get one free to try for hayfever(neither worked). Glad that I did not throw them away because I ran out of nasonex and not really into running to several specialists " $table follow up visits" for renewals of different types of prescriptions.

It looks like taking loratadine at night may do the trick if it has a short half-life in that a good percentage of it gets released in the first hours after taking it.
Singulair seems to have a short half-life and works good for preventing asthma and reducing sinus issues only if I take it 1-2 hours before breathing cold outdoor air. I wonder if singulair and loratadine are in the same class and are interchangeable (best to alternate days) and only one or the other should be taken in 24 hours or if both can be taken each at a seperate time in 24 hours for their seperate benefits? Looks like a visit to a drug interaction guide/ pharmacy is the first step in proceeding with caution. It would be cost effective and safer if the local family practice providers would be willing to prescribe more things for stable conditions but that would cut down on the $peciali$t's $table follow up vi$it income.

San_fran_gal, I'm glad to hear that you tried the sleep position ["The Falcon Position" :0) ] which I discussed and posted photos of above, and that you experienced dreams during both nights (for the first time in ages). Yes, I think your hunch is correct; in my experience, this position really does help facilitate getting into deeper levels of sleep (I think perhaps because it puts the body in such an anatomically comfortable and aligned position). Also, thanks for clarifying your history about how you were diagnosed with OSA. That's very interesting. I'm glad to hear that you were able to relieve your nighttime mouth dryness with the chin strap.


CollegeGirl, That's great to hear that you use the sleep position I described in my post above, and that you find it to be good for helping you to return back to sleep, if you wake up with your back hurting sometimes at night, after being in a different position. [It's okay that you also knew about it beforehand. We can share the naming rights! :0) ]


Guest tried username, I'm so happy to hear that you experienced good results during the two nights which you took Loratidine at bedtime, and also that this may end up being a less costly way for you to go, compared to using Nasonex at night.

Thanks also for describing your experience with trying Zyrtec, as well, at bedtime, and for mentioning that it did not relieve your symptoms. Yes, that was my finding also - the Zyrtec did not relieve my sleep-disordered breathing related symptoms when I took it at bedtime (I gave it a trial over the course of several nights). Neither did plain Allegra, when I tried it. What does work for me, is taking either Claritin/Loratidine (1 tablet) at bedtime, or Allegra-D (1/2 tablet) at bedtime.

However, I find that different people have various manners of responding (or not responding) to the three different non-sedating antihistamines (Claritin, Zyrtec, Allegra), as well as Allegra-D. That's why I usually mention all three in my discussions, as well as Allegra-D, so that people can know that there are some different choices available; in case they try one of the three and don't get relieve from that one - they can always go and try the remaining choices, and may perhaps get better results with one of the other ones.

In regards to your question about Singulair, and whether or not it would interact adversely with Loratidine/Claritin….Singulair is in a different drug class than Loratidine/Claritin, and there is no known adverse interactions by taking the two simultaneously, or within the same half of the day, or within the same 24 hour period, as far as I can see, based upon a literature search.

Loratidine is, of course, in the non-sedating antihistamine class of drugs, and Singulair (Montelukast) is in the Leukotriene-Receptor Antagonist class of medications. Both have different mechanisms of action from each other. (Check with your doctor, of course, when taking any medications.)

As you mentioned, you found Singulair to be good for asthma and reducing sinus issues, if you take it 1-2 hours before breathing cold outdoor air.

I once tried Singulair myself, at bedtime, over the course of a few nights, as an experiment. I wanted to see if Singulair would help relieve my sleep-disordered breathing symptoms (the way that Claritin does or Allegra-D does). However, I didn't experience any relief of my sleep-disordered breathing symptoms during this trial of taking Singulair at bedtime. (Many people with asthma, which I don't have, take Singulair at bedtime; but it usually is taken at bedtime for the purpose of relieving asthma symptoms the following day. This is a standard approach.)

Guest tried username,

By the way, if you're getting good symptomatic relief from Nasonex for your nighttime stuffiness, you may want to consider STAYING with that medication, instead of switching over to Loratidine (Claritin).

Although it sounds like a bit of a hassle you're experiencing trying to obtain medication renewals, by having to go back to see the 'Specialist' each time you need a prescription renewal for Nasonex. Perhaps you can discuss this with your Primary Care provider, and he/she would be willing to give you prescription renewals for Nasonex each time you need them, knowing that this medicine was already initially prescribed for you by the Specialist.

I personally would prefer to use a topically applied medication (e.g., Nasonex - a nasal steroid) versus an oral tablet (e.g., Claritin - a non-sedating antihistamine), if both worked equally as well, and if it was only the cost/price that was different about them. The reason for this preference is because an oral tablet has the 'potential' for more systemic side-effects (for example, the metabolic components of Claritin must be broken down and excreted by the liver). This means the side-effects of an orally ingested medication could potentially affect different organs or systems within the body; that is, if you were to have any side-effects at all even (for example, either acutely, or after chronic, long-term usage). This is in comparison to a 'topically applied medication,' which would ordinarily only be able to cause potential side-effects at the site of application (e.g., the nasal mucosa).

The nasal steroids (like Flonase and Nasonex) are generally well-tolerated and most people don't experience side-effects from them (e.g., harm to the nasal mucosa, etc). Also, the non-sedating antihistamine pills (like Claritin, etc) are generally well tolerated. However, there are more reports of various side-effects with these pills, compared to the nasally applied steroid sprays. (You can find a list of all the potential side-effects from medications by doing a search on the internet.)

Also, CorgiGirl mentioned a newer medication called "Astelin", which is a topically applied antihistamine, on the following excellent thread/discussion: viewtopic/t36483/newbie-clogged-nose-ergo-apnea.html

By the way 'topically applied antihistamine' means that it is a spray that you apply in the nose to each nostril.

I'm curious to give Astelin a try myself. That sounds very intriguing - an antihistamine that's now available in a nasal spray format!

Usually, nasal spray medications for chronic rhinitis/nasal inflammation have only been things like nasal steroids (e.g., Flonase, Nasonex) and nasal decongestants (e.g., Afrin - which can cause rebound congestion if used for more than three days in a row).

Since Astelin is not a nasal decongestant (it's an anti-histamine), it won't cause rebound congestion as a side-effect.

Also, I might give Nasonex a trial usage as well - the medication which has worked well for you. Thanks for letting us know your experience with this.

Regards.

PS: You asked about the half-life elimination time for Loratidine. It is 12 - 15 hours, according to the literature. That's referring to regular version of Loratidine; not the extended release (24-hr) version of Loratidine/Claritin. Patients' actual subjective experience of the effects of Loratidine/Claritin may vary widely, however. For example, you may perhaps no longer feel any effects of the medicine at all, after 5, 6, 8, or 10 hours. Others may experience a different length of time of effects than you. Much of it is very subjective, for many types of medications. The half-line elimination time for Singulair, for comparison, is 2.7 - 5.5 hours, according to the literature.

Benadryl has made my leg jerks at night much much worse. Although it does help me sleep. Just be careful and make sure it if helping you feel better and not worse.