Study finds Brain Chemical plays a roll in apnea in Mice

WxMan wrote:Then we have this...an actual study on Homo Sapiens that came to the opposite conclusion. SSRIs may reduce apnea.

I would expect taking an SSRI might reduce AHI if you already have sleep apnea since SSRI's reduce the amount of REM that you get and typically more apneas happen during REM.

Thats different than saying that SSRI use might cause sleep apnea to develop. (which of course is purely speculation)

WxMan wrote:Wouldn't it be nice to take a pill to control your apnea? Hope springs eternal. If that wish were to ever come to pass, we could start a new board "apneapilltalk.com"

yeah it would be great until 10-15 years when we learn what long term side effect it has... but at least the pharmas would be happy.

I would expect taking an SSRI might reduce AHI if you already have sleep apnea since SSRI's reduce the amount of REM that you get and typically more apneas happen during REM.

Good point!. Yes it is conceivable that serotonin could actually cause apnea but still reduce the AHI by reducing or eliminating REM sleep. Apnea episodes would have to increase or lengthen during other stages of sleep but not enough to offset the reduction during REM. Causing apnea is also different than controling it...the point of the mouse study.

As I interpret the study, the theory is that during sleep the reduction of serotonin to the upper airway dilator motor neurons leads to a reduction in the activity of the upper airway muscles during sleep. This suggests that an increase of serotonin may result in increased dilator muscle activity to reduce the apnea. However, that's only theory. If the studies only address a reduced AHI and not account for the REM sleep, it would be entirely possible that the drop in AHI would largely be due to a reduction in REM sleep with the increase in serotonin. The effect of REM sleep on that reduction would have to be accounted for.

I have no love for "Big Pharma" either. However, if a medication could be developed to control apnea with few adverse side affects (and all medication has side affects...as well as CPAP for that matter (insomnia being one)), it would be a big help to those many apnea suffers who find CPAP compliance so difficult.

I'm not holding my breath on this one. I suspect I and my APAP will be sleeping partners for a long time.

P.S. Thank you for an excellent piece of software!

Hi:

I have central sleep apea and obstructive sleep apnea. My sleep dr diagnosis as status post stoke. And yes i was very sick as a child and could have easily had stroke.

sarah

At the time of my last sleep study, I had no REM sleep during the 6.5 hours of sleep and still had apneas, hypopneas, and PLMD. I was retitrated to a pressure of 10. At that time, I was on Celexa (SSRI). Since that time, I am no longer on Celexa and have dropped over 30 lb. SSRI many times does lead to weight gain as it had with me and therefore, I would think it would tend to increase apnea. JMHO.

socknitster wrote:Interesting reference to a study on the potential causes of sleep apnea I found in the journal SLEEP.

http://www.journalsleep.org/ViewAbstrac ... ionid=3356

Jen

While a considerable amount of research is being directed at the role of serotonin and SDB, this particular study relates to the genesis of central sleep apnea. Mice don't get OSA.
SAG

THis study in mice is suggesting that a LACK of this brain chemical is causing the apnea.

MAOI drugs would increase the level of this specific chemical, I believe. So, this isn't indicating the SSRI's increase apnea, but rather that the old class of anti-depressants could help.

Most studies of this nature start in animals and if the show a trend get moved to humans. This is the way science works. Animals are easier to study and are very good predictors of how the results will be in humans, most of the time. Our basic biology is very similar, despite our differences in shape and size.

I wouldn't be surprised if SSRI's help with apnea. When I was misdiagnosed with depression for those 10 years--most of that time the SSRI's actually helped me sleep and function normally a significant portion of the time. It was only toward the end, right before I got the apnea diagnosis that they just couldn't help me anymore.

I know there are folks here that think all drugs of this nature are the devil. But if cpap were not available, I would HAVE to be on an SSRI or I wouldn't be able to function.

Happily, I have been off of all drugs for a couple of months. I weaned slowly under a doctors care. My mood and energy are great. I haven't felt this good for years.

My only problem now is my temper. Really made me pause when I read Allergyridden's post about MAO and criminals. My temper is legendary for a woman. When I see red, all logic goes out the window. And as my husband says, some days I am just looking for someone to be mad at. It really clashes with the rest of my personality and I have long wondered where this might come from. I daresay I could draw the conclusion at this point that it MIGHT be a result of my sleep disorder. I didn't have this problem when on a functional dose of ssri. This is the only remnant of my "depression" that is left. Maybe with more time on cpap it too will go. I can only hope!

jen