Newbie with many masks........

zonker wrote: ↑

Sat Jul 28, 2018 11:25 am

[quote=realshelby post_id=1260965 time=1532779775 user_id=87694
I didn't use the N20 last night as planned, my P10 came in! Very small and light. Done well with it last night but seemed to have several leak episodes. I did "butter" up my nostrils heavily with lanolin creme. That might be part of the problem as it seemed to slide too easily out of position. I will work on that tonight. Too early to tell if it would/could replace the Brevida.

yeah, you really don't want to do that. ask pugsy; she says she lathered on the lanolin and woke up in the middle of the night with her p10 in her ear!



a little dab'll do ya, as the kids today say....
[/quote]

Pugsy wrote: ↑

Tue Jul 31, 2018 7:36 am

I almost made the Brevida my primary mask and have the P10 fall to the number 2 spot.
I think I actually used it for 3 months.
The only thing keeping it from being number one was the inflate/deflate thing the pillows did with inhale and exhale (and for some people this isn't a problem) that I found slightly annoying. I could eventually tune it out though...so not a huge issue but that along with the overall slightly more bulkiness of the pillow compared to the P10 eventually caused me to go back to the P10. I simply prefer as little on my face as humanly possible and the slightly smaller footprint of the P10 pillows over the Brevida pillow won out.
It was a very close race though. I would say the P10 won by inches.

Apparently, the P10 also blows in your ear when your husband is away on the road.

Pugsy, try the Brevida without the diffuser one time. It lessens the movement of the pillow on exhalation slightly. There is less resistance to breathe coming out without the diffuser. I had gotten used to the pillows moving a bit and it didn't bother me. I do think I breathe better overall with the diffuser off, last night it was on and it felt ok. I don't have a problem with exhalation, but sometimes it felt like I was not inhaling air easy enough. I don't run much pressure compared to some. What I did learn was that confidence in the mask to stay in place and not leak much even when side sleeping is important. The Bravida is by FAR the best at this of all I have tried. Since the P10 is so small, it does very well at this too. I will probably run the P10 for several days at least unless my nostrils tell me otherwise. I will say that the larger size of the Bravida comes with the advantage of hardly any pressure on the nostrils!

realshelby wrote: ↑

Tue Jul 31, 2018 7:49 am

Pugsy, try the Brevida without the diffuser one time.

Actually I did try it with the diffuser removed. In all honesty I don't remember what it did with the inflate/deflate thing but the extra noise was a deal breaker for me. I didn't even try to sleep with it off...too noisy for me.
Not to mention without the diffuser hubby would like get cold air in his face and back from the venting.
He never complained about it with the Swift FX but when I changed to the P10 he made the comment
"Are you using a different mask? I no longer get the jet stream of cold air in my face or on my back. It's kinda nice not to have that happen".
So while he never complained...it did happen and it was annoying to him.

I learned a long time ago that I would give up a little stability for "less on my face and head"....so while the P10 moves around a little sometimes and the Brevida probably didn't...
It's all in our own personal priorities and for me the P10 still ticks off the most boxes. The Brevida was close though and for me to give it 3 months was saying something but in the end stability was less important to me than the inflate/deflate thing combined with the slightly large pillow footprint of the Brevida. Very minor I know but enough to tip the scale for me. I did keep the Brevida for a long time just in case I ever wanted to use it again but as with any mask that I do that with...I don't ever use it again and I think I finally gave the Brevida away to someone who wanted to try it and had no money.

Things have improved!

I have not ordered a mask in....about two weeks now!

Earlier I had written about the Nuance Pro. Best headgear I have used. But I had issues with the gel pillows, especially when I lubed up a bit with Lanolin. Well, got to thinking about that and tried it again. Always clean the masks every day with soap and water. I actually washed my nose area before going to bed to insure no oils were there. That makes a LOT of difference in how the Nuance Pro fits and stays in place! This mask actually shows the lowest leak rates of any on Sleepyhead reports. Last night, after about 7 hours, it seemed to start moving and leaking a bit. I think I was sweating or something. Still, I can say I could use this mask if needed. But I think there are better alternatives.

Used the Bravido some more. This is a very comfortable mask. Seems secure and seems like it doesn't leak much. But Sleepyhead says it leaks more than the Nuance or P10. It is still an acceptable amount, just different. What I did notice was that you might sweat in the nose area a bit under certain circumstances. Like if the A/C isn't running a lot or air movement in the bedroom makes it a bit stuffy. I noticed that because the mask seemed to move around a bit the last night I used it. Though to check, and under it my skin was sort of damp. So, that is something to consider. Still a very good design that I could use every day if that was what I had to use.

Back to the P10 for a while. I am going to try the Large pillows for one night. Just because I want to. This mask is going to be about impossible to beat overall. That is part of why I went back to the others to try them. Just confirming that the P10 is going to end up as my full time mask. This mask is quiet. Maybe not quite as quiet as the Bravido with the diffuser in use, but it is VERY quiet. The short tube is the best in the business! No swivel, and better for it. The Bravido swivel is a ball socket. Which sounds fine but actually bad about sticking in place and not moving. Others that swivel might seem to be a good thing, but the P10 hose is so flexible and light it makes up for ANY swivel option in my opinion. This helps give it a lower profile, which means you don't get as much movement when it is against a pillow. Regardless, the P10 seems like it is the MOST secure mask as far as being pushed out of place by pillows or the hose being tugged on compared to every other mask I have tried.

Yes, it might seem like I have tried every mask looking for perfection. I know there is no such thing. But had I not tried something new, I don't know that I would have been so inclined to continue this. Now, with what I have learned, I look forward to going to sleep and having dreams like I did 30 years ago. I like not falling asleep, or wanting to, throughout the day. I want to do things that I have put off because I was just not "feeling like it".

That is priceless!

I guess I lucked out, as the Brevida was the second mask I tried. I have been using it since with much success, and very little leakage.

On the rare occasion that I get a sinus issue, or like last year with the flu,....I use a Simplus FFM for a few days, or if my nose is running really badly, I go without cpap totally. (I only have mild/moderate apnea as in 16 AHI btw)

Well, time for another mask review! I think this made 9 different masks...

F20, N20, Dreamwear gel pillow, Dreamwear nasal, Dreamwear full face, Bravida, Nuance Pro, P10, and now....

The Swift FX

The reason I wanted to try this was that it seems to have nearly the same nasal pillows as the P 10 does. Made by the same company. I thought the headgear would make the mask more stable over the P 10. You can think or decide or whatever you want to do, but until you use it there simply isn't anything that matters. BTW, none of these masks, all in sealed factory packaging, were bought needing a prescription.

The Swift FX is one of if not the leader in sales for many years. That may change with the P 10 chasing it. There is a reason these sell well. I will say that the nasal pillows of these two are the best setup out of all the masks I use. The head gear on the Swift FX works very well. I would want to cut off the excess strapping sticking out past the binder on top of my head if I were to use this full time. It does not sit quite as comfortable under the nose when compared to the P 10. It does seal well. But surprisingly the heavier head gear does not seem to make it any more secure than the P 10. I thought that the silicone style piece that goes to the nose area would hold it in place better. But it seems to stick to your skin and actually push against the nose piece when laying on your side with head on a pillow. The P 10 has the cloth in this area and it allows the headgear to move a bit and actually keeps a seal better. I could live with the Swift FX if that is what I had to use.

But I am thankful I have better alternatives! One is that I have learned that I do NOT really care for a swivel. They can catch sometimes but my main problem is that they can turn upside down and actually blow onto you instead of away from you! This opinion of swivels isn't just for the Swift FX, I feel the same about the Bravida. But what I really cannot get around is how much air comes out of the venting of the mask! It is the most of any of the masks I have used. There is noise with this much airflow. I found it woke me up many times blowing on me during the night.

I know everyone is different. I try to be subjective with these reviews of masks. I know everyone cannot go out and buy a mask just to try. Maybe this will help keep someone from getting a mask they won't like.

I have been using the CPAP for a bit over 3 months now. 100% "compliance". I told myself to do what I needed to do to keep using it. I feel a lot better using it and have from the first day. I appreciate the knowledge and information here!

Which led me to my changing my pressure settings. Prescription was 4-20. Was on that for about 3 months. Went up to 5-20. Doesn't seem like much. But take a look at my report from Sleepy head. I think that says the change was beneficial:

Changes to Prescription Settings
First Last Days AHI FL Machine Pressure Relief Mode Pressure Settings
Thu Aug 30 2018 Mon Sep 17 2018 19 0.89 0.00 AutoSet (37028) EPR: Full Time 3cmH2O APAP Min 5 Max 20 (cmH2O)
Tue Jun 5 2018 Wed Aug 29 2018 86 1.59 0.00 AutoSet (37028) EPR: Full Time 3cmH2O APAP Min 4 Max 20 (cmH2O)

86 days at my "prescription" setting with an AHI of 1.59. Then 19 days at 5-20 with an AHI average of .89. My average pressure at 90% is 6.9 with the peak of 10.42 over the past month.

I get 2-3 Centrals on average. Sometimes none. I figure some/most are false. Others are OA's and H's. I feel good and actually seem to breathe better with this setting. I think an average under 1 AHI is pretty good. I also don't want to be tempted to chase the rainbow to get it lower. I don't think I feel better at this setting, I do think I breathe easier however. So, should I just leave it as is?

You feel better, you are breathing better and your AHI is below 1.....why are you even asking?

realshelby wrote: ↑

Tue Sep 18, 2018 7:02 am

I do think I breathe easier however.

This alone would answer the question for me.

What are your goals?

Goals? To put on the mask, turn on the machine and not have to worry about anything until the next morning when I take it off. That is part of the "many masks". I think I have proven the P 10 is the best compromise I will find. For me. The machine settings have been left alone until I felt the other factors were as good as they were likely to get. Changing the machine seems to show lower AHI averages by a decent amount. I was hoping it would and pleased that it did. But what I do NOT want to get into is chasing a rainbow or otherwise known as trying to get a zero AHI score. I feel good, and I think there isn't likely any improvement on that even at 0 AHI. I just would feel good if that would get confirmed! Easy to get consumed by trying to make things better.

Does lowering an AHI that is already averaging below "1" have any real benefits? That answer is what I am after.......

realshelby wrote: ↑

Tue Sep 18, 2018 12:16 pm

Does lowering an AHI that is already averaging below "1" have any real benefits? That answer is what I am after.......

And I can't give you a definite answer to that question because it also comes with that YMMV sticker.
For some people they say they can notice a difference in how they feel or sleep....others like myself, not so much so.
It also depends on what that AHI is composed of. I find that my AHI is elevated mainly from central flags on the nights where my back is bothering me worse than usual. So I go look at those flagged events and pretty much every single one of them is SWJ and not real.
The other day I zoomed in on all my events where my AHI was 1.82 for the night of about 6 hours. Every single one of them wasn't real. They were all SWJ....even had a handful of OAs and hyponeas in there that weren't real.
Essentially my AHI was 0.0 if I remove the SWJ non real flagged events but I still slept like crap but it was because of the pain and not the sleep apnea stuff.

A nice low number doesn't guarantee you much except a nice math score and maybe a chance to pat yourself on the back.
If that is important to you...then by all means strive for it and a lot of people find it is very important to them.
Me...not so much. One of my very best days in terms of how I felt during the day followed a night with the AHI of 10.2. Go figure that one.

My goals...probably different from some people but I just want to have the OSA stuff decently controlled with leaks that don't wake me up. I want to sleep as best I can given the other stuff that messes with my sleep and feel the best I can during the day given that other stuff seems to really put a damper on my hours of sleep which is critical for how I feel during the day.
I don't sweat an ugly leak line as long as I slept through the leaks. I don't sweat a higher than usual AHI because 99% of the time it's higher because of SWJ not asleep flagged events or post arousal flagged events.

AHI of 0.0 doesn't guarantee much of anything except maybe some bragging rights and I long ago stopped needing those rights.
The best numbers in the world don't mean squat if you feel like crap because you slept like crap and that includes going to extraordinary measures to obtain that "perfect" leak graph. I can get a prettier leak graph but I sacrifice sleep quality when I do that and again sleep quality is really my main goal because without decent sleep quality and hours of sleep the rest of the stuff doesn't really matter all that much to me.

I think that is the answer or confirmation I am after. I am very lucky to be able to run the pressure I do and get the results I do. Later on I may have to make changes. But I don't think I need to chase the zero AHI score.

I have not had the issues with mask leaks many here have. I average under 2L per minute leak rate. Not much to improve or change there.

Thanks, sometimes you just need to hear that you are on the right track.

realshelby wrote: ↑

Tue Sep 18, 2018 12:16 pm

Does lowering an AHI that is already averaging below "1" have any real benefits? That answer is what I am after.......

If you're not more disturbed by doing so, sure... less sleep interruptions is better.

However, "how much better" is the issue... It's a classic case of the law of diminishing returns. Your sleep will be better, (all things being equal) if your AHI is lower, but will it be a noticeable better? I know mine's above 1.5-2, then I feel worse the next day, but pretty much anything below 1.5... I don't really *feel* any difference.

I had an AHI of 1.8 last night. Highest in quite a while. Took two Advil about an hour before I went to bed, been doing some hard work that had my muscles a bit sore.

Best night of sleep I have had in a while! Didn't get up one time for a bathroom break, lately that has been once or twice per night. Dreamed all night. Feel good this morning.

So chasing the low AHI isn't the real goal. How you feel is. I think I have everything working well. Don't even have an urge to try a new mask. Unless something brand new in the nasal pillow design comes out!