xxyzx and Morbius Spam Buttons Removed

Grace~~~ wrote:I believe they found that pre-moderation still has clumps of moderation in it and can be just as potent as full on moderation?

Pre-moderation IS "full on moderation".

What should be employed is "Reactive" or "Distributive" moderation.

Clearly, the most important (read: "only") consideration for a moderation system here is that it costs somewhere between "cheap" and "free" and/or helps contribute to the bottom line.

xxyzx wrote:

Pugsy wrote:

TASmart wrote:Welcome to a pretty impressive group pugsy. The only issue is the et al means others, but in this case, more likely means every poster who ever posts. Anyway, I am awed to be in the same company as you.

I have always been there with you more than most people ever know.
I hate seeing people getting picked on for no reason.

OH...in case anyone is wondering what started this war between me and the alphabet child/baby.
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=156993&start=0&st=0 ... w#p1201476
He got mean and nasty to a newbie and it's one thing for the forum veterans to be duking it out with him but it's another thing to go picking on a newbie. I see red when people do that. He was being a bully and I called him out on it. He didn't like what I said but I don't really care. I knew what his response would be. I will take a lot of crap but I won't let newbies be mistreated. That is NOT what this forum is about.

Now I know a lot of you are frustrated with the poster in that thread...but she's a newbie and she is trying and that's all it takes for me to try to help someone even if there are extra challenges involved. Picking on a newbie will get my dander up quicker than attacking me directly.
If you can't say something positive or helpful...just don't say anything. Calling her a moron or stupid isn't the way we treat newbies around here.

=====

it was started by palerider
who also posts as lsat and tasmart

once he started bullying and spreading lies about my posts
others joined in thinking somehow a mob mentality shark attack was somehow good

xxyzx still has not admitted that he posts as AMESS

LSAT wrote:xxyzx still has not admitted that he posts as AMESS

At first I thought that was nonsense. However, the more I thought about it... and since nothing surprises me here...


However, if that isn't the case, I apologize to AMESS.

LSAT wrote:xxyzx still has not admitted that he posts as AMESS

You can't really expect a deranged lunatic to admit to anything.

Howdy,

I care about CPAPtalk and its mission.

I don't agree with most who have posted to this thread though. I think a moderated forum loses its ability to talk strait at things, which is often what is lacking in other mediums of support. If we moderate we cross a line and are forever changed. From that time forward, someone else will decide for each individual what may be said and what may not be. Most have called for this change, and there have been abuses, but I'd consider we'd have lost something special if we did it.

So then, what values does this forum stand for? My personal values, the values of the majority or whatever dictated values result in the greatest number of newbies helped with the most effective information?

You could argue I'm already dictating values, just with a light enforcement touch. I am the only one with a ban button and its use or lack of use doesn't make that less true.

You could also argue this forum has been successful exactly because it has worked on its mission in a way which is outside of the majority opinion and that changing that is bad.

What I do know is that emotions are high and that's never a good time to make a good long term decision.

I will continue to read this thread and think on this.

Johnny

johnnygoodman wrote:(snip)
Most have called for this change, and there have been abuses, but I'd consider we'd have lost something special if we did it.

I fail to see what is so 'special' about harassment and abuse.

This has nothing to do with opinions about treatment; what is or is not effective. There have been instances of members following other members into threads with the (seemingly) sole intent of harassing them. They offer no opinion relevant to the thread, only spewing hatefulness at their target. And I am speaking about what I saw being done to xxyzx.

There is no reason that this behavior needs to be tolerated. Stopping this behavior is not in conflict with providing unbiased information about cpap treatment.

johnnygoodman wrote:So then, what values does this forum stand for?

Apparently as a haven for bullies.

Thank you, Johnny, for your thoughtful response.

johnnygoodman wrote:I think a moderated forum loses its ability to talk strait at things, which is often what is lacking in other mediums of support.

But here I have to ask, "What discussion about CPAP use would be adversely affected even in the most strictly moderated forum?" In 23 years of active involvement in the diagnosis and treatment of sleep disorders, the most controversial issue I have seen is whether or not patients have the right to make changes to their own therapy. And TTBOMK, all of those discussions have been pretty civil.

I don't believe anyone wants ANY sleep-related issues to be moderated.

Rather, it is the insults, vulgarity and disrespect that (if I may be so bold to say) concerns people.

I will respect your values and their application to this board. However, are these really your values? When you and you family are sitting around the dinner table, are the terms "libtard", "fuck", "asshole", et al freely tossed around? Are there banners proclaiming family members' stupidity?

I am sure there are many examples that demonstrate my lapses as well. I take full responsibility for them.

At any rate, while the term moderation keeps being bandied about, this is more about maintaining basic respect and courtesy.

Meanwhile, some thoughts on "moderation":

Moderating

Without some form of moderation, your community will quickly descend into anarchy, and the atmosphere will probably become so unpleasant it will turn off potential new members.

I just got an email advertisement from cpap.com entitles, "Will You Invite Us In?"

I feel really conflicted right now. I wanted cpap.com to be a resource, hopefully for decently priced supplies. But my gut tells me to unsubscribe from their email list and move on.

It's a matter of principle. As a Texan, I'd thing you could understand and relate to that.

Johnny you are wise beyond your years and a wise business man.

Here are some "Moderation suggestions":
I think you already have a plan in mind already but in case you don't consider locking out everyone who tries to force your hand by being unruly. You know who they are and they are not here to help.

Something you should consider is to stop allowing those who have had their spam buttons removed already to create another username for any reason and also stop allowing any proxy servers access period. I think you would see things settle right down. You know there are a lot of repeat offenders making the noise and causing trouble.

Morbius wrote:Rather, it is the insults, vulgarity and disrespect that (if I may be so bold to say) concerns people.

I will respect your values and their application to this board. However, are these really your values? When you and you family are sitting around the dinner table, are the terms "libtard", "fuck", "asshole", et al freely tossed around? Are there banners proclaiming family members' stupidity?

In past years you have "freely tossed around" such words yourself, along with starting a poll a few years back pinning one person against another. I clearly remember reading that thread with disbelief because nothing was done to stop it. I would have to go back and find it, but I'm pretty sure the majority of those people are no longer here.

I know you have much knowledgeable about sleep apnea which has shown itself in response to people in distress. However, you have done the very thing you wish to see stopped here, along with being undeniably rude when it suited you.

I haven't always agreed with Johnny's way of doing things but I sure haven't insulted him the way you have. Along those lines, anyone who insults, intimidates and enjoys being hateful and nasty has no place on a forum that exists to help people.

Is this happening everywhere in the world?

...or is cpaptalk kinda rare?

It seems crazy to *me* that anyone would want to be moderated?

I can NOT wrap my mind around it?



~~~~as for folks being 'scared off' ... does that really seem like HUMAN NATURE?

If so ... we may be doomed.

Lucyhere wrote:

Morbius wrote:Rather, it is the insults, vulgarity and disrespect that (if I may be so bold to say) concerns people.

I will respect your values and their application to this board. However, are these really your values? When you and you family are sitting around the dinner table, are the terms "libtard", "fuck", "asshole", et al freely tossed around? Are there banners proclaiming family members' stupidity?

In past years you have "freely tossed around" such words yourself, along with starting a poll a few years back pinning one person against another. I clearly remember reading that thread with disbelief because nothing was done to stop it. I would have to go back and find it, but I'm pretty sure the majority of those people are no longer here.

I know you have much knowledgeable about sleep apnea which has shown itself in response to people in distress. However, you have done the very thing you wish to see stopped here, along with being undeniably rude when it suited you.

I haven't always agreed with Johnny's way of doing things but I sure haven't insulted him the way you have. Along those lines, anyone who insults, intimidates and enjoys being hateful and nasty has no place on a forum that exists to help people.

Agreed.

Morbius wrote:I am sure there are many examples that demonstrate my lapses as well. I take full responsibility for them.

johnnygoodman wrote:Howdy,

I care about CPAPtalk and its mission.

I don't agree with most who have posted to this thread though. I think a moderated forum loses its ability to talk strait at things, which is often what is lacking in other mediums of support. If we moderate we cross a line and are forever changed. From that time forward, someone else will decide for each individual what may be said and what may not be. Most have called for this change, and there have been abuses, but I'd consider we'd have lost something special if we did it.

So then, what values does this forum stand for? My personal values, the values of the majority or whatever dictated values result in the greatest number of newbies helped with the most effective information?

You could argue I'm already dictating values, just with a light enforcement touch. I am the only one with a ban button and its use or lack of use doesn't make that less true.

You could also argue this forum has been successful exactly because it has worked on its mission in a way which is outside of the majority opinion and that changing that is bad.

What I do know is that emotions are high and that's never a good time to make a good long term decision.

I will continue to read this thread and think on this.

Johnny

As a 11-year+ forum member, I applaud your decision to maintain the forum as it has always been.

The recent mainstream "politically correct" subculture would rather lose their freedom of expression than be offended .... and in the end, everybody will be offended by something until there is nothing left for anyone to do except keep our thoughts and ideas to ourselves and listen/watch the dark silence all around.

Thanks for what you have done for me and for what you do for everyone else.

The problem I continue to see is certain people "needing" to post on every thread that comes along. Often, these posts simply restate what was said previously. Others consider any disagreement with what they post as a personal affront to them. They cannot accept the idea that they just might be in error. Any contradiction to anything they post results in name calling and insults. Almost every thread gets hijacked by these people and degrades to a name calling match. People coming here for help have to wade through a lot of BS in order to get any useful information. I am amazed that newcomers stick around. Luckily, I developed a rather thick skin many years ago. I understand there are people who have a need to be the center of attention and have to be right all of the time. Having advanced degrees does not make a person smart. It merely means they had the tenacity to stay in school for a very long time. I am retired military with a masters degree in management and human relations. I have dealt with people like this in the past and do not like dealing with them, but have done so out of necessity. It is not necessary for me to stay on this forum and deal with them, but I will stick around a little longer only because I think I have a little knowledge that can be of use to someone just starting their treatment. I am not sure how much longer I will continue on this forum.