Why is 'effort' not considered an alternate?

Exercise and (needed) weight loss DO help, but not necessarily where you most want it to,
like those stubborn belly rolls, saddle bags, and sleep apnea.
Nature is cruel.

It's a funny thing. When I started CPAP I was 112kg, so I decided to exercise and diet, as well as keep with my CPAP therapy.

I'm now 86kg, I regularly run and recent records are 52:00 10km and a 2:01:xx half marathon. I've also got a black belt in Taekwon Do that I now also teach. My resting pulse is under 50pm and I'm fitter than in my pre CPAP years... and yet a sleep study last year showed minor AHI improvement.

The low down.. I still need my CPAP. It's just the way my throat is shaped.

So just be careful about anyone trying to sell you an "exercise is all you need to be 'cured'"

My 2 cents

Mogy wrote:Hi Jimw159,
I agree that xPAP requires effort.
The question is more directed to alternative or adjunct treatments.
This study says that 54 percent were compliant using xPAP.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2679572/

At lot of people are falling through the cracks.
I don't believe that they are all quitters.
Are drugs and surgery the only alternatives for these people?
Is there no other alternative that warrants mentioning?

I believe that many of the people who fail at xpap were not given good help from a doctor or DME. They didn't find a forum like this one. They were sent home with a machine that was set to start too low and/or wide open. Many of them felt like they were suffocating and never got past that. They didn't have somebody who could help them find the right settings, the right mask, etc. They were doomed to fail by a system that is not designed to help them succeed.

Seeing BanjoPaterson's reply has got me thinking about my dad who used to run marathons right up until he was almost 70 years old.

One race he ran for many years was the Comrades Marathon, 90kms this race is brutal .... https://www.brandsouthafrica.com/people ... s-marathon

At the 1986 race, a nurse's station was set up and folks could have their BP taken. My dad had his taken before the race started and it was 190/100. The nurses urged him not to run, but he did anyway, and his best time ever! (06:59.29) He still gets a kick out of this.

At that time not a single doctor wondered why a top notch athlete like him had resistant hypertension, nor did they ask if he snored (yes, loudly and often), or woke up gasping for breath (yes) and had anyone reported seeing him stop breathing while asleep (yes). Not to mention the multiple trips to the bathroom at night.

OSA was not on the radar back then I guess?

For sure he had (and still has) OSA and no amount of exercise could address whatever was causing this. Not even training for a 90km race for months and months at a time.

Arlene1963 wrote:OSA was not on the radar back then I guess?

Nice story, Arlene.

The first commercial CPAP was introduced in 1981. By 1986, there was only a small market penetration, and sleep labs were rare.

BTW, your father may have loved running because he had sleep apnea:

People who don’t sleep efficiently will take measures during the day to compensate for their inability to stay focused or stay awake. Some people drink lots of coffee. Others exercise like crazy. Some even become olympic swimming or ballroom dancing champions.

... Many long distance runners feel alive only when they’re running. It’s shocking how often people who are addicted to endurance sports can’t or prefer not to sleep on their backs.

http://doctorstevenpark.com/tim-ferris-adhd-sleep-apnea

Yes, I am overweight. Yes, my apnea might go away if I lost weight. Yes, I am north of 60. I have not been able to lose weight and keep it off successfully so I have this condition. I choose to treat it with a machine and keep looking for a way to lose weight and keep it off. In the meantime, I will use my machine faithfully.

lathnos46 wrote:Yes, I am overweight. Yes, my apnea might go away if I lost weight. Yes, I am north of 60. I have not been able to lose weight and keep it off successfully so I have this condition. I choose to treat it with a machine and keep looking for a way to lose weight and keep it off. In the meantime, I will use my machine faithfully.

Losing weight would help many of our lives, as far as stopping the need to treat our sleep apnea, not likely, believe in Pie in the Sky, if it helps you, but reality always wins. Best of luck, I'll keep using XPAP also. Jim

Arlene1963 wrote:Seeing BanjoPaterson's reply has got me thinking about my dad who used to run marathons right up until he was almost 70 years old.

One race he ran for many years was the Comrades Marathon, 90kms this race is brutal .... https://www.brandsouthafrica.com/people ... s-marathon

At the 1986 race, a nurse's station was set up and folks could have their BP taken. My dad had his taken before the race started and it was 190/100. The nurses urged him not to run, but he did anyway, and his best time ever! (06:59.29) He still gets a kick out of this.

At that time not a single doctor wondered why a top notch athlete like him had resistant hypertension, nor did they ask if he snored (yes, loudly and often), or woke up gasping for breath (yes) and had anyone reported seeing him stop breathing while asleep (yes). Not to mention the multiple trips to the bathroom at night.

OSA was not on the radar back then I guess?

For sure he had (and still has) OSA (emphasis added) and no amount of exercise could address whatever was causing this. Not even training for a 90km race for months and months at a time.

Has he gotten tested since? Has he started on PAP yet?

Feel great with ketogenic diet...have lost about 50 lbs. now, about 25% of my original weight, and kept it off about a year so far. Lots of exercise, both aerobic and non-aerobic. Still have moderate apnea, though, no change in that. So, for me, while I wasn't expecting to lose the apnea with the weight, losing the weight and lower blood pressure and pulse rate is fine with me *smile*.

JimW159 wrote:
Has he gotten tested since? Has he started on PAP yet?

Hi JimW,

Unfortunately he had never heard of OSA prior to my diagnosis in 2015.

When I suggested that he probably has OSA based on a lifetime of classic OSA symptoms (including falling asleep very easily during the day, and this is getting worse with age) and also his co-morbidities of resistant hypertension (since his mid 30s), AFIB (diagnosed in his late 50s/early 60s), high cholesterol (since his early 50s,) and a recent history of small strokes, he totally dismissed (laughed in my face actually) the idea.

My bet is that he's had SDB since he was in his early 30s. He put on quite a bit of weight before age 40, and decided to start running as a way of losing weight at around that age, which he did for the rest of his life, right up until now in his early 80s.

My dad and I have very similar facial structures, possibly a small jaw and large tongue is the reason for our SDB.

It upsets me that his doctor never mentioned the possibility of a sleep study ever, even in recent times when sleep apnea has received much more attention. Maybe if it came from a doctor he would take it seriously, but not from his daughter.