What data does my HC234 Keep?

Anonymous wrote:Dsm,
<snip>

dsm wrote:I have no doubt that this post will attract the usual anon & guest attacks and perhaps criticism from some regulars with vested interests, but I claim that I state facts and have the guts to stand behind them. Even against the obnoxious 'anons' & any attacking 'guests'.

If I wrote stuff like that, I would also "dread times when I am sure a comment will be pounced on by anons/guests." With those words, you are inviting the very attacks you say you dread.

<snip>

Anon,

Actually I agree re inviting the very thing one is complaining about & removed those words about 4 hrs ago ? - am wondering how they now showed up in your post so many hours later

I stand by my opinion of the most useful data gathered by cpap machines.

If one gets analytical and detailed these are the values that really matter

1) AHI broken down into AI & HI at say 1 minute intervals during the night
2) Airflow being delivered in litres/min (most don't provide this)
3) Detected airflow leaks allowing for the fixed leak rate of the mask
4) The current pressure settings (esp so for Autos & Bilevels)
5) If possible, SpO2 readings & heartbeat from a Pulse Oximeter

Then there is the accuracy of the data. But that is another debate.

Unless one is a rocket scientist, any additional data is likely to be clutter.
Unless one is fixated on charts & stats the above data can be presented in 1 line chart or, selectively, in bar charts (line charts allow most different types of data to appear in the one chart).

Cheers DSM

Re vested interests - my definition of this is that if someone pays me either in money or gifts (read free machines) to write favourable reviews of said free machine(s), then it is a fair comment to say I have a vested interest. Anyone who has done this knows what I mean. Maybe it isn't any big deal but declaring one's vested interest is the honest way to publish such reports.

Do you have a position on such behaviour ?

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CPAPopedia Keywords Contained In This Post (Click For Definition): CPAP, AHI

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CPAPopedia Keywords Contained In This Post (Click For Definition): CPAP, AHI

dsm wrote:Re vested interests - my definition of this is that if someone pays me either in money or gifts (read free machines) to write favourable reviews of said free machine(s), then it is a fair comment to say I have a vested interest. Anyone who has done this knows what I mean. Maybe it isn't any big deal but declaring one's vested interest is the honest way to publish such reports.

dsm, I'm curious. Do you think that my being given a Respironics REMstar Auto with C-flex to try out when C-flex was introduced into the Auto, and my writing a review for cpap.com of my honest opinion about that machine means I had, or have, a "vested interest" in saying that I honestly like the REMstar Auto very much and like Encore Pro software?

Would it make any difference to you to know that I sent cpap.com a check in the amount of the full price for the Respironics REMstar Auto with C-Flex I was trying out because I wanted to buy it?

For the record, I already had a Respironics REMstar Auto that I bought and had been using for a year. I had already been using Encore Pro software. Given that I already liked the REMstar Auto and Encore Pro it's no surprise that I also liked the same machine when C-Flex was added. It was easy to write a favorable honest review.

Geeze.... "regulars with vested interests!"

rested gal wrote:

dsm wrote:Re vested interests - my definition of this is that if someone pays me either in money or gifts (read free machines) to write favourable reviews of said free machine(s), then it is a fair comment to say I have a vested interest. Anyone who has done this knows what I mean. Maybe it isn't any big deal but declaring one's vested interest is the honest way to publish such reports.

dsm, I'm curious. Do you think that my being given a Respironics REMstar Auto with C-flex to try out when C-flex was introduced into the Auto, and my writing a review for cpap.com of my honest opinion about that machine means I had, or have, a "vested interest" in saying that I honestly like the REMstar Auto very much and like Encore Pro software?

Would it make any difference to you to know that I sent cpap.com a check in the amount of the full price for the Respironics REMstar Auto with C-Flex I was trying out because I wanted to buy it?

For the record, I already had a Respironics REMstar Auto that I bought and had been using for a year. I had already been using Encore Pro software. Given that I already liked the REMstar Auto and Encore Pro it's no surprise that I also liked the same machine when C-Flex was added. It was easy to write a favorable honest review.

Geeze.... "regulars with vested interests!"

Rested Gal,

Lets not overreact here - no one accused you of anything ?

I was asked by a anon what I meant by vested interests & I responded !.

The issue that is on the plate is if people doing reviews of any gear here are being paid or given the goods in question in exchange for favourable reviews. Would you agree or not agree that anyone doing this should state up front the circumstances of any payment or gift in relation to any review they publish.

If you agree on this point then why even respond

Geeze.... "regulars with vested interests!"
- thee protesteth loudly - what prompted this ?

I haven't indulged in this practice & I sure hope no-one else here supports the notion nor does it.

Thats all.

DSM

I feel compelled to stand up in support of DSM. he has been a steadfast member of this forum and has posted SO MUCH valuable information and has developed SO MANY resources valuable to us all!!

He has drawn some criticism regarding a question that he has, appropriately I believe, raised regarding the possibility of "vested interests" amongst some who place posts advocating the purchase and use of one particular brand of equipment here. I will stand next to DSM in stating that I share his same concerns.

This forum, while unquestionably valuable to the larger community of xPAP and SDB patients and their families, is after all, sponsored and moderated by a retailer of xPAP equipment and supplies. The fact that they have a vested interest in selling equipment is patent and unquestioned. To the extent that they may have a vested interest in selling a particular brand of such equipment for contractual or other reasons should also be unquestioned as such arrangements are a normal part of the world of retail sales.

However, the almost monolithic adoration of Respironics equipment as represented by the posts of many of the users here, is worrisome to me. In my six months or so of participation in this forum, I couldn't help but notice that posts in support of other manufacturer's equipment, most particularly ResMed, are met with torrents of derision. At the same time, adverse comments about Respironics gear are similarly met with incendiary flames.

Now, we've all speculated openly on this forum from time to time, that manufacturer's representatives may frequently masquerade on this forum as users and give posts biased toward enhancing sales of the gear they represent. And, i take those posts with a grain of salt. I expect them , and I believe above all else here in the principle of CAVEAT EMPTOR.

But, I am also concerned about inducements that may be offered to respected, independent users in the form of eequipment provided for review purposes. Such HAS happened here in the past on a number of occasions. The proprietors of this site have even posted regarding their policies in doing so.

Many of those respected users who have participated in this practice have responded with outrage when they have felt that their integrity has been questioned. And, for many of them, I believe that they have been open and candid regarding their receipt of free equipment to the exstent that I DON'T question their integrity or the honesty of their posts.

But the problem is, I don't know how many of the rest of the "partisan" users here have received inducements here that we are NOT aware of. This information, I believe, is VITAL to my ability to evaluate the posts that I read that inevitably influence purchase decisions (as I believe that they are intended to do).

I work as a state government human services for the disabled administrator. We take careful pains to inquire about conflicts of interest amongst the offerors of the contracts that we solicit, and even greater pains to require disclosure of potential conflicts of interest in those, including myself, who are asked to serve on panels evaluating the proposals that we are sent. Of course, none of us own this forum and therefore, we have no place in requiring, suggesting or even expecting such efforts or policies to protect us against such conflicts of interest. Once again, this forum is "owned" by a retailer with an intrinsic VESTED INTEREST in sales.

However, as a simple courtesy to one another, I would desperately hope that any of us who are simply friends and colleagues struggling together to overcome the same disorder, have the integrity to simply disclose UP FRONT ANY POSIIBLE CONFLICT OF INTEREST OR INDUCEMENT that they may have received from ANY source. Such inducment might be as simple as the pride one gets for being recognized as a respected member by being selected to review a piece of equipment int he first palce. This is still an inducement however. The fact that such individuals may have purchased the equipment before or after posting their review is irrelevant. The inducement of being selected to post the review needs to be disclosed IN ADVANCE. And, given the number of new members who turn to us evry day, this disclosure needs to be reminded frequently.That's the only way that we can fairly evaluate the merits of reviews or incidental posts. That's the only way that we can fairly rely upon one another for truly helpful advice.

However, once again, we are all playing on a retailer's playground here, so LET THE BUYER BEWARE (CAVEAT EMPTOR)!!!

BTW, I have NO interest in ANYONE'S sales or profits related to xPAP or SDB. And, I'll NEVER recommend one piece of equipment over another. I believe that each of our experiences is different and we all need to try before we buy, and DEMAND NO LESS from our suppliers. Our health depends on it.

Now, bring on the flames.

Chuck

DSM, lets clear something up. Are we talking about specific "regulars" being paid or given equipment in exchange for favorable reviews? Who are they? Are you implying Johnny Goodman is paying people and giving free equipment in exchange for favorable reviews? That's a very serious accusation. A slanderous accusation.

In the past, Johnny has generously allowed users to trial equipment for their unbiased reviews. To insinuate otherwise, is, at the very least, inaccurate. To suggest there are "regulars with vested interests" is not only unsubstantiated, but insults the integrity of Mr. Goodman and cpap.com.

Everyone has their opinion about their favorite equipment. The problems seem to arise when someone attempts to put forth their opinion based upon their experience and claims their observations are a matter of fact for everyone. Nothing could be further from the truth.

GoofyUT, I don't think it's a big surprise we see the slant towards Respironics and away from Resmed -- especially in light of their internet pricing debacle. We're all on the internet and Resmed is gunning for us. It hard to recommend their products with a clear conscience when equally effective products are offered by Respironics. Resmed created their own monster on this one and it has certainly contributed to the "almost monolithic adoration of Respironics." I don't find it worrisome. I find it a healthy by-product of freedom of speech. We are making ourselves heard. There is power in numbers and I'd agree with you; on this forum the numbers indicate Respironics is the preferred manufacturer of equipment. Somebody has to be ahead and it only makes sense the company that's ahead here at cpaptalk isn't the one that has proudly broadcast their intention to screw internet customers while at the same time making the ludicrous claim they are doing so out of concern for the patient. They insult our wallets and our intelligence. On the other hand, for those users who obtain everything through their DME and are blissfully unaware of the internet pricing policy Resmed plans to implement, I'm sure Resmed is viewed in a very positive light. Here, on the internet, it should come as no surprise to see Resmed met with what you describe as "torrents of derision." They brought it on themselves.

Well, since I'm unable to post this as a Guest, whatever rep I have will undoubtedly get burned at the stake also. So be it.

I am, in short, DISAPPOINTED, TIRED of all of this unnecessarily defensive bantering. What's wrong here? A person writes of his personal experience, and immediately he's attacked!
So here's what I was going to write as "Guest" - granted, it's harsher, hoping I was yet behind another 'mask', but MY OPINION is just that.


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The complete post will need to be read in order to 'feel' my reaction to the post to which I am referring. This post just happened to be the one that set me off - nothing personal, so please read all in its entirety. I must stand behind my reaction, which is one of complete shock at the attitudes and opinions written about the initial post, which stated a personal experience, nothing more.

rested gal wrote:

dsm wrote:Re vested interests - my definition of this is that if someone pays me either in money or gifts (read free machines) to write favourable reviews of said free machine(s), then it is a fair comment to say I have a vested interest. Anyone who has done this knows what I mean. Maybe it isn't any big deal but declaring one's vested interest is the honest way to publish such reports.

dsm, I'm curious. Do you think that my being given a Respironics REMstar Auto with C-flex to try out when C-flex was introduced into the Auto, and my writing a review for cpap.com of my honest opinion about that machine means I had, or have, a "vested interest" in saying that I honestly like the REMstar Auto very much and like Encore Pro software?

Would it make any difference to you to know that I sent cpap.com a check in the amount of the full price for the Respironics REMstar Auto with C-Flex I was trying out because I wanted to buy it?

For the record, I already had a Respironics REMstar Auto that I bought and had been using for a year. I had already been using Encore Pro software. Given that I already liked the REMstar Auto and Encore Pro it's no surprise that I also liked the same machine when C-Flex was added. It was easy to write a favorable honest review.

Geeze.... "regulars with vested interests!"

WHERE DID THIS RESPONSE COME FROM? NO ONE MENTIONED YOUR NAME! STOP WITH THE DEFENSIVE ATTITUDES! STOP TRYING TO ARGUE! CAN'T YOU (YOU-ALL) JUST READ WHAT HAS BEEN WRITTEN, TAKE IT FOR WHAT IT IS, MAYBE LEARN, AND N O T ATTACK SOMETHING THAT HASN'T BEEN WRITTEN?

IF THERE IS NOTHING TO DEFEND, DON'T DO IT!
I am really surprised at these attacks on a statement which was just that - a statement, relaying personal experience.
and why, RestedGal, did you feel the need to put your word 'honest' in bold letters???????

Let's back off and try to LEARN from each other by listening ONLY to what has been said, not what we THINK has been said.

I'm really tired of this; it surely detracts from the forum, and lessens my wantings to post anything, if I must be SO CAREFUL of what & how I say anything.

NO, I am NOT DSM, but someone who wants to learn something here, rather than have de javu of high school politics & popularity contests, name-calling, et al. Note: I DIDN'T say anyone DID that, just that is MY REACTION to having read all of this that is IMMATERIAL to the subject!


AGAIN: Nothing personal here; I've had good rapor with posters mentioned here, but am sorely surprised at what I've been reading re this subject.
ABOVE ALL: LET US NOT LOSE RESPECT FOR EACH OTHER, OR FOR OTHER'S PERSONAL EXPERIENCES. READ WHAT IS SAID, NOT WHAT YOU THINK WAS SAID/INTENDED. WE DO NEED EACH OTHER, SO LET US NOT PUT STRAINS ON INTEGRITY. ...what's that smell..??? Oh, yeah, since the price of gasoline came down temporarily, you want to find out what roasted duck smells like? I AM JOKING - You'd have to take off the durn tape first, anyway.