Input on lack of results

izzyb · Post by **izzyb** » Fri Mar 07, 2008 9:59 am

My guess is you're not feeling the effect of the treatment because you are having apneas.

The machine only records apneas when the air flow changes due to obstructions. But with mouthleaks, your machine doesn't "see" the obstructions you're having and can't report them.

O.

I feel really dumb here. I don't get what you are saying. I get that an obstruction causes an apnea and it registers. So, if I am having apneas because of a leak, which means the air isn't keeping my throat open, then isn't that an obstruction which should register? Why would it matter why I am obstructed?

izzyb

DreamStalker · Post by **DreamStalker** » Fri Mar 07, 2008 10:35 am

izzyb wrote:My guess is you're not feeling the effect of the treatment because you are having apneas.

The machine only records apneas when the air flow changes due to obstructions. But with mouthleaks, your machine doesn't "see" the obstructions you're having and can't report them.

O.

I feel really dumb here. I don't get what you are saying. I get that an obstruction causes an apnea and it registers. So, if I am having apneas because of a leak, which means the air isn't keeping my throat open, then isn't that an obstruction which should register? Why would it matter why I am obstructed?

izzyb

If air is leaking out your mouth, the system is no longer closed ... there is no feed back to the machine sensor to register the apnea or the feed back that it does get is incorrect.

ozij · Post by **ozij** » Fri Mar 07, 2008 11:03 am

"Apnea" literaly means "not breathing.

Your throat slams shut because that's what it does it really doesn't matter why. You're not breathing.

Your mouth drops open.

The pressurized air is pouring out of you mouth instead of building up against the obstruction.

The machine's sensor does not know you've stopped breathing and it does not register the apnea you are having.

But you're having them. With you mouth open, you are not getting the pressure necessary to to keep your airway open. With your mouth open, the machine's sesnsor does not register the breathing interruptions (aks apneas) you are having.

O.

izzyb · Post by **izzyb** » Fri Mar 07, 2008 11:06 am

Snooze Blues,

Oh I know that exercising and losing weight will cure everything (I'm not being a smart aleck - I think it just about will). If I could do that, I wouldn't be here. The problem is I have no willpower to actually do those things. It is a vicious circle. I have had Psych 101 and Abnormal Psychology in college so I know how the brain works physically and mentally, and I've certainly read enough about behavior, depression, and how to be physically fit and healthy to give seminars. Just can't do it.

But it is nice to hear from someone else who suffers from the same affliction as I do. And it is great that you are managing to do something about it and that you have found someone. I am 49 and have been divorced for seven years. I had 2 dates (same person) right after the divorce and before I got real fat (I was still overweight at the time and he wasn't that great of a catch). Nothing since, but I don't want "a man". There are rare moments when I wish I had a companion to talk to and share things with, but I have absolutely no desire to really be part of a couple. It is more trouble than it is worth. I like not having to consider someone else's wishes and feelings. Call me selfish, but I barely have enough energy to get myself through the workday and skate by on what I have to do at home, let alone worry about someone else. And even if I did, there is no way that I would even entertain the thought of trying to attract someone at this weight. It is over for me.

I just want to lose some weight and not be tired. I know - it is connected.

Sorry, I am just rambling. Thanks for the input.

izzyb

izzyb · Post by **izzyb** » Fri Mar 07, 2008 11:12 am

Dream Stalker and Ozij, so, does that mean that since the air is going somewhere (anywhere) the machine thinks there is no apnea and everything is okay, and that the machine is not actually registering the obstruction, but the air flow?

izzyb

ozij · Post by **ozij** » Fri Mar 07, 2008 11:14 am

Yes.

O.

izzyb · Post by **izzyb** » Fri Mar 07, 2008 12:32 pm

By George I've got it!

izzyb

BarryKaraoke · Post by **BarryKaraoke** » Fri Mar 07, 2008 12:59 pm

izzyb wrote:By George I've got it!

izzyb

Think of it as a false negative.

It's like a badly insulated house leaking through every crack (mouth), yet your thermostat (CPAP) says everything is fine at 70 degrees. You only realize the problem when you get the fuel bill (still tired).

OK, that was a terrible analogy, I admit.

DreamStalker · Post by **DreamStalker** » Fri Mar 07, 2008 1:01 pm

That was a good analogy!

Nodzy · Post by **Nodzy** » Fri Mar 07, 2008 1:44 pm

Barry....
That analogy made it easy for even me to understand.

Thanks.... LOLOLOL... and so true.

Nodzy

Snooze_Blues · Post by **Snooze_Blues** » Fri Mar 07, 2008 4:58 pm

izzyb wrote:Snooze Blues,

Oh I know that exercising and losing weight will cure everything (I'm not being a smart aleck - I think it just about will). If I could do that, I wouldn't be here. The problem is I have no willpower to actually do those things. It is a vicious circle. ... Just can't do it.

... And even if I did, there is no way that I would even entertain the thought of trying to attract someone at this weight. It is over for me.

I just want to lose some weight and not be tired. I know - it is connected.

Sorry, I am just rambling. Thanks for the input.

izzyb

Sorry if I sounded preachy or condescending. Didn't mean for that post to get so carried away either. I thought twice about posting it, but once I wrote it I figured what the heck, maybe one pellet of the shotgun blast would hit the target.

Here I go again...

Being large doesn't make you ineligible, or unlovable, at least not with the right person. I have a brother who is probably around 320 lbs, maybe more, it's been a while since I've seen him. He told me he'd tried all the diets, that he's always been fat, and that he will always be fat. He's alright with it, for now anyway, but people do change their minds. He is also very happily married to the sweetest lady who is also large with one child who looks like a chip-n-dale model. Don't ask me how. I think he has an occasional dip into the abyss, but he would never mention it to me. That's our family creed. I also know his large wife is an important source of strength and happiness for him, and he for her. So I don't believe it is ever too late. I'm glad you are keeping the door open to companionship. I think that is a wise focus and attainable. I never wanted to be married myself, but after we moved in together, my mother-in-law just wouldn't let up until I was.

When I am really down I try to look no farther than today or tomorrow or I'll get completely overwhelmed. The same way you are sounding if I'm reading your posts right. If I can get myself out of bed and set just one little goal, one that I know I can attain (like take a shower and get dressed), I feel a bit better, and if the planets are aligned just right, I may set a second, similarly small goal (like getting out and doing something I know I always enjoy), and sometimes that can get me going. Other times, you know the drill.

I hope fixing the CPAP leaks reduces your apnea and gives you a jump start. I believe you will find "hope" somewhere if you keep your eyes pealed and catch a break or two. I don't believe it is over for you, although I know there is probably no way to convince you of that if you're being flooded with negative feelings.

izzyb · Post by **izzyb** » Sun Mar 09, 2008 6:56 am

Snooze Blues, no problem. I know you were just trying to help. I hope I didn't sound too defensive.

izzyb

izzyb · Post by **izzyb** » Sun Mar 09, 2008 7:04 am

I have another question about leaks and AHI readings.

Now that I know that the AHIs that are resgistering are not due to excessive mask leaks, it got me to wondering about the AHIs that are registered. If everything is working properly - no mask leaks and the pressure is doing its job of keeping the airway open, then what is going wrong when an apnea occurs and it is registered? From what I have learned from this thread about how apneas occuring during leaks are not registered, I assume that the ones that are registered are happening because the pressure is not doing its job by keeping the airway open and the air has stopped flowing. Why would this be happening? Is it an obstruction that is more stubborn than a person's average obstruction - one that the current pressure just can't open? And would this mean the pressure is not set high enough, or is it impossible to "catch" them all?

izzyb

Wulfman · Post by **Wulfman** » Sun Mar 09, 2008 12:05 pm

izzyb wrote:I have another question about leaks and AHI readings.

Now that I know that the AHIs that are resgistering are not due to excessive mask leaks, it got me to wondering about the AHIs that are registered. If everything is working properly - no mask leaks and the pressure is doing its job of keeping the airway open, then what is going wrong when an apnea occurs and it is registered? From what I have learned from this thread about how apneas occuring during leaks are not registered, I assume that the ones that are registered are happening because the pressure is not doing its job by keeping the airway open and the air has stopped flowing. Why would this be happening? Is it an obstruction that is more stubborn than a person's average obstruction - one that the current pressure just can't open? And would this mean the pressure is not set high enough, or is it impossible to "catch" them all?

izzyb

Basically, any or all of the above.

It's pretty hard for the machines to get them all. If too many get through, then a person needs to address their pressure settings and try to adjust accordingly.

Den

izzyb · Post by **izzyb** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 9:59 am

I rechecked what the leak rate chart says and at my inhalation (16) it should be 32.3 and at my exhalation (11) it should be 26.7. I'm not sure which I should go by - maybe a happy medium? Anyway mine averages around 40. I am assuming anything over the chart rate means it is leaking somewhere it shouldn't be leaking. Is it okay or expected to be a little over the chart rate? Does anyone know if my average of 40 is really bad? I really don't feel as if I have a leak in my mask. I don't know where to go from here.

izzyb