OT: Time out and/or Duke it out thread

[jnk...]

So as long as someone is registered, their gratuitously nasty reply to a valid comment is OK, as long as they don't delete it, as long as they ignore it (don't want to fan the flames after all) and have the personal attack (untruthful as it may be) stand in perpetuity? How would you have responded, what would you have actually said in the circumstances - please just give an actual alternative answer I could have written to respond to what was left - generalities don't cut it or I wouldn't ask.

If I ignore a personal attack of me, then I do not validate it. If I can manage to speak kindly to the attacker, then what I would hope "stands in perpetuity" would be a testament to the attacker's inappropriateness and maybe, just maybe, an example of the value of attempting some online cheek-turning. YMMV.

[robysue]

Following up on my own post with a bit of clarification.

I wrote:

Edit: Deleted posts are a no-no. But, can a nasty post by a "Guest" be deleted, or is it there forever? I understand the post can't be foed.

In my humble opinion the only use for the Spam button is to remove honest-to-God Spam. In other words, a post by an anonymous user trying to SELL something (particularly something NOT related to CPAP) or a post advertising a clear SCAM. Others may differ with my opinion.

I want to clarify exactly what the word spam means to me and why I feel as though my definition is not just an "opinion". The English Oxford on-line Living Dictionary defines spam as:

• Spam: Noun
  1. Irrelevant or unsolicited messages sent over the Internet, typically to a large number of users, for the purposes of advertising, phishing, spreading malware, etc.
  
  1.1 Unwanted or intrusive advertising on the Internet. [as modifier] ‘an autogenerated spam website’
  
  2 trademark A tinned meat product made mainly from ham. (https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/spam)

Because this is the definition of Spam that I am familiar with, I restrict my own use of the Spam button to remove only posts, usually by anonymous "guest" posters, that contain clearly unwanted ADVERTISING or involve PHISHING or other attempts to scam people.

My guess is that there are sources that define spam differently. And if the word spam means something very different to you, then I invite you to find an objective source that demonstrates your interpretation of the word spam is accepted by a large group of people.

[robysue]

So as long as someone is registered, their gratuitously nasty reply to a valid comment is OK, as long as they don't delete it, as long as they ignore it (don't want to fan the flames after all) and have the personal attack (untruthful as it may be) stand in perpetuity? How would you have responded, what would you have actually said in the circumstances - please just give an actual alternative answer I could have written to respond to what was left - generalities don't cut it or I wouldn't ask.

If I ignore a personal attack of me, then I do not validate it. If I can manage to speak kindly to the attacker, then what I would hope "stands in perpetuity" would be a testament to the attacker's inappropriateness and maybe, just maybe, an example of the value of attempting some online cheek-turning. YMMV.

+1

[Pugsy]

, usually by anonymous "guest" posters, that contain clearly unwanted ADVERTISING or involve PHISHING or other attempts to scam people.

Carolyn and her team are working hard in trying to put up roadblocks to make harder for "guests" to spam us.
There are also spammers who take the time to register and log in so they can post their garbage..either in the body of the post or sometimes they do the sneaky spammer links in their signatures in hopes we won't notice...but I notice and those get removed also.
Then Carolyn gets a note with a link to the profile and she in turn blocks them from doing it again.
Now we can't prevent them from using another email addy to register and do it again but we sure slow them down.

[Julie]

Thank you JNK for your reply - at least it was specific.

[robysue]

, usually by anonymous "guest" posters, that contain clearly unwanted ADVERTISING or involve PHISHING or other attempts to scam people.

Carolyn and her team are working hard in trying to put up roadblocks to make harder for "guests" to spam us.
There are also spammers who take the time to register and log in so they can post their garbage..either in the body of the post or sometimes they do the sneaky spammer links in their signatures in hopes we won't notice...but I notice and those get removed also.
Then Carolyn gets a note with a link to the profile and she in turn blocks them from doing it again.
Now we can't prevent them from using another email addy to register and do it again but we sure slow them down.

Yes, I'm sure they're hard at work on the spam issue. All things considered, the total amount of spam that gets through is exceptionally small, particularly compared to the number of posts.

If there were such a thing as a perfect anti-spam system, then Carolyn and Johnny would have no need to give us Spam buttons.

[jnk...]

Thank you JNK for your reply - at least it was specific.

You are very welcome, Julie.

You may recall I have defended you in the past. And as far as I am concerned, your reputation is made up solely of what YOU say in YOUR posts, NOT what others say about you or your posts. I may not always agree 100% with what you say or how you say it (just as I'm sure you don't always agree 100% with my posts), but I have never once doubted your motives or seen any reason to. I believe I have contradicted you in all respect at times and that you have done the same with me. And I think it is important for all of us in a forum about such a serious subject to all welcome that sort of thing and roll with it as much as possible, even when the one contradicting us doesn't do it well. So from where I sit, I see no reason for you to get overly distracted with defending your honor or reputation. Just my opinion.

-jeff

[Julie]

Thank you again... what hasn't been said here is the 'reason' things went the way they did in that post, the history between PEF and me is not new, and I finally just had it (never mind that our politics are at opposite ends of the planet too ). A person should have some recourse when they're dissed like that and while I can usually just either answer in kind (and we both agree to walk away) with others, this one was the straw and I knew that nothing I could say or not say would make a difference.

[Lucyhere]

So as long as someone is registered, their gratuitously nasty reply to a valid comment is OK, as long as they don't delete it, as long as the person attacked ignores it (don't want to fan the flames after all) and leaves the personal attack (untruthful as it may be) stand in perpetuity?

You and PEF had a difference of opinion. Her opinion is as valid as yours. If PEF's post was directed to me, at that point, I would have moved on. You keep insisting her post was nasty, wrong and a personal attack. Most don't agree with you. What you said may have been right for you; obviously it was not right for her. You aren't a doctor; yet you continue to play like one on the internet.

We sometimes post about our personal experience about a particular issue. That's what PEF did and that was her opinion. It wasn't wrong, and you keep insisting that it was. Simply put, you think your post was 'right' and her post was 'wrong'', and I doubt that anyone can change your mind.

Deleting someone's post is not allowed here for any reason. You have no valid point for deleting her post.

[Julie]

MYOB

[Lucyhere]

MYOB

Well, at least you didn't delete my post!

[Lucyhere]

Another question: If I see the beginning of a belittling, bully like, uncalled for post(s) from a member (or non member), my intent is to copy and paste all posts involved in this thread, immediately, in the hopes of stopping the poster in his/her tracks, so as not to derail a helping thread. That's what I think is the intent here. Am I correct?

That part of the experiment is still a work in progress.
I don't think copying the fight and posting it here will necessarily cause the parties involved to move the spat. They already know what they have said to each other or want to say to each other and I would think that they could do the copying and pasting themselves.

Of course it won't cause the parties involved to move the spat. That ain't gonna happen. That's why I said what I did about moving the post(s) to this thread, and maybe adding a post to the other thread saying that the offending post(s) had been moved, or something along those lines. ??

[Pugsy]

That's why I said what I did about moving the post(s) to this thread, and maybe adding a post to the other thread saying that the offending post(s) had been moved, or something along those lines. ??

I hear you. I am trying to put myself in the shoes of someone who just got the "suggestion" that the "discussion" be taken elsewhere...
So if I was one of the guilty parties I don't see the need for me to be reminded of whatever it was that was ugly by doing what you are thinking. I am already probably pretty worked up by then anyway and I know what was said.
Plus when make a point of copying specifics it opens you up to some criticism for "judging".
To be honest...I probably wouldn't even look at it....this is me if I were in the offenders shoes.

I think that a non aggressive, non threatening, non judgemental (if we can get all that accomplished) "suggestion" to both parties (I would do it in one post) saying something like...

So and so we know you have some differences of opinions but how about you take the rest of the discussion over to the Time out Thread...or create your own...or maybe use private messages so that the original intent of this thread which was so and so's question/problem doesn't get derailed and lost in the heat of where this discussion seems to be heading.

Something along those lines..I don't want to make a point of calling them names or anything like that. Even if someone is being an obvious first class asshole/bully/jerk/dick...we don't need to point that out...I guarantee everyone already knows that fact. Don't turn into what it is you are wanting to stop...you are likely to end up with the 2 offenders both joining forces and jumping down your throat.
I just want to ask in a nice way to not derail the thread. Will it work? I don't know but at least I tried and the OP knows that someone at least tried to bring some order back to the thread.
Maybe add an apology to the OP for the direction things went.

I still haven't come up with exactly what I would say or when I would decide it needed to be said. I think this is where common sense and maybe just a wee bit of patience might be in order...sometimes things flare up quickly and die just as quickly and if we go jumping in immediately we might actually feed the flame war more.

[Lucyhere]

I think that a non aggressive, non threatening, non judgemental (if we can get all that accomplished) "suggestion" to both parties (I would do it in one post) saying something like...

So and so we know you have some differences of opinions but how about you take the rest of the discussion over to the Time out Thread...or create your own...or maybe use private messages so that the original intent of this thread which was so and so's question/problem doesn't get derailed and lost in the heat of where this discussion seems to be heading.



***I agree with you. Makes more sense. Maybe use the same paragraph in all such threads.



Don't turn into what it is you are wanting to stop...you are likely to end up with the 2 offenders both joining forces and jumping down your throat.

[DanceDiva26]

I just want to ask in a nice way to not derail the thread. Will it work? I don't know but at least I tried and the OP knows that someone at least tried to bring some order back to the thread.

<Newbie jumping in where even rabid wolves fear to tread>

Would something short, along the lines of:

"I know you have a wealth of experience and knowledge. Besides what you just wrote which doesn't help the OP, is there anything you would like to add to specifically address the OP's problem?"

Relatively innocuous, but pointed?