Does your electric company give you a discount or allow CPAP users to be on the priority restore list?

bwexler wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 14, 2019 6:11 pm

I must agree with those who suggest that society doesn't owe anyone anything beyond life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.
But I would be foolish not to partake in a money saving offer from my otherwise greedy power company.
If you saw a $100 bill on the sidewalk, would you pick it up, or would you say that's not mine and leave it there.
I sometimes wonder weather I should be entitled to collect on Social security and Medicare. But then I remember i have been paying for both for decades. I still pay for both with one hand while I still work and collect both with the other hand. I also pay for Medicare monthly out of my social security.

Would you be happy, if you knew that $100 was taken by a Company and they chose to it away, but then took it again from others that paid their bills in full? The Company isn't hurt in the least, now they can get paid even more, plus charge even more than the $100 you got for their trouble. Money found on the street is a whole Different thing, if I say who dropped it, I would tell them and or give it to them. If there was no clear owner, it would be mine. Falsely claiming something or more than you are entitled too is wrong for people that know the difference! Jim

crab-legs wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 14, 2019 11:09 am

Dog Slobber wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 14, 2019 8:11 am

crab-legs wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 14, 2019 1:05 am

My CPAP machine is a life-saving device. If I can't use it, I don't fall asleep. I am very groggy, especially on the second day of no CPAP use, and could crash a car. So it is life saving.

If you're in a position where you are so groggy that driving a car is so dangerous, and you choose to drive a car, then any accident, injury or death is completely on you.

You need to stop believing that other people are responsible for negative outcomes because of decisions you make.

The problem is sometimes you have to drive. My medical doctors are 4 hours away from me. And without my CPAP, I cannot fall asleep. Before I had CPAP, I spent all day at home sleepy. So sleepy I really didn't go out much. I slept for up to 20 hours a day and was still sleepy. I couldn't work.

Yeah, you're probably right.

After all, your life is worth more than the lives of others who you're putting at risk while driving impaired because of sleep deprivation.

I don't see the need so much to get a "Discount" on my power bill - but having a database of users who have a "Greater need" for power to be restored in a timely manner would be nice.

If you have 4 neighborhoods.

1. with 30 people on CPAP
2. with 8 people on CPAP
3. with 2 people on CPAP and one guy on a Ventilator (it doesn't work he dies with in minutes) - obviously he has a battery backup or generator or he has a death wish...
4. with people who just need their fridges to work and electricity so they can watch TV so they don't get bored...

The above 4 examples... If you have a storm and you need to restore power... You do 3 first, then 1, then 2, then 4 is last on the list...

There subtle differences in levels of "Need" we all need electricity to function as a whole day to day, to a point. I would argue that for some off us that need is greater then others, and for some it is a mater of life or death.

If you are reasonably sound financially, are not hurting for money, you probably shouldn't be looking for a discount from the power company just because your CPAP is more of a need then your neighbor's TV set. It doesn't take away from the fact that for some of us, we really really really "NEED" our CPAP machines to be working so we can sleep, live...

We need to sleep or we die... You can only stay awake for so many days before you risk serious medical complications... if your Apnea is at a level where you start to have serious complications with in hours of falling asleep with out PAP treatment then you could argue a greater need then someone with mild apnea who could get away with sleeping in a recliner or stuffing some tennis balls in the back of their shirt if they can't use their PAP.

I've only fallen asleep accidentally 2 times in the last 12+ years with out my PAP device and I woke up shortly there after with my head feeling like it was going to explode... my heart trying to beat it's way out of my chest like in the aliens movie and needless to say I'm terrified of the idea of having to sleep with out my machine. I really would rather not have a heart attack or stroke... I have a portable generator as an emergency backup if were I live gets hit with a bad storm and I'm with out power for like a week or more... I also have a standing invitation to stay at a friends house less then an hour away who has a total home generator backup... I'm not stupid, I have made plans for if things get really bad. At least to a point, I don't have plans for the end of the world or zombies... but I digress.

You do have people who are living pay check to pay check, who can't afford to pay for extras, even if needed. If your living somewhere with crappy power, and you really need your CPAP then you should have a backup system... but if you can barely make your rent payments and pay for meds or food as it is... some needs If your in financial need, then having a waver or discount on your power bill isn't something I'd have a problem with.

There's too much politics in all this. We can't live in a Nanny state were every thing we want is handed to us, but I also don't want to live in an anarchic state were it's all a mater of survival of the fittest and if you can't manage to eat all the little fish around you, to bad, your just going to have to learn to like being someones lunch.

I think it's a mater of balancing needs vs wants... in the not so distant future, I can see a time were we're going to be looking at a complete crash in the jobs market as every possible conceivable job you can imagine is done by robots or automated systems. If you literally can't find a job to support your self no mater what you do... at what point do we start to look at providing people with some form of living stipend so they can pay for "needs" like shelter, food, water, health care...? Otherwise... ?

Think of it as a thought experiment. If there no jobs to be had... how are you supposed to earn a living in the classic capitalistic process? I'm guessing some of it will even out, because if everyone's broke because no one's making any money then all the companies that make all the crap we'd like to buy, (whether it's done with robots or not) will go out of business because no one will be able to afford to buy their nick nacks... so who knows.

I'm getting a little side tracked I guess. I just find it so odd to see the defensive or, sometimes rather snippy comments, when it comes to this topic.
If the idea of a Discount riles you up... ignore that part and focus on the "priority" aspect of the question. I see no problems with letting the power company know that I have a medical device that I Need to use at least part of the Day/Night that while not 100% critical to my moment to moment survival does still play a critical role in my health that should weighted with more importance then say my neighbor who just wanted to watch the news on his flat screen. We all need power for our fridges... but I can live off of dry goods, but after a few days with no power, and suffocating through the night, I'm going to be a medical mess, where as someone else who doesn't need PAP may just be overly annoyed.

I don't get the back and forth... of saying CPAP is no big deal... but yet also saying that it's really serious and we need to use it every time all the time... Is it one or the other?
I don't see CPAP as simply a "Improvement to the quality of my life" I see it as a genuine need. By no means am I comparing my CPAP to say my Grandfathers respirator. If the respirator fails your looking at eminent death. However, I still don't like the odds of trying to sleep with out my machine and not having a heart attack or stroke when I hit REM sleep. I can stay awake or get creative with my power needs but I still think CPAP should be taken seriously. I don't want a hand out just because I use CPAP but if there enough CPAP user's registered in a given neighborhood then say another one... I think in the event of a power loss there algorithms that can dispatch repair crews to repair damage in such a way that those neighborhoods stand a better chance of getting fixed sooner then later.

That's all I'd like to see.

Rest well,

Gryphon

The problem with Repair is, it's a system, repair has to be done point to point, unless a wire or transformer in your location is the fault. Storms don't just hit one place. You almost always have to fix the closest problem to the power grid and work down the line.

A stupid driver hitting a power pole or blown transformer, or one down line, is easier and can be fixed faster. (We Hope) The list might help on that level, can't hurt. But Forcing your Neighbors, to pay for your electric use, is cruel and unusual punishment for letting them in your power service area! Jim

crab-legs wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 14, 2019 1:05 am

allow CPAP users to be on the priority restore list?

There are a few CPAP users on every block in my neighborhoods. The whole country would be on a priority list. Get yourself a backup generator or battery system paid for by the fruits of your own labor.

crab-legs wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 14, 2019 2:54 pm

palerider wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 14, 2019 1:58 pm

crab-legs wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 14, 2019 11:16 am

I appreciate your sentiments Jim. The problem with me is that is is life saving. If I can't use CPAP, I can't fall asleep. And without sleep, a person will eventually die.

You are trivializing "life saving", it's disingenuous, and bordering on deplorable.

When someone's oxygen concentrator shuts off, and they can't breathe *during the day*, that's critical.

When their ventilator shuts off, and they die, that's critical.

You are merely inconvenienced, get over yourself.

Yeah, being groggy all day and "sleeping" and being unable to work is surely an "inconvenience". My AHI before CPAP was over 200. CPAP may not technically be life-saving for me, but being without one I pretty much do not have a life.

We are talking about power outages. They are temporary. If the power outage is bad enough to last more than a week, then it is probably due to a natural disaster, and you won't be getting your power back any faster than anybody else. You will STILL need to find a way to take care of yourself or deal with the outage. And MOST people will have a tough time during a power outage lasting several days. Too cold in the winter. Too hot in the summer. Food destroyed in the fridge and freezer. Unable to cook unless you have options.

But! There is a way to deal with this. Be prepared. Battery options. Generator. Etc. We are adults, and we are capable of seeing the possibilities and planning for them. Everybody should be able to deal with a power outage of at least a week. With food supplies, battery options etc. Whether it be a flood, earthquake, bad storm; we KNOW that it will take days to get power restored. The government cannot take care of ALL of us. And while you say that we should take care of the most vulnerable, we are NOT the most vulnerable. Those would be the people in hospitals, a lot of elderly people, and people with much more serious chronic conditions and disabilities. If we are being treated for sleep apnea, then we should be fine before the power outage. We start off in good condition and have a few bad days. They are already having trouble BEFORE the power outage.

For most people, cpap usage does NOT compare to other disabilities. Ours can bet treated, and a few days without may leave us feeling like crap, but is unlikely to risk our life. Most of us went YEARS without treatment. This is a condition that causes damage over time. It is not something that suddenly kills a person.

Now, as to the ahi over 200. If it is real, get a special doctor's note that you need special consideration. But I have to wonder if this is even possible. An event must be 10 seconds or longer to count. There are 3600 seconds in an hour. An ahi of 200 at the bare minimum of 10 seconds would be 2000 seconds, well over 50% of the time. That seems very unlikely. And well above anybody else's diagnosed ahi.

Any chance you can post the summary from your sleep study?

Go to a motel--send a bill to your congressman.
Good luck.

zoocrewphoto wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 15, 2019 2:24 pm

crab-legs wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 14, 2019 2:54 pm

palerider wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 14, 2019 1:58 pm

crab-legs wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 14, 2019 11:16 am

I appreciate your sentiments Jim. The problem with me is that is is life saving. If I can't use CPAP, I can't fall asleep. And without sleep, a person will eventually die.

You are trivializing "life saving", it's disingenuous, and bordering on deplorable.

When someone's oxygen concentrator shuts off, and they can't breathe *during the day*, that's critical.

When their ventilator shuts off, and they die, that's critical.

You are merely inconvenienced, get over yourself.

Yeah, being groggy all day and "sleeping" and being unable to work is surely an "inconvenience". My AHI before CPAP was over 200. CPAP may not technically be life-saving for me, but being without one I pretty much do not have a life.

Now, as to the ahi over 200. If it is real, get a special doctor's note that you need special consideration. But I have to wonder if this is even possible. An event must be 10 seconds or longer to count. There are 3600 seconds in an hour. An ahi of 200 at the bare minimum of 10 seconds would be 2000 seconds, well over 50% of the time. That seems very unlikely. And well above anybody else's diagnosed ahi.

Any chance you can post the summary from your sleep study?

Not the OP but 200 doesn't seem all that high to me. I don't expect special treatment for my AHI.

My AHI was only 83.
I didn't even know I had a problem until I got my first physical on Medicare accurately diagnosed several maladies I was unaware of including Apnea and Afib. He then attempted to scare the hell out of me and my wife. He sent me directly to the ER, saying he didn't want me to die in his office.
I still think he over hipped my conditions.
Now wife will not allow me to slide my treatment or medication, even the meds I like to wean myself off of.
So 200 is high but is obviously possible.

crab-legs wrote: ↑

Wed Aug 14, 2019 11:50 am

Regardless, health care should be universal, as it is a human right.

Opinions vary on health care being a "Right". Especially the Doctor who practices for a living instead of "doing it as a hobby". I've always viewed folks claiming healthcare as a "right" would be highly opposed to indentured servitude (ie slavery), but they clearly have no problem demanding Doc's work on *their* terms, regardless of the value the Doc places on his own labor, skills and supplies.

Basic human rights can not be a "right" if they require anyone else to *provide* them to you. Rights are things you already possess without requiring anyone else to do anything. They do require that someone else does not *actively* deny them to you under force of law. For example, the govt can't pass a law that forbids you from getting healthcare on your own, but your neighbor (who is a doctor) is not required to treat you if he doesn't want to -- because he has rights too and you (or a mob of you's) are stomping all over them by demanding he work for you on your terms (which is what govt-controlled healthcare ultimately does).

So in that regard, I agree that you have a right to acquire your own healthcare with whomever you can enter into a mutual agreement with. However, you do not have a right to demand I treat you if I don't want to. I may point you to another doc who does charity work on your schedule and you can go ask them.

As far as the power company, if your xPAP therapy is that critical, why in the world would you trust your health to a third-party power provider when it is trivially easy to provide your own simple battery backup system (DIY-built or bought)? Or go get a hotel where there is power. But consider a couple/few nights in a hotel would likely pay for a battery backup system.

If you *must* travel after a sleepless night that leaves you significantly impaired, please do not knowingly & willingly get behind the wheel and potentially kill some innocent person. You've already admitted you are fully aware you will be driving impaired. You are no different than a drunk driver in that circumstance. If you choose to get behind the wheel in that condition, you and only you are personally responsible for whatever happens. You are reasonably intelligent. You know you should either bum a ride from friends/family of hire a car for your unavoidable & mandatory travel to avoid the risk of adding to the traffic fatality statistics.

Further, you value the "life-saving" service the power company provides you in such high regard, that you feel entitled to a discount on it... If all the logic requires is the establishment of a "basic right", then what about food? Should we be entitled to a discount for running a refrigerator?

You seem to be taking great pains to avoid any and all personal responsibility for circumstances that are well within your ability to manage all by yourself. Let me stress that, "...that are well within your ability to manage all by yourself..." You aren't helpless as you are clearly able to fire up a computer, navigate to a site and type information. In that regard, you have *plenty* of self-help options. I hate to sound so blunt and I truly mean no offense, but I just can't understand the mindset of dependence on others for something as important as "basic rights". Like I said, opinions will vary, but I much prefer to provide for my own basic rights whenever possible instead of depending on them from someone else who will inevitably & eventually fail to provide them. And as luck will have it, they will fail when I need them most. If you can't depend on yourself, how are you going to depend on anyone else, especially if you don't *have* to?

Best of luck to you in figuring out your situation.
And apologies for the long-windedness,
-JD

JayDee wrote: ↑

Mon Aug 19, 2019 5:49 am

I've always viewed folks claiming healthcare as a "right" would be highly opposed to indentured servitude (ie slavery), but they clearly have no problem demanding Doc's work on *their* terms, regardless of the value the Doc places on his own labor, skills and supplies.

Basic human rights can not be a "right" if they require anyone else to *provide* them to you.

I love JD.

Basic human rights can not be a "right" if they require anyone else to *provide* them to you.

Wow that is an awesome quote. . Clearly worded. Thank you JD!

crab-legs wrote: ↑Wed Aug 14, 2019 12:50 pm

Regardless, health care should be universal, as it is a human right.

Great Idea but total BS! I need my Sewer dug us two broken tiles, If that is true, Sewers that work are also a human right, bad sewers are a health problem, you would by any chance be willing to come over here and dig mine up and repair it FOR FREE. I also need a Electric Box replaced in the rear house, and a few new wires run, FOR FREE, of course, Safe Electric service is also a human right. I doubt if you will be here to help me with my human right issues.

So I'm facing a $2300 bill for the sewer to repair a repair that was done 13 years ago incorrectly. It will probable still be done incorrectly again, because if you can't do everything yourself you are at the mercy of people who work, but either don't know how to do their jobs or don't care enough to do them right. as far as the electric it's on hold, let it burn the building down if it wants to.

It would be nice to have everything you want or need paid by someone willing to work, but around here their is just one Human Right I have found that works. Thats, "WORK"! if you don't do it, you don't have any "Rights"! As you get older it pays off if you have planned ahead so you can take care of yourself when you can no longer work, living with-in your means from day one helps, soak up the rainy days before all of us. Jim

Goofproof wrote: ↑

Mon Aug 19, 2019 9:17 am

Goofproof

I love Jim also.

You guys are all right about what RIGHTS we have.
And I understand the golden rule, he who has the gold...
But why should anyone pay more for the 300th KWH or 3000th KWH than they did for the first one. Yes we should pay for each KWH we use but none are intrinsically worth more than another. So my discount doesn't give me anything for free. It only allows me to pay a flat, equal amount for each unit I use.
If I go to the store and buy a bunch of bananas, should I pay more for number 10 than I would for the first one?
What you are advocating here in SDG&E land, is that those who can scrimp and get by with an arbitrary minimum amount of power should in fact get a discount while all who use a bit more should subsidize them. And, those who choose to use a lot of power should pay more per unit and subsidize all of their more frugal neighbors.
I would suggest a flat rate par per unit for all use, so no one is subsidized. That is all I accomplished for myself.
I have always advocated for each us to negotiate the best available deals for everything we acquire. When was the last time you paid sticker price for a new car?