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DME Police wrote:Dearest Guest,

A CPAP is worth a million bucks if you have sleep apnea and you can't get one cheaper. Unfortunately, they do sell for less. The patients seem to think they have something to say about pricing. They seem adverse to paying more than is necessary to acquire the equipment. Fortunately the DMEs and manufacturers will hold the line. I will see to it.

DME Police

Well dont expect the advantages of a brick and mortar DME if you dont want to pay for their extra services (or at least the ones they should supply). If selling a machine for 5% profit isnt compatible with their business model, then how should they take a loss just for you to come piss and moan about their pricing?

Anonymous wrote:
Well dont expect the advantages of a brick and mortar DME if you dont want to pay for their extra services (or at least the ones they should supply). If selling a machine for 5% profit isnt compatible with their business model, then how should they take a loss just for you to come piss and moan about their pricing?

Somehow, I can imagine the defense contractor using this argument on the Army as it was selling them the $700 toilet seat.

Perchancetodream wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Well dont expect the advantages of a brick and mortar DME if you dont want to pay for their extra services (or at least the ones they should supply). If selling a machine for 5% profit isnt compatible with their business model, then how should they take a loss just for you to come piss and moan about their pricing?

Somehow, I can imagine the defense contractor using this argument on the Army as it was selling them the $700 toilet seat.

they have better margins I'm sure, but if your insurance company has a contract for $XYZ for this machine, along with it is the assumption the DME is going to follow up and monitor your treatment, provide feedback and alter the course of treatment. To me, that's always been the numbers game. The insurance company reimburses a higher amount so the DME can afford to pay someone to help keep you on course, help you with your treatment.

Isn't that the advantage for insurance companies? They treat your apnea now, so they're not paying for other problems down the line with your heart, IDDM, HTN, anything...

I wasn't referring to the insurance companies.

Has it occurred to you yet that the reason most of us are here is that the local DMEs are not providing any services for us to take advantage of? And that has a result we tend to be a bit bitter at what, since no service is provided, is an exorbitant profit? And that in order to insure that profit a major manufacturer is now requiring online dealers who are not expected to provide any services to charge the same dollar amount to the patient?

And please, enough of the there are some bad apples out there excuse. Unfortunately, those bad apples leave a mighty unpleasant aftertaste, especially when they become nationwide DME networks.

Perchancetodream wrote:I wasn't referring to the insurance companies.

Has it occurred to you yet that the reason most of us are here is that the local DMEs are not providing any services for us to take advantage of? And that has a result we tend to be a bit bitter at what, since no service is provided, is an exorbitant profit? And that in order to insure that profit a major manufacturer is now requiring online dealers who are not expected to provide any services to charge the same dollar amount to the patient?

And please, enough of the there are some bad apples out there excuse. Unfortunately, those bad apples leave a mighty unpleasant aftertaste, especially when they become nationwide DME networks.
_________________

I'll concede that point, and agree our local Apria is frustrating... Being that this is not a randomly selected population of the XPAP nation, I'm here to provide the ''devil's advocate'' point of view, even if just a gentle reminder that an entitlement mentality isn't sexy or becoming.

In case people don't want to wade through 3 pages to figure out what's going on, I'll sum up the conversation and provide the formula that's used to construct these threads in the future so we can all save a little bit of time.

Step 1: Propose that a given CPAP manufacturer makes overpriced crap.
Step 2: Have a few people to support your position.
Step 3: Post an anonymous defence of said company because "they're just looking out for their business interests."
Step 4: Lament the fact that the healthcare industry is an industry and really couldn't care less about you or your perceived difficulty to afford their products.
Step 5: Recount the history of these conversations in the past and how little has changed since the last discussion.
Step 6: Attack the person that posted anonymously for not owning up to their comments.
Step 7: Enjoy the sudden resurgence of more guest posters supporting both positions. Declare all out war.

...snip for brevity...

Step 3240: Post a sarcastic and annoying post psychoanalysing the rest of the thread and unduly judging everyone in the thread.
Step 3241 (yet to occur): Attack this poster for complaining about the fact that people complain about other people.

Anyway, if you're wondering what my point is then here you go. Resmed does what they do. If you don't like it, fine. I don't. It's like any other company/product/service. I don't think Resmed is committing outright fraud. In that case you may not like what they're doing but it's not wrong. If you don't like their products, policies, or prices, then DON'T BUY THEM. Fine. No worries. End of story.

If you DO think what they're doing is wrong, then work on legal policies to make their behaviour legally wrong. Personally I don't want the government deciding much about what I pay for things or how I buy them. I can abstain from buying Resmed all by myself with no help from the government.

Yes yes, DMEs convolute the whole process. Anyway, I'm just trying to say it's not worth getting this upset over. Buy Respironics or Resmed as your inclinations lie and move on.

And still didn't answer either on of my questions........

“I can abstain from buying Resmed all by myself with no help from the government.”

Me, too. But that doesn’t mean squat to Resmed. Or to Respironics.

There is no meaningful competition in the manufacture of XPAP. And now the manufacturers are taking steps to stamp out any hint of competition in the retail sale of their products. Google “oligopoly.”

The only solution is to enact laws restricting the manufacturers’ (so far successful) efforts to eliminate competition in their industries.

Wayne

blarg wrote:In case people don't want to wade through 3 pages to figure out what's going on, I'll sum up the conversation and provide the formula that's used to construct these threads in the future so we can all save a little bit of time.

blarg wrote:In case people don't want to wade through 3 pages to figure out what's going on, I'll sum up the conversation and provide the formula that's used to construct these threads in the future so we can all save a little bit of time.

Thanks for your apt and enlightening thread formula summary. It should save me some time in the future. I'll make it a point not to respond courteously, or with relevant logical facts easily reduced to "blah blah blah", in these formula threads.

I now see I was approaching things from the wrong perspective. Erroneously imagining I might influence personal positions deeply entrenched in narrow life experience and the continued pursuit of personal monetary enrichment.

I appreciate you pointing out my error in assumption, and the predictable sequela of inbred cultural group-think, but how politics entered into the discussion yet remains a mystery, and is notably absent your formula, unless it might fall under "declare all out war". but I think I'll simply chalk it up to personal axes to grind and hidden agendas from anonymous posters, slash, trolls. That usually isn't far off the mark in most forums.

rested gal wrote:

blarg wrote:In case people don't want to wade through 3 pages to figure out what's going on, I'll sum up the conversation and provide the formula that's used to construct these threads in the future so we can all save a little bit of time.

Great Picture!!!!


Thanks,
Susan

Perchancetodream wrote:Great Picture!!!!


Thanks,
Susan

heheh, well, first time I ever saw it, blarg put it into a thread. So, I just had to dig it out.

Snooze_Blues wrote:

blarg wrote:In case people don't want to wade through 3 pages to figure out what's going on, I'll sum up the conversation and provide the formula that's used to construct these threads in the future so we can all save a little bit of time.

Thanks for your apt and enlightening thread formula summary. It should save me some time in the future. I'll make it a point not to respond courteously, or with relevant logical facts easily reduced to "blah blah blah", in these formula threads.

I now see I was approaching things from the wrong perspective. Erroneously imagining I might influence personal positions deeply entrenched in narrow life experience and the continued pursuit of personal monetary enrichment.

I appreciate you pointing out my error in assumption, and the predictable sequela of inbred cultural group-think, but how politics entered into the discussion yet remains a mystery, and is notably absent your formula, unless it might fall under "declare all out war". but I think I'll simply chalk it up to personal axes to grind and hidden agendas from anonymous posters, slash, trolls. That usually isn't far off the mark in most forums.[/quote

Yeah, that's it... corporations = bad, consumers = good. I am a pawn of big corporations...

Anonymous wrote: I am a pawn of big corporations...

I knew I'd get you to confess.

rested gal wrote:heheh, well, first time I ever saw it, blarg put it into a thread. So, I just had to dig it out.

You're amazing.