Missing Data Again

xyz · Post by **xyz** » Sun Apr 27, 2008 1:41 pm

> I know that if I take it out too soon, it loses data.

I take my card out around 1 hr after I get up. I have never lost data. I doubt that this is the problem. Something else is going on.

I read and format the card daily.

My guess is that formating the card after you read it (regardless of how often you read it) eliminates most problems. http://www.mycap.org

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Mon Oct 20, 2008 8:32 pm

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=35412&p=304177&hilit=data#p304177

Guest wrote:
feeling_better wrote: ... My method of a remote switch turned to have problems with data loss in the card:
Maybe you should document that here
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=27310&st=0&sk=t&sd=a
for those wondering why they are missing data.

GumbyCT · Post by **GumbyCT** » Thu Jan 15, 2009 3:38 pm

Using a recently formatted card my page count went down to 11 then 10 and sure enuff I have missing detailed data once again. I was careful not to have more than 1 session each day. The compliance data is there for the days there is no detailed data, so the machine was ON & recording.

I think someone here once said they thought it might be the number of hours recorded. I now think the tripping point may be 10 hrs. I only hope it's not less.

Who knows how Respironics stores the excess data when they have more than 1 session each day or when the session exceeds 8 hrs.?

GumbyCT · Post by **GumbyCT** » Thu Jan 15, 2009 10:13 pm

So to be complete it also looks like a session longer than 10hrs may also contribute to data loss or missing detailed daily data.

Found this in another post but will add it here -

Referring to Missing data -

It's been narrowed down to "too many sessions" in one day. Meaning more than 3 sessions.
What defines a session? Wulfman has some posts on here that tell what defines a session.

In summary they incl.-
Any time the card is removed from the machine.
Any power interruption, incl. turning power to machine OFF begins a new session when power is restored.
Any break (period of non-use) of 59 minutes or more. Meaning naps or power interruptions.

Yes, the machine has an internal clock.
btw- Encore defines a day from noon-to-noon unless you've changed it. So any naps after noon WILL be recorded BEFORE the evening sleep session just gets moved to compliance (w/o details).

ALL will end the current session and begin a new one when the machines starts again. For some reason the info is carried to compliance data - so you can tell the machine was used but you NOT will get any detailed data.

<snip>

This problem is believed to be in the M series firmware not your software or the older 'classic tanks' firmware.
Some say formatting helps but if you avoid more than 3 sessions each day you can accomplish the same results.

If you search you can/will find many more discussions on missing data, with examples.
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=27310&p=243092&hilit=#p243092

Begin Detailed Discussion here -
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=27310

HTH

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=34890&p=298948
So to be complete it also looks like a session longer than 10hrs may also contribute to data loss or missing detailed daily data.

GumbyCT · Post by **GumbyCT** » Sat Jan 17, 2009 6:00 pm

To be clear - I haven't been sleeping more than 10hrs but since learning how the sessions work, when I do get up I sometimes watch the time to make sure if I am going to return I do so within 59 min. Thinking I wouldn't create another session causing data loss but which resulted in the increased session length and increased amount of data and also caused data loss, I guess.

Kinda strange the way Respironics chose to handle the data storage, vaporizing the new data in favor of the old.

That's my theory anyway.

DoriC · Post by **DoriC** » Sun Jan 18, 2009 7:30 pm

I was losing data every 7 days or so at the beginning until I started to format my card every Sunday AM and no more lost data since until last night. I think it's because my husband 's sessions are now 9-10 hrs since he's been sleeping better and because it's colder now and he stays in bed longer even if not fully asleep. I guess I'll try formatting the card every 6 days instead of 7 and see if that makes a difference. I called Respironics about this some time ago and was politely told "we are aware of the problem and are working on it".

GumbyCT · Post by **GumbyCT** » Wed Nov 11, 2009 6:46 pm

GumbyCT wrote:So to be complete it also looks like a session longer than 10hrs may also contribute to data loss or missing detailed daily data.

Found this in another post but will add it here -

Referring to Missing data -
It's been narrowed down to "too many sessions" in one day. Meaning more than 3 sessions.
What defines a session? Wulfman has some posts on here that tell what defines a session.

In summary they incl.-
Any time the card is removed from the machine.
Any power interruption, incl. turning power to machine OFF begins a new session when power is restored.
Any break (period of non-use) of 59 minutes or more. Meaning naps or power interruptions.

Yes, the machine has an internal clock.
btw- Encore defines a day from noon-to-noon unless you've changed it. So any naps after noon WILL be recorded BEFORE the evening sleep session just gets moved to compliance (w/o details).

ALL will end the current session and begin a new one when the machines starts again. For some reason the info is carried to compliance data - so you can tell the machine was used but you NOT will get any detailed data.

<snip>

This problem is believed to be in the M series firmware not your software or the older 'classic tanks' firmware.
Some say formatting helps but if you avoid more than 3 sessions each day you can accomplish the same results.

If you search you can/will find many more discussions on missing data, with examples.
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=27310&p=243092&hilit=#p243092

Begin Detailed Discussion here -
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=27310

HTH
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=34890&p=298948
So to be complete it also looks like a session longer than 10hrs may also contribute to data loss or missing detailed daily data.

GumbyCT wrote:
mindy wrote:Somehow I would guess that the way it apportions space on the card and then the way it writes, if we have a longer night, it can't quite figure out how to fit in the data and so it gets lost. How's that for a scientific explanation!!!
I have been told the card has a limitation - of 3 sessions during a 24hr period. I don't know what defines a session. I do know the default period is from 12 noon to 12 noon. That really messes with my thinking so I changed mine to a normal 24 hr period = midnite - midnite. Now my days are the same as Encore's - YAHOO!!! We are now on the same page.

From what I understand - if more than 3 sessions are attempted - the 4th or later sessions simply will NOT be recorded. This should NOT be considered lost or missing data. If someone knows any differently - kindly step up.

I do NOT erase my card daily - so my success can NOT be any daily erasures. However, I have been powering the machine OFF, which I believe has been contributing to my success, lately.

Nelson & Mindy -
I don't know how either of you could say that the daily data erasures are working when you are doing other things that could be the reason. Not too scientific, eh!

My suggestion is to stop turning the power OFF but continue with the daily data erasures. You need to eliminate other variables. The card can be removed from the machine while still plugged in to AC power but with the blower OFF. Which I believe is how many of us have been removing the card.

So give that a try if you will please and let us know how you are making out.
Thanks,
GumbyCT

UPDATE: I have experienced Missing Daily Data again several more times since the last post here and just wanted to share a few more things I believe to be true for my machine - BiPap Auto M Series firmware 4.03

The BiPap will create more data and will likely lose data before other M series machines w/ver. 4.03
That may be the reason I start loosing daily details when any session exceeds 8hrs, I mean by even 1 minute. The data loss doesn't occur until 4 days after the 8hr session.

So what I've started doing (when I can remember) is simply removing the card momentarily when I get up for a bathroom trip. Removing and reinserting the card starts another session and seems to prevent this data loss.

If I forget and go over 8hrs, I try to use many more short sessions to force this larger session off the card. And now noticed that I had some days with 4 sessions. I didn't persue this any more but just made a mental note that I exceeded the 3 daily sessions which was thought to be a limit before.

GumbyCT · Post by **GumbyCT** » Thu Nov 12, 2009 7:22 pm

fwiw - there were 4 sessions recorded on my card yesterday with NO data loss. I haven't tried to get any more at this point. So I guess it may depend on the size of the data recorded by the session.

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