Ready to quit CPAP

Hi,

maybe someone can help me out before I quit.
I am getting less sleep than before and feel much worse.
I'm a new user and have been using my CPAP every night for 3 weeks.
I wake up every night, every hour or so with severe dry mouth, to the point where it is painful.
I have the humidity up full on the machine and have tried all temperature settings for the hose.
The machine feels like there is no moisture coming from it, yet the tank is dry every morning.

Jack

Air Sense 10 Settings:
Mask - Full face
Humidity - 8
Climate Control Hose Temperature - have tried all variations
Air Pressure - 17

In addition, I have been using a chin strap, bioextra mouth gel and have a humidifier in my room with the windows open

Hi - can you be a bit more specific re the actual model of which machine plse, and same for the mask? And unless you're on a plain cpap machine set at 17 (that is high) for some reason(?) are you on min. and max (auto) settings, or just the one fixed (cpap?) at 17?

Jacksie wrote: ↑

Thu Apr 02, 2020 12:33 pm

Hi,

maybe someone can help me out before I quit.

welcome! you've come to the right place. however we are going to need more info in order to help you.

a place to start is what julie recommended. here is a list of machines. would you be so kind as to look through and tell us which one?

wiki/index.php/CPAP_models

this will help because, as you can see, there are many models.

good luck!

Dry mouth is almost always from mouth breathing. If you have a nasal or nasal pillow mask, the pressure the machine is trying to use to keep your airway open is leaking right out of your mouth. If you have a full face mask, the pressure will be maintained but your mouth will still dry out wickedly and cranking the humidity up can sometimes make it worse because too much humidity may make your nose stuffy so you have to breathe through your mouth.

So when we know what your equipment is (mask, too!) we can make some suggestions that will help.

Meanwhile, hang in there. Try wearing your mask while you are awake and sitting up in a chair. Are you able to seal your lips shut and breathe only through your nose? If not, tell us what's preventing that and we'll be able to help you come up with some solutions.

Hi Julie,

thanks for the reply.

The machine is the ResMed Airsense 10 Autoset
The hose is ResMed ClimateLineAir
The mask is a ResMed AirFit F20 M
Because of the number of episodes I have per hour, the professor wants me at 20
I have been studied in a lab overnight twice.
I started at 15, moved to 16, then to 17. Auto is disabled, as is ramp up.

zonker wrote: ↑

Thu Apr 02, 2020 1:37 pm

Jacksie wrote: ↑

Thu Apr 02, 2020 12:33 pm

Hi,

maybe someone can help me out before I quit.

welcome! you've come to the right place. however we are going to need more info in order to help you.

a place to start is what julie recommended. here is a list of machines. would you be so kind as to look through and tell us which one?

wiki/index.php/CPAP_models

this will help because, as you can see, there are many models.

good luck!

Hi Zonker,

it is an ResMed AirSense 10 Autoset reference number 37028

Jacksie wrote: ↑

Thu Apr 02, 2020 2:42 pm

Hi Julie,

thanks for the reply.

The machine is the ResMed Airsense 10 Autoset
The hose is ResMed ClimateLineAir
The mask is a ResMed AirFit F20 M
Because of the number of episodes I have per hour, the professor wants me at 20
I have been studied in a lab overnight twice.
I started at 15, moved to 16, then to 17. Auto is disabled, as is ramp up.

Your machine is set to the max of 20cmH20 constantly?

Midwest_non_sleeper wrote: ↑

Thu Apr 02, 2020 2:45 pm

Jacksie wrote: ↑

Thu Apr 02, 2020 2:42 pm

Hi Julie,

thanks for the reply.

The machine is the ResMed Airsense 10 Autoset
The hose is ResMed ClimateLineAir
The mask is a ResMed AirFit F20 M
Because of the number of episodes I have per hour, the professor wants me at 20
I have been studied in a lab overnight twice.
I started at 15, moved to 16, then to 17. Auto is disabled, as is ramp up.

Your machine is set to the max of 20cmH20 constantly?

Hi Midwest, it is set to 17, this is per the experts advice, I've gone up from 15 to 16 to 17, the EPR is set to 3

OSCAR https://www.sleepfiles.com/OSCAR/
http://www.apneaboard.com/wiki/index.ph ... stallation
http://www.apneaboard.com/wiki/index.ph ... rpretation

viewtopic/t158560/How-to-post-images-for-review.html

Jacksie wrote: ↑

Thu Apr 02, 2020 2:43 pm

Hi Zonker,

it is an ResMed AirSense 10 Autoset reference number 37028

okay, then! <rubs hands together briskly>

so, may i suggest for your next steps two things-

all the stuff that pugsy gave you links to. this will help you going forward. it's software to gather data from your machine. it will present itself as charts. those charts full of data can be shared right here in this post so that people can make helpful suggestions. it's going to mean you will have to do some tweaking on your machine to make sure it's set up to do the best job for YOU.

second thing, could you please take the time to fill out your equipment profile? when you do that, it will show up at the bottom of each of your posts like it does on mine below.

i know this may sound like a lot. but we're here to help you.

you can do this. together, we will make it better.

good luck!

You might want to go over the reports from your sleep studies for any helpful clues. For instance, is there a positional component to your events? What is your sleep position? If perhaps you have more events when supine and you back sleep, getting off your back could help you not need such a high pressure. Is there a significant difference in pressure needs when in REM? Using a range instead of a fixed pressure could help you not need to stay at a high pressure. Theoretically, one would think less pressure could help mouth dryness. Just trying to think of some little things that might make this more tolerable. I have dry mouth issues. A few years back I mastered the technique of keeping my tongue sealed to the roof of my mouth. While lack of movement inside the mouth can cause dryness too since there is no stimulus for salivation, for me this dryness is nowhere near as miserable as was the air blowing around in my mouth. Even when not mouth breathing, just the air going in there was incredibly drying. Good luck finding ways to help yourself. Maybe your machine data will prove helpful.

From personal experience, these are the things I've done to combat dry mouth.

The Airfit F20 is an awesome mask. It's designed to fit a wide range of faces.

If you're getting large leaks, you may need help figuring out how to seat the mask so it doesn't leak. If you had it fitted at a DME, it's likely the right size, but on the off chance, you may want to try a different sized pillow.

These are methods I use to reduce leak to a minimum:
Consider getting Pad a Cheek's anti-leak strap. It works wonders.
https://www.cpap.com/productpage/pad-a- ... 0-f30-mask

Consider a papcap. It's my last defense against mouthleaks. I can't sleep without it.
https://www.cpap.com/productpage/pursle ... rap-cotton

Things you can change in the settings menu that also cause dry mouth and stuffy nose:

• Take the climate control off Auto.
• Reduce your climateline temperature to 70 degrees F, 20.5 degrees C. Mine defaulted to 82 degrees F on Auto. It was burning my mouth dry. Had to stop that.
• Reduce your humidity level to 3 - If your nose is stuffy, it's often an indication that your humidity is too high. It's counter-intuitive, but it works for a lot of us.
• Make sure your water tank is relatively full.

I hope this helps.

Chris

Jacksie wrote: ↑

Thu Apr 02, 2020 12:33 pm

Hi,

maybe someone can help me out before I quit.
I am getting less sleep than before and feel much worse.
I'm a new user and have been using my CPAP every night for 3 weeks.
I wake up every night, every hour or so with severe dry mouth, to the point where it is painful.
I have the humidity up full on the machine and have tried all temperature settings for the hose.
The machine feels like there is no moisture coming from it, yet the tank is dry every morning.

Jack

Air Sense 10 Settings:
Mask - Full face
Humidity - 8
Climate Control Hose Temperature - have tried all variations
Air Pressure - 17

In addition, I have been using a chin strap, bioextra mouth gel and have a humidifier in my room with the windows open

Other than the super dry mouth, how is everything else? Are you congested when you wake up? Any other concerns?

In terms of the dry mouth, you likely have a trifecta going on -- mouth breathing, mask leak, and higher pressures.

A few things that have worked for me:
- Stay well hydrated.
- Try something like biotene before bed (not familiar with bioextra -- perhaps the same thing)
- Try a night guard (it can make you drool)
- Keep water with a straw near your bed -- you can disconnect the hose and take a sip of water when you wake up (without taking off the mask)
- Download OSCAR and look at your leak data -- I suspect you have significant leaks. Not every mask fits every person (I love a size large airtouch F20 but not the airfit, and it must be a large) -- others hate what works for me.
- Try using the machine while awake. Do you find your mouth open? As you shift around, do leaks start?

About pressures. Pressure needs are not determined by your untreated AHI -- but rather how much pressure is need to lower them. Higher AHI does not guarantee a need fr higher pressure. And pressure needs can vary night to night, by sleep position, and by sleep stage. Higher pressure is not a bad thing per se although it does make air swallowing and mask leaks more likely. The good news is you can do something about that. A good future discussion....

Jacksie wrote: ↑

Thu Apr 02, 2020 2:42 pm

Because of the number of episodes I have per hour, the professor wants me at 20
I have been studied in a lab overnight twice.
I started at 15, moved to 16, then to 17. Auto is disabled, as is ramp up.

Can you post your sleep study results (with personal info blacked out)? And can you post some of your Oscar data?


It would be helpful to see what worked during the titration. And also what results you are getting with your current settings.

Your doctor should already know that the pressure a person needs is NOT related to the number of events. Some people have a lot of events, but don't need much pressure to prevent them. I had a split night study, so I had an ahi of 79 an hour without reaching REM sleep. It is probably worse than that if checked for the whole night. Definitely severe. But my settings are 11-17, and I really don't go past 13 that much. Just for short times as I roll onto my back. It is quite possible that you don't need such high pressure. If you can post some data from your machine, we can see if you might do better at lower pressures.

Pugsy wrote: ↑

Thu Apr 02, 2020 3:04 pm

OSCAR https://www.sleepfiles.com/OSCAR/
http://www.apneaboard.com/wiki/index.ph ... stallation
http://www.apneaboard.com/wiki/index.ph ... rpretation

viewtopic/t158560/How-to-post-images-for-review.html

Thank you, I am checking these links now