negative impressions of this "business"

General Discussion on any topic relating to CPAP and/or Sleep Apnea.
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NightHawkeye
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Post by NightHawkeye » Tue Feb 13, 2007 4:07 pm

TANSTAF1 wrote:I simply do not agree that all doctors are bad.
Nor do I.
TANSTAF1 wrote:Maybe it's because I live in an area with some of the best hospitals in the world and we are able to get good recommendations (usually from someone inside the medical profession or from family) before picking a doctor, but we have great doctors.
And there's the rub. How does one pick a "good" physician?

A few noble causes have tried unsuccessfully to make physician ratings available and been thwarted. It's apparently not in the best interests of physicians to have such info generally available, or at least that's the way they've viewed it. [sarcasm ON] After all, they're highly educated, dedicated professionals. There's no need for that sort of thing. [sarcasm OFF]

Umm . . ., Hello! .

Regards,
Bill

SaLeepy
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Post by SaLeepy » Tue Feb 13, 2007 4:15 pm

TANSTAF1 wrote:there does seem to be a high percentage of complaints and anecdotal evidence about sleep doctors and DME's.
The population of this board undoubtedly is an accurate relection of the population as a whole.

People who have good doctors and DME's with effective treatment are very likely to seek out a board such as this so that they may speak passionately of their satisfaction with their care, and continue to seek answers as to how to they managed to do it.

People who have not, on the other hand, are far more likely to just go on with their lives despite their great problems, and not seek out a board that offers help such as this. ':?': It must all balance out in order to make sense. That's why it does. ':?'

Last edited by SaLeepy on Tue Feb 13, 2007 5:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Rabid1
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Post by Rabid1 » Tue Feb 13, 2007 4:55 pm

snoregirl wrote:Solution to the imediate problem you have (not by any means a fix for the whole issue) is to avoid DME and their $150 charge (of which I am sure you must have some copay), then go get the software and do it yourself.

Good luck.
Snoregirl!!!

How dare you suggest us po' ignant folk mess wit our own healt!

Wake me up when this is over...

Hurricane
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Post by Hurricane » Tue Feb 13, 2007 5:07 pm

Thats why we call this great country the land of opportunity, Just paying for their degrees.

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Bamalady
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Post by Bamalady » Tue Feb 13, 2007 5:39 pm

So perhaps it's time to start giving some feedback.

The Doctor's Report Card. What do you think?

http://diagknowsis.org/reportcard/

jackr
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Post by jackr » Tue Feb 13, 2007 6:04 pm

My experiance was the exact opposite. The doctor, and tech took as much time with me as needed and made sure I understood everything I had asked about.

When I told them I plan on buying online they had no problem with it. It didnt seem like a racket to me. I guess I got lucky.

I found a doctor off the internet and then after I saw him it turns out that my brother and sister in law (who is a nurse) also saw the same guy. She went to him after being a nurse in his town for many years and knew his reputation.

I really did get lucky from what I am reading.

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NightHawkeye
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Post by NightHawkeye » Tue Feb 13, 2007 6:32 pm

Bamalady wrote:The Doctor's Report Card. What do you think?
Thanks for the link, Bamalady. I've got a couple of physicians in mind to provide feedback to.

From what I read on the website though, it only provides feedback to the doctor's office, but does not make results of the feedback generally available.

It appears that the results don't even go to any medical governing body. {sigh . . . }

From the website:

"Patients have a right to be treated respectfully and with the best medical practices available. Providing feedback to our medical providers helps them understand how well they have met, exceeded, or failed to meet those rights. Sharp patients know it’s important to provide feedback to their doctors about office visits, quality of care, and ability to communicate with the doctor and his/her staff.

The DiagKNOWsis Doctor’s Report Card is a good tool for patients and professionals.
A patient fills it out, grades the doctor and his/her staff, and sends it directly to the doctor."

Despite the shortcomings though, I hope it's better than nothing.

Regards,
Bill

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NightHawkeye
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Post by NightHawkeye » Tue Feb 13, 2007 6:54 pm

SaLeepy wrote:The population of this board undoubtedly is an accurate relection of the population as a whole.
Arguably, this board is a skewed population in many respects, however, the overriding fact that not even 50% of diagnosed apnea patients find CPAP therapy tolerable strongly suggests that the population here may not be nearly as skewed as you might like to believe. Almost every day, people literally stumble in here with the most basic of questions and needs, few of which reflect positively on the medical community.

Yet, if you accept the premise that folks here are more capable than the general population, then you also need to accept the fact that, being more capable, many of these same folks, arguably 50% of them, would have found a way to become compliant with their therapy even without benefit of this forum. Hence, the conclusion that this group represents the general population, at least in terms of what their compliance would have been without this forum.

At least that's my observation, having watched the comings and goings here with great interest for over a year now.

Regards,
Bill (. . . making apologies to no one for having an opinion on the matter)


msteve
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Post by msteve » Tue Feb 13, 2007 7:20 pm

Perhaps I'm just in a negative mood this evening; but I tend to agree with the folks who think the sleep apnea treatment thing is a racket. I live in the SE suburbs of Chicago. My primary care physician sent me to the sleep clinic at the big local hospital where I spent two nights being tested and titrated under the watchful eye of a technician. The doctor who runs the place examined my test results and wrote my prescription without ever seeing me or consulting with me then or after.

Even though I had major problems (due to mouth breathing) neither the sleep doctor, the sleep clinic, nor the DME were responsive or forthcoming with any positive suggestions about what to do. They had received their insurance payments for the testing, the diagnosis and the sale of the equipment and clearly did not care whether I was compliant or not. They did not demonstrate any care for whether my treatment helped me.

Even my primary care physician did not discuss CPAP with me until I made an appointment to talk to him about it because by then I was livid and raging. Here I was being treated for a condition which no one had explained and I even had to figure out how to adjust my mask by going to the manufacturers Internet web site.

Racket? I think so.


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SaLeepy
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Post by SaLeepy » Tue Feb 13, 2007 8:25 pm

Arguably, this board is a skewed population in many respects
Stands to reason, yes.

however, the overriding fact that not even 50% of diagnosed apnea patients find CPAP therapy tolerable strongly suggests that the population here may not be nearly as skewed
low tolerance for CPAP strongly suggests that compliance is tough. Difficulty with compliance does not strongly suggest that our own board's population, or number or quality of posts, is skewed in any predictable direction.

Almost every day, people literally stumble in here with the most basic of questions and needs, few of which reflect positively on the medical community.
Almost every day, far more people than the few who stumble in here are unaccounted for.

A board like this would certainly be more likely to draw the people that are having problems, unless you would posit that a disproportionately large number of satisfied patients would come here so that they may speak passionately of their satisfaction with their care, and continue to seek answers as to how to they managed to do it.

Yet, if you accept the premise that folks here are more capable than the general population
That would be an interesting premise, yes. Is it yours?

you also need to accept the fact that, being more capable, many of these same folks, arguably 50% of them, would have found a way to become compliant with their therapy even without benefit of this forum.
My opinon is that we need to accept the fact that "facts" come when verifiable evidence is presented, not from premises and the opinions that accompany them no matter how strongly stated.

Hence, the conclusion
. . . more specifically, your conclusion

that this group represents the general population, at least in terms of what their compliance would have been without this forum
Interesting speculation. You could be right. Or wrong. Depends on whether your multiple premises are accepted, and quite a lot more. Conjecture and Conclusion sound so similar, but are worlds apart.

At least that's my observation, having watched the comings and goings here with great interest for over a year now.
Life is funny like that. The more that you look for what you seek, the more frequently that you will find it.

Regards,
Bill (. . . making apologies to no one for having an opinion on the matter)
Doesn't sound like you'd have any reason to suspect that you would owe an apology for having an opinon. My "opinion" is that it is curious that you feel the need to alert us about that . . .


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NightHawkeye
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Post by NightHawkeye » Tue Feb 13, 2007 8:34 pm

SaLeepy wrote:Doesn't sound like you'd have any reason to suspect that you would owe an apology for having an opinon. My "opinion" is that it is curious that you feel the need to alert us about that . . .
Having been recently lambasted for opinions which were not sufficiently caveated to the likings of others (as you have caveated my foregoing work in great detail), I just wanted to make sure that that no one mistook my chicken-scratchings for a disciplined scientific treatise. .

Regards,
Bill

SaLeepy
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Post by SaLeepy » Tue Feb 13, 2007 9:12 pm

It appears that the results don't even go to any medical governing body. {sigh . . . }
Nor does it appear that is the intent:
From the website:
Providing feedback to our medical providers helps them understand how well they have met, exceeded, or failed to meet those rights. Sharp patients know it’s important to provide feedback to their doctors about office visits, quality of care, and ability to communicate with the doctor and his/her staff.


On the other hand, if you do want your complaints to go to a "medical governing body", you'd actually have to send them to one. {sigh . . . }
http://www.hcqualitycommission.gov/cborr/chap7.html
http://www.doh.wa.gov/Publicat/DOH-faq.htm#Bookmark%207 (each state has something similar of course)

Who knew?

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NightHawkeye
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Post by NightHawkeye » Tue Feb 13, 2007 9:23 pm

SaLeepy wrote:On the other hand, if you do want your complaints to go to a "medical governing body", you'd actually have to send them to one. {sigh . . . }
Indeed, and if one is dissatisfied enough, as many apparently have been in recent years, then one files the complaint through a lawyer.

Regards,
Bill ( . . . thinking something about the lesser of two weavils)

SaLeepy
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Post by SaLeepy » Tue Feb 13, 2007 9:24 pm

NightHawkeye wrote:I just wanted to make sure that that no one mistook my chicken-scratchings for a disciplined scientific treatise.
It doesn't seem likely from what I've read, but who knows.
I applaud your willingness to label your opinons as just that. It's admirable.

.

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NightHawkeye
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Post by NightHawkeye » Tue Feb 13, 2007 9:37 pm

So, SaLeepy, being knowledgeable about the medical profession, as you clearly are, can you offer us less fortunate folks some good methods for finding "good" physicians? Just a few pointers to help folks on this board out would be immensely useful, I'm sure, and much appreciated.

Regards,
Bill