Labored breathing with P10

Sluggish wrote: ↑

Sun Jun 16, 2019 10:54 am

I think if even a small bit of what he claims is accurate, the consumer has a right to know about it. I thought what he was saying was that C02 poisoning can kill people and that the P10 “can” contribute to this by the vents getting clogged. That is different that saying “the P10 mask will kill people”. Or at least I think it is anyway.

This is an exact quote of his:

http://www.apneaboard.com/forums/Thread ... #pid286576

As many have pointed out, apparently the majority of users are happy campers...

But perhaps a few of the ones who aren't, might have died??

Perhaps, you could explain it in a relevant context where he's not suggesting the p10s aren't the potential cause of people dying.

Dog Slobber wrote: ↑

Sun Jun 16, 2019 11:45 am

Sluggish wrote: ↑

Sun Jun 16, 2019 10:54 am

I think if even a small bit of what he claims is accurate, the consumer has a right to know about it. I thought what he was saying was that C02 poisoning can kill people and that the P10 “can” contribute to this by the vents getting clogged. That is different that saying “the P10 mask will kill people”. Or at least I think it is anyway.

This is an exact quote of his:

http://www.apneaboard.com/forums/Thread ... #pid286576

As many have pointed out, apparently the majority of users are happy campers...

But perhaps a few of the ones who aren't, might have died??

Perhaps, you could explain it in a relevant context where he's not suggesting the p10s aren't the potential cause of people dying.

Oh. My bad.
Removing him from the equation, has anyone besides myself noticed any difficulty breathing with the P10? I’m wondering if maybe I got a defective one or something? I’m so sad about this. I love the fit of the P10. I have a FFM on order and will try to use the ESON in the mean time. It’s too early to tell if I just had a random good night or if the ESON was the reason. So many variables.

I think installing fear is part of the Business plan.

And so it goes.......

https://www.courtlistener.com/docket/14 ... clean-inc/

Dog Slobber wrote: ↑

Sun Jun 16, 2019 7:08 am

Cpapian wrote: ↑

Sat Jun 15, 2019 8:20 pm

Clogged vent is a thing. Search Apnea Board for the topic ....."Evidence of the P10 vent obstruction causing hypercapnia".

You mean the topic where the poster makes all kinds of claims about the dangers of the p10 design, so much that he has reported it to the FDA.

But continues to use it himself.

He's such a fear mongerer, he's likely to be hired by SoClean.

Sluggish wrote: ↑

Sun Jun 16, 2019 12:45 pm

Oh. My bad.
Removing him from the equation, has anyone besides myself noticed any difficulty breathing with the P10?

not from me. for me, it's the most amazing mask i've owned. now, i realize i'm a VERY lucky individual. i only tried 3 other masks before i hit this one.

i'm also keenly aware that a mask that works for me may not work for thee. and the other way around.

this is why i don't recommend a mask straight out of the gate when a newbie arrives asking "what's the best mask?".

it's all down to the individual.

Sluggish wrote: ↑

Sun Jun 16, 2019 12:45 pm

Oh. My bad.
Removing him from the equation, has anyone besides myself noticed any difficulty breathing with the P10? I’m wondering if maybe I got a defective one or something? I’m so sad about this. I love the fit of the P10. I have a FFM on order and will try to use the ESON in the mean time. It’s too early to tell if I just had a random good night or if the ESON was the reason. So many variables.

When I started with the P10, I used medium pillows, I felt it was difficult to breathe, so switched to large, no more problems getting a good deep breath.

If you ARE having CO2 buildup, I don't know if I'd call it "labored" breathing, (not exactly sure what you mean by that..) what will happen is that your respiration rate will accelerate, you'll start breathing harder, and deeper, as your body tries to blow off the excess CO2 that's causing your blood to acidify. This can progress until you're breathing like you've just run a race, or been climbing many flights of stairs very fast, because what those things do is to increase the CO2 in your blood, and your breathing naturally increases till that CO2 comes back down.

If you really like the mask in general maybe it's worth it to purchase one more pillow and see what happens ...... maybe the current one is defective.

I have a P10, but haven't used it a lot. It seems fine when I use it.

Seems like you options are:

- use a larger size pillow (but you said that gets leaky)
- adjust your EPR so you have the maximum reduction
- decrease your humidity
- try the piĺlows setting
- clean it (you did that without improvement)
- complain to your supplier
- stick a bunch of pin holes into the mesh
- buy a new pillow in your correct size and hope the last one was a dud and your problem was a one off problem

If you do buy a new pillow, maybe buy it from a different place just in case.

Otherwise, I hope your new mask works

Got the FFM today.
Doing some daytime testing. I changed the machine settings from nasal to FFM. But I also wonder.. am I supposed to lower the pressure?? My cheeks immediately fill up with air and leaks occur at the edges etc..
Seems like maybe the nasal masks require more pressure or something? What is a good starting pressure for FFM?

Sluggish wrote: ↑

Wed Jun 19, 2019 12:40 pm

Seems like maybe the nasal masks require more pressure or something? What is a good starting pressure for FFM?

When switching from a nasal mask to FFM, usually, you should use the same pressure setting to start with. (12 min, 17 max, 2 EPR).

However, the daily graph you posted shows your pressure barely goes above 12. If it were me, I would change the settings to 10 min, 20 max, 2 EPR. Don't worry about 20 max pressure. The machine won't go that high as long as it doesn't sense a collapsing airway.

Sluggish wrote: ↑

Wed Jun 19, 2019 12:40 pm

Got the FFM today.
Doing some daytime testing. I changed the machine settings from nasal to FFM. But I also wonder.. am I supposed to lower the pressure?? My cheeks immediately fill up with air and leaks occur at the edges etc..
Seems like maybe the nasal masks require more pressure or something? What is a good starting pressure for FFM?

FFMs often require *more* pressure, because they can push the lower jaw backwards, narrowing the airway

Do people just sleep all night with puffy cheeks then? Just try to ignore it and sleep through it?

Sluggish wrote: ↑

Wed Jun 19, 2019 3:03 pm

Do people just sleep all night with puffy cheeks then? Just try to ignore it and sleep through it?

Are you using a FFM because your mouth leaks? Those leaks will allow the pressure to equalize and the cheeks will deflate.

ChicagoGranny wrote: ↑

Wed Jun 19, 2019 3:07 pm

Sluggish wrote: ↑

Wed Jun 19, 2019 3:03 pm

Do people just sleep all night with puffy cheeks then? Just try to ignore it and sleep through it?

Are you using a FFM because your mouth leaks? Those leaks will allow the pressure to equalize and the cheeks will deflate.

No. I’m wearing FFM in hopes that I can now breathe through my mouth, nose, or both. No more taping, no worries about mouth leaks, etc..

Sluggish wrote: ↑

Wed Jun 19, 2019 3:28 pm

I’m wearing FFM in hopes that I can now breathe through my mouth, nose, or both.

If you open your lips slightly, the pressure will equalize.

A few questions regarding the F20....
Is the "for her" medium cushion/frame smaller than the standard mens medium? Do they consider a medium size women smaller than a medium sized man?
I think I need the mens medium cushion size but the small elastic headgear. It seems the only way to get this combo is to order the "for her" in medium which will ship with medium frame/cushion and small headgear.
I'm just wondering if there are any other differences between the two "medium" builds. Thanks!