The results are in - I'm ANGRY at my Doc...
The results are in - I'm ANGRY at my Doc...
OK, so after waiting three weeks for the results of the test, I go see the doc.
"I'm kinda puzzled by the results of the test, Tom?"
Really? how?
"Well, you don't have apnea. In the five hours from when you entered sleep until you were woken up, you only had 12 episodes of OSA or hypopnea."
OK, why was I so tired, then?
"Well, your snoring woke you up 56 times. Your grand total of arousals was 80 during the five hour period."
Great. So, I'm waking up an average of 16 times an hour. Now what?
"Well, how about a tonsilectomy?"
Weren't you the guy who said everthing was normal when I came in the end of March?
"Yeah. And, I really want to be very conservative. Maybe the operation isn't the way to go."
Won't a CPAP help?
"Uhhh, not quite sure. Let me give you the number of a sleep specialist you can visit."
Uhhh, don't you guys advertise that you handle sleep issues?
"Yeah, but we're not sleep 'Specialists'"
GRRRRRRR.....
So, now I have an appointment with a 'sleep specialist' on May 18, a 30 day supply of Ambien (had to beg it out of him) and a chip on my shoulder the size of Wisconsin.
I thought CPAPs could treat snoring?
Take off you hoseheads!
---- Bob McKenzie (Strange Brew - 1983)
Remstar Auto with CFlex (5 - 15)
Swift Mask with Medium Nasal Pillows
---- Bob McKenzie (Strange Brew - 1983)
Remstar Auto with CFlex (5 - 15)
Swift Mask with Medium Nasal Pillows
Gosh, Tampa Tom,
If this is the script of your life, I'd say find another movie!!
Wow. The word moron seems to fit. The doctor should have sent you to a "specialist" right off. My primary care physician did that, maybe not right off, but he never presumed to understand OSA enough to be the doctor of choice. I blame him for lots, but for this I am extremely grateful.
You have every right to be angry. If you throw something, aim at the "good" doctor.
Is this "specialist" one HE recommended? Maybe you should get another recommendation or something.
Your story makes me so angry as well.
And here I was waiting for good news, any news, clear and decisive news, from you and the doc. Keep us posted. Hopefully the rest of this script isn't of a soap opera (or a horror flick). Good luck.
Linda
If this is the script of your life, I'd say find another movie!!
Wow. The word moron seems to fit. The doctor should have sent you to a "specialist" right off. My primary care physician did that, maybe not right off, but he never presumed to understand OSA enough to be the doctor of choice. I blame him for lots, but for this I am extremely grateful.
You have every right to be angry. If you throw something, aim at the "good" doctor.
Is this "specialist" one HE recommended? Maybe you should get another recommendation or something.
Your story makes me so angry as well.
And here I was waiting for good news, any news, clear and decisive news, from you and the doc. Keep us posted. Hopefully the rest of this script isn't of a soap opera (or a horror flick). Good luck.
Linda
Hi Tampa Tom,
Just want to expand a little on what Linda said about the recommended sleep specialist.
If I knew then what I know now about my sleep Doc I would have arranged to see someone else. The referred Doc may be just fine, but I would check him out as much as you can before you commit.
There must be online profiles you can view as a minimum. From there I would try to find out what he normally prescribes for garden variety Apnea, which DME he would refer you to ( and check them out as well ), if you can order equipment on-line and if in fact you have treatable Apnea will he prescribe a unit ie APAP of your choice.
My recommendation to anyone seeing a sleep specialist for the first time would be to find out everything you can about the process - start to finish. Then run it by this forum to see if it rings clear. Do make sure the specialist reviews the completed tests and compare his take on what your current Doc said.
Take a deep breath and relax, there have been horror stories worse than yours posted here. And the good news - the longer it takes, providing you're still with us, the better chance you have of getting the very lates technology.
All the best.
Bob F
Just want to expand a little on what Linda said about the recommended sleep specialist.
If I knew then what I know now about my sleep Doc I would have arranged to see someone else. The referred Doc may be just fine, but I would check him out as much as you can before you commit.
There must be online profiles you can view as a minimum. From there I would try to find out what he normally prescribes for garden variety Apnea, which DME he would refer you to ( and check them out as well ), if you can order equipment on-line and if in fact you have treatable Apnea will he prescribe a unit ie APAP of your choice.
My recommendation to anyone seeing a sleep specialist for the first time would be to find out everything you can about the process - start to finish. Then run it by this forum to see if it rings clear. Do make sure the specialist reviews the completed tests and compare his take on what your current Doc said.
Take a deep breath and relax, there have been horror stories worse than yours posted here. And the good news - the longer it takes, providing you're still with us, the better chance you have of getting the very lates technology.
All the best.
Bob F
unclebob
Unclebob is oh so wise.
There is so much to consider, and frankly we need to make those physicians answer these questions, demand it. Easier said than done, sometimes.
Even with a good specialist, you have to be pushy (again, easier said than done when feeling particularly vulnerable and miserable). And if they don't seem right for you, chuck 'em. (again ESTD, for some insurance companies don't take kindly to too many referrals)
My pulminory "specialist" who indeed seems to be so, is a weird bird. God help you if you are a woman under his condenscending and groping care! He went over the results of my sleep study report, showed me the paper and everything. At the end, I rummaged for that pen I intended to bring, but I'd forgotten it. He was HOLDING a pen. I asked to borrow it to quickly jot down a couple of the numbers. He hesitated and looked at me like I'd just asked for his kidney! He didn't want me touching his pen! After his long pause, I said, pointedly and with the beginnings of anger, "OR, you can give me a copy of the report!!!"
He hesitated then too. He clearly didn't want to give me a copy of my report OR let me borrow his pen. But presented with a choice, the turd actually chose to give me a copy, begrudgingly. Did he think I was going to give his pen cooties??!
You may luck out and get a great personable doctor. God, I hope you do. But hold them all accountable. You deserve answers, you deserve a copy of that sleep study, and you deserve to be treated with respect, or at least the same as someone with any other disorder.
Wish I'd taken Unclebob's advice back when. Life might have been a whole lot easier!!
Linda,
ranting
There is so much to consider, and frankly we need to make those physicians answer these questions, demand it. Easier said than done, sometimes.
Even with a good specialist, you have to be pushy (again, easier said than done when feeling particularly vulnerable and miserable). And if they don't seem right for you, chuck 'em. (again ESTD, for some insurance companies don't take kindly to too many referrals)
My pulminory "specialist" who indeed seems to be so, is a weird bird. God help you if you are a woman under his condenscending and groping care! He went over the results of my sleep study report, showed me the paper and everything. At the end, I rummaged for that pen I intended to bring, but I'd forgotten it. He was HOLDING a pen. I asked to borrow it to quickly jot down a couple of the numbers. He hesitated and looked at me like I'd just asked for his kidney! He didn't want me touching his pen! After his long pause, I said, pointedly and with the beginnings of anger, "OR, you can give me a copy of the report!!!"
He hesitated then too. He clearly didn't want to give me a copy of my report OR let me borrow his pen. But presented with a choice, the turd actually chose to give me a copy, begrudgingly. Did he think I was going to give his pen cooties??!
You may luck out and get a great personable doctor. God, I hope you do. But hold them all accountable. You deserve answers, you deserve a copy of that sleep study, and you deserve to be treated with respect, or at least the same as someone with any other disorder.
Wish I'd taken Unclebob's advice back when. Life might have been a whole lot easier!!
Linda,
ranting
unclebob wrote:Hi Tampa Tom,
If I knew then what I know now about my sleep Doc I would have arranged to see someone else. The referred Doc may be just fine, but I would check him out as much as you can before you commit.
Hey Tom,
Always listen to your Uncle.
The best way for us laypeople to determine if a sleep "specialist" is really qualified is to ask if he or she is "Board Certified".
I too live in Florida also and our fair state, like others, gives written examinations to specialist doctors to "certify" that they have been tested and known to possess a measured high degree of knowledge in their specialty that other doctors in that specialty do not possess. Or at least, were not willing to be so tested. If that certification test was easy, all doctors would at least try. You can bet it is as tough a test as doctors EVER take.
Ask the simple question when you call their offices, "Is this doctor Board Certified in his specialty" and ""how long has he specialized in treating sleep disorders." Be careful about the last question. If your referred doctor has "been board certified since the beginning of time", he may be too old to remember what he reads.
You have the rest of your life ahead of you, so don't get too upset about another month or two. Be absolutely certain your next doctor is good enough so you do not have to change again.
Best of luck to you, my friend.
Andy
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ChicagoCpap
- Posts: 6
- Joined: Tue Apr 26, 2005 9:13 am
- Location: Chicago, IL
... and remember, don't worry about hurting anyone's feelings... this is your LIFE that you are concerned about.
I find all-too-often that Doctors forget who they work for... US... we are the consumer, they are the providers... they work for us. Be as pushy as you can. We want you around giving us your two year report of the CPAP machine!
-mark
I find all-too-often that Doctors forget who they work for... US... we are the consumer, they are the providers... they work for us. Be as pushy as you can. We want you around giving us your two year report of the CPAP machine!
-mark
Re: The results are in - I'm ANGRY at my Doc...
There's a nice bridge between St Pete and Tampa, with this doc's name on it.
we're all bobbing our collective heads (I am assuming) that this seems to be the s.o.story some of us have experienced w/our docs. My GP whom I hold in high regard, actually chuckled, when I told him re: sleep study, apnea, etc. He said OH YEAH? Well we spent just 1 lesson on sleep in med school, and kept chuckling, as if I'm paranoid, neurotic and a hypochondriac. (which on same days I may be one if not all of the above) but when I showed him the sleep apnea titration report, he got a little more quiet, serious and said 'hmmm'' several times.
The sleep doc, basically didn't even look up, said here's a scrip for the cpap and when I demanded an apap, he just looked at me and left. So I got his RT to get me a new scrip.
The most I learned was on this board and while I'm not a doctor, RT, MD, or any other set of initials maybe a diff. sleep doc is in order?
You know what my GP reacted the most to? When I told him how much the hospital (and food chain) down to the dr. I had to pay for a sleep study? That perked him right up? $$
Good luck searching for a new one...I do know in the past several people have posted on here where they live and good doc's recommended...maybe that would help....?
Keep searching.....and come back to the board....ok?
we're all bobbing our collective heads (I am assuming) that this seems to be the s.o.story some of us have experienced w/our docs. My GP whom I hold in high regard, actually chuckled, when I told him re: sleep study, apnea, etc. He said OH YEAH? Well we spent just 1 lesson on sleep in med school, and kept chuckling, as if I'm paranoid, neurotic and a hypochondriac. (which on same days I may be one if not all of the above) but when I showed him the sleep apnea titration report, he got a little more quiet, serious and said 'hmmm'' several times.
The sleep doc, basically didn't even look up, said here's a scrip for the cpap and when I demanded an apap, he just looked at me and left. So I got his RT to get me a new scrip.
The most I learned was on this board and while I'm not a doctor, RT, MD, or any other set of initials maybe a diff. sleep doc is in order?
You know what my GP reacted the most to? When I told him how much the hospital (and food chain) down to the dr. I had to pay for a sleep study? That perked him right up? $$
Good luck searching for a new one...I do know in the past several people have posted on here where they live and good doc's recommended...maybe that would help....?
Keep searching.....and come back to the board....ok?
Tampa Tom wrote:
OK, so after waiting three weeks for the results of the test, I go see the doc.
"I'm kinda puzzled by the results of the test, Tom?"
Really? how?
"Well, you don't have apnea. In the five hours from when you entered sleep until you were woken up, you only had 12 episodes of OSA or hypopnea."
OK, why was I so tired, then?
"Well, your snoring woke you up 56 times. Your grand total of arousals was 80 during the five hour period."
Great. So, I'm waking up an average of 16 times an hour. Now what?
"Well, how about a tonsilectomy?"
Weren't you the guy who said everthing was normal when I came in the end of March?
"Yeah. And, I really want to be very conservative. Maybe the operation isn't the way to go."
Won't a CPAP help?
"Uhhh, not quite sure. Let me give you the number of a sleep specialist you can visit."
Uhhh, don't you guys advertise that you handle sleep issues?
"Yeah, but we're not sleep 'Specialists'"
GRRRRRRR.....
So, now I have an appointment with a 'sleep specialist' on May 18, a 30 day supply of Ambien (had to beg it out of him) and a chip on my shoulder the size of Wisconsin.
I thought CPAPs could treat snoring?
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jdschooler
- Posts: 99
- Joined: Wed Jan 26, 2005 5:37 pm
- Location: Devils Lake, ND
Your doc is your EMPLOYEE....if he isn't doing the job...fire him.
In his defense....if your symptoms were indicative of OSA....ie tiredness, headaches, snoring...and so on an sleep study was clearly indicated and he may have been trying to save you some $$ by foregoing the sleep specialist and expected the sleep study to come back positive for OSA in which case the doc that interpreted the sleep study for the sleep lab would have suggested CPAP or AutoPap or BiPap and your physician would have prescribed a machine and so on.
On the other hand, something is causing you to snore...My snoring did go away with APAP...but then again I have severe OSA. It could be that your insurance won't pay for CPAP if you don't have OSA.
And on the bright side, even though you are tired and haven't found a resolution for that, atleast you haven't had years of damage to your body that sleep apnea causes and a shorter life span because of it.
Hope you get some good rest soon.
In his defense....if your symptoms were indicative of OSA....ie tiredness, headaches, snoring...and so on an sleep study was clearly indicated and he may have been trying to save you some $$ by foregoing the sleep specialist and expected the sleep study to come back positive for OSA in which case the doc that interpreted the sleep study for the sleep lab would have suggested CPAP or AutoPap or BiPap and your physician would have prescribed a machine and so on.
On the other hand, something is causing you to snore...My snoring did go away with APAP...but then again I have severe OSA. It could be that your insurance won't pay for CPAP if you don't have OSA.
And on the bright side, even though you are tired and haven't found a resolution for that, atleast you haven't had years of damage to your body that sleep apnea causes and a shorter life span because of it.
Hope you get some good rest soon.
Jeff,
The No-Longer Sleepy Medic
ResMed AutoSet Spirit w/ heated humidifier
Ramp 20 min, 8cm to 20cm H2o
ResMed Activa Nasal Mask
Respironics Comfort Gel Nasal Mask
ResMed Swfit Nasal Pillows Large
The No-Longer Sleepy Medic
ResMed AutoSet Spirit w/ heated humidifier
Ramp 20 min, 8cm to 20cm H2o
ResMed Activa Nasal Mask
Respironics Comfort Gel Nasal Mask
ResMed Swfit Nasal Pillows Large
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Janelle
Okay, Tom, so you're having 16 hypopneas an hour. No apneas. That's still an AHI of 16 which is moderate to severe if I remember the numbers right. Obviously a tonsilectomy won't do anygood if you aren't having enough obstruction to cause full apneas, and besides it is severely painful for 2 weeks and sometimes longer. Tonsilectomies are not a good choice for adults only children.
Did you get a copy of the sleep report?
Did you get a copy of the sleep report?
Hey Tampa Tom.
Sorry to hear about your news. I was so excited to know right away after my study that I had sleep apnea!! I have been fortunate so far through my whole process so I can't possibly know what you are going through. Anyway, hang in there. And remember, you are paying the doc so if he isn't doin the job, like a previos member said tell him "You're FIRED!!!!" Oh and by the way, is the chip on your shoulder full of cheese? LOL!!! (I am from Wisconsin)
Sorry to hear about your news. I was so excited to know right away after my study that I had sleep apnea!! I have been fortunate so far through my whole process so I can't possibly know what you are going through. Anyway, hang in there. And remember, you are paying the doc so if he isn't doin the job, like a previos member said tell him "You're FIRED!!!!" Oh and by the way, is the chip on your shoulder full of cheese? LOL!!! (I am from Wisconsin)
Longing 4 rest!!
If you had 12 events in 5 hours that would be 12/5 or an AHI of 2.4
However, your RDI would be around 40 (80/5)
Did you have a split night study done? (with an AHI that low I doubt it, but curious if they tried)
When you see your new Doc, you might ask to see if they can try CPAP and see if you feel better. Be advised tho, with an AHI that low you might have trouble getting insurance to pay for it.
BTW high RDI is still considered sleep disordered breathing and still needs to be treated. See this powerpoint presentation from Dr Strohl that links RDI to high blood pressure and heart disease Link Here
Also, remember that the doctors really have a limited insight into sleeping disorders such as SDB. Basically you caught him in a situation where he didn't have an answer. At least he is referring you somewhere, some of them with the "god" complex would just tell you it is in your head...
Good luck!
However, your RDI would be around 40 (80/5)
Did you have a split night study done? (with an AHI that low I doubt it, but curious if they tried)
When you see your new Doc, you might ask to see if they can try CPAP and see if you feel better. Be advised tho, with an AHI that low you might have trouble getting insurance to pay for it.
BTW high RDI is still considered sleep disordered breathing and still needs to be treated. See this powerpoint presentation from Dr Strohl that links RDI to high blood pressure and heart disease Link Here
Also, remember that the doctors really have a limited insight into sleeping disorders such as SDB. Basically you caught him in a situation where he didn't have an answer. At least he is referring you somewhere, some of them with the "god" complex would just tell you it is in your head...
Good luck!
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wading thru the muck!
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