will rainout wake you up?

bluegrassfan · Post by **bluegrassfan** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 6:00 am

I had progressed to where I was getting up to 4 hrs continuous sleep, then it turned cold here in Ga. Monday thru Friday nite, I woke up 5 to 8 times. No problems with breathing, I just wake up. When I take the mask off to make a note of the time, water drips out of the mask. I have the HH set on 2. Is it possible this rainout is waking me up?

Can't control the heat in only one room, so I guess I need an aussie heating hose, or will one of those hose covers do it? I guess I also need to cut off humidifier heat and go with a cold nose. tks..bob

jimbassett · Post by **jimbassett** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 6:38 am

I have never experienced rain-out as my wife made me hose covers from a piece of flannel she had laying around. I would think though that water in the mask would cause me to have a run-away. That is very likely what is waking you up. Try wrapping your hose with some old socks if nothing else to see if it helps. Hang in there......Its got to get better.

Sleepy-eyes · Post by **Sleepy-eyes** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 7:30 am

Can rainout wake you? Imagine you are comfortably asleep (you know, back before you had to wear a mask) and someone starts dripping water on your face. Would that wake you? Most likely. I know it does me!

Rainout is very uncomfortable. It's not too hard to combat. I don't have a heated hose or heated hose cover. I tried making my own cover, but found it just made the hose difficult to maneuver in bed, so I'm back to no cover. My easiest solution has been to change to "passover" humidification on nights likely to cause rainout. In case you don't already know, "passover" humidification is where you just don't turn on the heater but still have water in the humidifier. You'll still get humification............just not so much the inside of the mask sweats.

sharon1965 · Post by **sharon1965** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 8:36 am

yes, rainout makes me crazy!! you just have to play around with the settings on your hh; some people put the hose under their blanket and find that helps; the hose cover helps some; a lot of people have the aussie; plus your humidity needs change with the seasons, so it's just a matter of tweaking...but yes, it definitely wakes me up!

WearyOne · Post by **WearyOne** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 11:58 am

I'm having a horrible time with this right now. Weird thing (at least to me) is most of the water collects it the little nasal pillows of my mask and apparently drips from there (Hybrid). I wake up every two hours or so and have to wipe the water out of it. The hose is fine--no moisture in there. Right now, I'm using a hose cover, but it doesn't help much (my Aussie heated hose is on the way!).

I'm going to try Sleepy-eyes idea tonight and just try it as a passover and see if that works. I'm already down to "2" on the humidifier anyway.

Pam

Catnapper · Post by **Catnapper** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 12:17 pm

This may seem like a simple fix for rainout, but it has made a difference for me. I put an extra strip of Velcro at each end of the hose cover and made the cover very snug against the end of the hose. Since I did that, I have had no rain in the Aura, which is the rainiest mask I can imagine. It has that small hose from the mask to the machine hose and I made a cover for it too. Of course, I have the HH at 1 which is very low. Don't know what it would do if I turned it way up to 2! Before the extra Velcro strips, even at 1, the hose and my nose would be very wet. You wouldn't think the loose hose cover could make that much difference. Room temperature may get down to 66 degrees at night.
I would be curious to know if anyone tries this to see if it makes a difference for them.

john44077 · Post by **john44077** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 12:49 pm

I had water pooling in the hose where the tube conects to the mask. There is a little lip there and it was collecting on it. Made a lot of noise.

John

NightHawkeye · Post by **NightHawkeye** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 1:09 pm

bluegrassfan wrote:Will rainout wake you up?

As if water dripping into one's nostrils weren't enough to rouse one from slumber, I've also noticed that water accumulation in the hose itself causes the machine pressure response to be disturbingly jerky in the Respironics machines I've owned. (I can't say how other manufacturers machines might respond.)

Although my hose is generally elevated overhead and loosely attached to the top of the bedpost, there is still a small loop of hose which dips down slightly and into which rainout will accumulate. When enough water accumulates to slosh around a little, as a result of breathing and from movement, the machine senses the resulting minute pressure changes and responds jerkily to them thereby awakening me. I usually don't realize why I woke up until I move around some and experience the abrupt pressure shifts. I've experienced this with all three Respironics machines I've used - with and without C-flex and Bi-flex - so I believe that it is an inherent response of Respironics' algorithm.

bluegrassfan wrote:I had progressed to where I was getting up to 4 hrs continuous sleep, then it turned cold here in Ga. Monday thru Friday nite, I woke up 5 to 8 times. No problems with breathing, I just wake up. When I take the mask off to make a note of the time, water drips out of the mask. I have the HH set on 2. Is it possible this rainout is waking me up?

Yep. I'd venture to say probable, actually.

bluegrassfan wrote:Can't control the heat in only one room, so I guess I need an aussie heating hose, or will one of those hose covers do it? I guess I also need to cut off humidifier heat and go with a cold nose. tks..bob

Best solution I've found for it is the Aussie heated hose. Second best solution is a hose cover and turning the humidifier down until the rainout doesn't occur anymore.

Try the hose cover first. That'll likely solve it for you. You'll notice a big difference with just the hose cover, but if you want to be able to crank the humidity all the way up, then the heated hose is what you'll need.

Regards,
Bill

bluegrassfan · Post by **bluegrassfan** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 5:31 pm

Thanks all. I really appreciate the responses. I have ordered a flannel hose cover just now from Cpap. And I'm going to look into the Aussie heated hose. Tonight (lol), my hose is wrapped in a foam cover used to insulate plumbing pipes, and I'll leave the heat off in the humidifier. We'll see what happens.

Alisha · Post by **Alisha** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 8:27 pm

blueglassfan, the weather is setting records for cold in April in my state. I didn't want to turn the heat on for a few cold nights, but it might not have been a good decision. After a couple hours' sleep last night, I was awakened by rainout.

If I have to take my mask off when I awake, I am then wide awake and not able to go back to sleep. After I got my mask dried out and checked the hose, I watched a movie on TV in the living room and then went back to bed. I was then blessed to sleep 5 more hours with no rainout.

Today I remembered I had moved the small table my apap sits on further away from the bed yesterday, which meant more of the hose was not under the covers. Today I moved the table up against the bed so I can keep most of the hose under the comforter. I also turned the HH down to between 1 and 2, whereas it was on 3 before. If I still get rainout and the weather stays cold, I'll have to turn on the heat tomorrow evening.

I have not purchased a hose cover or Aussie because I haven't had rainout before. I hope I can control this without making more purchases.

NightHawkeye said:

I've also noticed that water accumulation in the hose itself causes the machine pressure response to be disturbingly jerky in the Respironics machines I've owned.

NHE, this is interesting. Can you have water in the hose itself but no water in the mask and therefore not be aware water is accumulating in hose?

My EncorePro Daily Details have shown a jerky machine pressure response since increasing (by "1") my max auto pressure 13 days ago. I haven't been concerned about this, because the new max pressure is giving me super AHI stats.

I was thinking of raising my min auto pressure by "1" to see if the wavy pressure response would settle down. Maybe I should first try hanging my hose on the shower rod to dry it out in case there's water moisture inside for a few days. When my AHI is looking so good, I hesitate to change the pressure either way. I've had 3 or 4 days with zero apneas and this makes me very happy.

Any help, thoughts, comments will be greatly appreciated.

Regards,

Alisha

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 9:39 pm

Alisha, I actually put my hose in the dryer and run it for an hour on medium heat to dry it out. That hose had water droplets all thru it this morning. I'm hoping this foam insulation works tonight, if not I'll use the covers somehow.

Linda3032 · Post by **Linda3032** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 9:46 pm

Just using the humidifier as passover should stop all rainout (as a temporary fix).

Also, you can roll your hose into a large bath towel, and then tie the towel in 3 or 4 places. That insulates the hose pretty well.

Yes, rainout will wake you up. Even a little droplet up a nostril.

NightHawkeye · Post by **NightHawkeye** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 9:53 pm

Alisha wrote:
NightHawkeye wrote:I've also noticed that water accumulation in the hose itself causes the machine pressure response to be disturbingly jerky in the Respironics machines I've owned.
NHE, this is interesting. Can you have water in the hose itself but no water in the mask and therefore not be aware water is accumulating in hose?

Yep. At least I can. I hadn't really thought about it before you asked, but it depends a whole lot on the mask design. I use the Comfort Curve mask which provides a continuous drop-off away from the nose (unless one is sleeping on one's back). Hence, most of the condensation simply runs down the hose and I am not aware of it until the machine starts acting squirrelly. I also experienced the effect with the UltraMirage nasal mask. I don't remember experiencing it with either the Swift or the CL2, but that was probably because I was using the Aussie heated hose with those masks.

Alisha wrote:My EncorePro Daily Details have shown a jerky machine pressure response since increasing (by "1") my max auto pressure 13 days ago. I haven't been concerned about this, because the new max pressure is giving me super AHI stats.

I was thinking of raising my min auto pressure by "1" to see if the wavy pressure response would settle down. Maybe I should first try hanging my hose on the shower rod to dry it out in case there's water moisture inside for a few days. When my AHI is looking so good, I hesitate to change the pressure either way. I've had 3 or 4 days with zero apneas and this makes me very happy.

Doesn't sound like the same thing I experience, Alisha. I can physically feel the crazy machine response when water collects in the hose.

I think you have every right to be happy with your results, Alisha. Enjoy! Also, congratulate yourself on having adjusted your machine for optimum health benefits.

Regards,
Bill (. . . only a little envious)

Alisha · Post by **Alisha** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 10:17 pm

NightHawkeye wrote:

Doesn't sound like the same thing I experience, Alisha. I can physically feel the crazy machine response when water collects in the hose.

Bill, thanks for clarifying this for me. I think I'll just enjoy my very low AHI's and increased energy and forget about the seemingly jerky-looking pressure changes showing on my EncorePro Daily Details (for a few more weeks, at least). Thanks for your kind words.

bluegrassfan, I hope you have a "dry" xpap night and your hose cover arrives soon.

Regards,

Alisha

apneaicinisrael · Post by **apneaicinisrael** » Sat Apr 07, 2007 11:27 pm

Hi all,

One more suggestion - in addition to covering the hose and turning down the humidifier -

Make sure the machine is lower than the bed. This was recommended to me when I wrote in with the same problem a few months ago, and it worked. I moved my machine from a nightstand at head level, to a low shelf almost on the floor, and this solved the problem that had persisted even with the cover etc.

And .... summer is coming!

Good luck,
AII

will rainout wake you up?

will rainout wake you up?

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