Doctor told me "some people just don't tolerate CPAP"

Stom wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 16, 2018 12:18 pm

From my perspective, palerider belittled the OP.

I respect your perspective. PR's communication style isn't perfect. But neither is mine. Heck, neither is Pugsy's, for that matter. I read PR's comments in this thread as being an informative attempt at explaining, in old-school fashion, that pushing back argumentatively as a style when asking for help could alienate experienced posters like himself in a forum such as this one.

If I had a choice between (1) a guy with useful info and (2) a guy with a gentle bedside manner, I would choose useful info every time, although I fully respect the preference of those who would choose the latter. Ideally one would get a perfect balance of both in one guy, but life rarely works that way. Thus the benefit of a variety of styles in any one forum.

Personally, I deeply respect and applaud the strides PR has made in showing increasing amounts of restraint and patience in recent months when dealing with new members. That, sir, is my perspective, for whatever it is or isn't worth to you.

jnk... wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 16, 2018 1:02 pm

a troll wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 16, 2018 12:18 pm

From my perspective, palerider belittled the OP.

PR's communication style isn't perfect. Neither is mine. Heck, neither is Pugsy's, for that matter. But I read PR's comments in this thread as being an informative attempt at explaining, in old-school fashion, that pushing back argumentatively as a style when asking for help could alienate experienced posters like himself in a forum such as this one.

If I had a choice between (1) a guy with useful info and (2) a guy with a gentle bedside manner, I would choose useful info every time, although I fully respect the preference of those who would choose the latter. Ideally one would get a perfect balance of that in one guy, but life rarely works that way. Thus the benefit of a variety of styles in any one forum.

Personally, I deeply respect and applaud the strides PR has made in showing increasing amounts of restraint and patience in recent months when dealing with new members. That, sir, is my perspective, for whatever it is or isn't worth to you.

I may be delusional, but from my perspective, I've always been more than happy to share information with anybody, newbie and veteran alike, that wanted to benefit from the information.

What I've never had any patience for is people who just want to argue, people who spread misinformation, people who seemingly don't want to learn, people who ... I don't know, just want to show everybody how smart they think they are.... and those that are just here to criticize others.

If that makes me a bad person in the eyes of some trolls, ... well, I'm ok with that.

palerider wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 16, 2018 1:15 pm

If that makes me a bad person in the eyes of some trolls, ... well, I'm ok with that

You are comfortable in your own skin. Not everyone is. Especially not those whose circumstances force them to expose themselves by asking for help on the Internet.

Your vast amount of knowledge makes you an authority figure who, intentionally or not, wields added power here--which makes you a target, yes, but more important, makes people feel especially vulnerable to your tone. A slight rebuke from you can affect people more than a tirade from someone else. Knowlege is power in more ways than one.

I admire what you do. I learn from you. I have seen your gentleness and care for others in action. I especially appreciate it every time you are careful and employ your tact and humor instead of reaching for a hammer. Your stature here means that your simply saying "I don't agree" is hammer enough.

Thanks for being here. I will always welcome any suggestions from you for keeping my posts accurate and helpful. Please never hesitate to disagree with me.

jnk... wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 16, 2018 1:33 pm

Please never hesitate to disagree with me.

Well, in all honesty, if you want me to disagree with you more, then you're going to have to work at being less accurate.

I've always respected your posts and opinions because, as far as I can tell, you don't go around mouthing off about things you have only a superficial understanding of.

There's a number of people that read a lot of things, find published studies, and read them, but then don't *understand* them... they don't understand the meaning of the lingo, but then they start acting like they're the new expert and set out to impress everybody with their 'knowledge' (misinformation).

I've never gotten that impression from you. You're always clear about your limits of understanding on a subject... Or, as Confucius said, "Real knowledge is to know the extent of one's ignorance"

Stom wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 16, 2018 12:18 pm

If the purpose is to help it doesn't really matter how much one knows if newbies are driven out of forum with rudeness. There's more to helping people than showing off. From my perspective, palerider belittled the OP. Now there is cheering for how great palerider is and giving him an explicit pass for being less than nice, which isn't really going to encourage the OP to come back for additional information.

I do not disagree but the forum owners decided to give him a free pass. If we do not like it we either tolerate it or leave and take our CPAP business elsewhere.

prodigyplace wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 16, 2018 2:20 pm

I do not disagree but the forum owners decided to give him a free pass. If we do not like it we either tolerate it or leave and take our CPAP business elsewhere.

I'd say it's more complicated than that. While one must accept that the mods will not do anything because it's explicitly a lightly modded forum by the owner's preference, conversely we are thus also free to call out behavior we think is indecorous and turns off new posters to the forum. We as forum users don't have to "accept" such behavior per se. It would be an egregious inconsistency to allow indecorous behavior as part of a lightly modded forum, but to prohibit the pointing out of such behavior. To do so would be to actively steer the forum in the direction of indecorous behavior rather than being a "neutral", lightly modded forum.

Frankly, I don't think this thread is that bad, but I do think that the OP got turned off by the tone of the back and forth, something that could have been avoided with less snark.

Stom wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 16, 2018 2:36 pm

something that could have been avoided with less snark.

Many of the most helpful posters moved to this forum to get away from the forums that have banned snarky expressions of truth. Perhaps some of us tend to revel in that distinction in a somewhat overbalanced manner.

Just an observation, not an excuse.

palerider wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 16, 2018 2:14 pm

if you want me to disagree with you more, then you're going to have to work at being less accurate.

I'll see what I can do.

To me, the value of this forum is that it has an underlying feel of peer review but without fully succumbing to the evils of groupthink, which I consider to be rampant in the OSA forums with a rigid, formal, authoritative hierarchy.

When I see "Doctor told me........" I think of some of these old advertisements.......









Den

.

jnk... wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 16, 2018 3:06 pm

palerider wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 16, 2018 2:14 pm

if you want me to disagree with you more, then you're going to have to work at being less accurate.

I'll see what I can do.

To me, the value of this forum is that it has an underlying feel of peer review but without fully succumbing to the evils of groupthink, which I consider to be rampant in the OSA forums with a rigid, formal, authoritative hierarchy.

Indeed... What I don't understand is why the people that whine about the 'atmosphere' and 'behavior' on this forum don't simply GO SOMEWHERE ELSE, instead of trying to drag this forum down into the mediocrity of, say, apneabored.

Let snarch speak for snarch.

snarch wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 16, 2018 12:48 am

I hope to hear from you (palerider) again on my next post after I do some homework on CAs and play with the epr.

ChicagoGranny wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 16, 2018 4:25 pm

Let snarch speak for snarch.

snarch wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 16, 2018 12:48 am

I hope to hear from you (palerider) again on my next post after I do some homework on CAs and play with the epr.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^ THIS!

snarch wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 16, 2018 12:48 am

I do some homework on CAs

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3417331/

I fail to see what the big fuss is, according to a few members here, concerning palerider and his 'bedside manner' so to speak.
I would much rather get the facts from someone with experience, than to be be dazzled with BS by an inexperienced person that is full of poetic responses, and wants to pretend to be an expert.

I'm far from an expert, although I understand the basics now, but I stay away from giving people advice. There are folks here that are far more informed and experienced than I am, and I leave it to them to dispense the important stuff.

I was, and still am, appreciative of the help that I have received from Pugsy, palerider, and a few others on this board, regardless of the differences in personality.

palerider wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 16, 2018 3:49 pm

Indeed... What I don't understand is why the people that whine about the 'atmosphere' and 'behavior' on this forum don't simply GO SOMEWHERE ELSE, instead of trying to drag this forum down into the mediocrity of, say, apneabored.

I generally find exhortations to "love it or leave it" to be excuses to never improve. This is mostly a great place, but that doesn't mean it can't be better.