CPAP seems to be useless

RipVanWinkle · Post by **RipVanWinkle** » Wed Jul 05, 2006 8:05 am

I'm frustrated. I've had my CPAP machine for a couple of weeks and have used it religiously. The result: I'm AT LEAST as tired as I was before I started. I don't understand it. I have a full face mask that does not seem to be leaking. I have a REMstar Pro M Series with C-Flex set at 1. My pressure is 11. Am I just being too impatient, or do I need a higher pressure, or do I have central sleep apnea, or is there another explanation? I'm so disappointed; I was excited to start my therapy so that I could finally feel awake and refreshed in the mornings and I've yet to enjoy that feeling.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Wed Jul 05, 2006 8:23 am

What does your software say? What is your AHI with and without CPAP? What is your leak rate? Sounds like the PAP isn't getting to your obstruction.

NightHawkeye · Post by **NightHawkeye** » Wed Jul 05, 2006 8:57 am

RipVanWinkle wrote:I have a full face mask that does not seem to be leaking. . . Am I just being too impatient, or do I need a higher pressure, or do I have central sleep apnea, or is there another explanation? [/url]

Rip, there are, in fact, other explanations. I agree with "Guest" though, that the easiest way to sort through the possibilities is by using Encore Pro software.

Judging from posts on this forum, one factor which seems much more common than "central" apnea is jaw displacement caused by using a full-face mask. A number of folks with known TMJ issues have this problem, and some of us who didn't really know we had TMJ issues have discovered this as well. What seems to happen is that the pressure exerted on the lower jaw moves the jaw back which then causes further restriction of the windpipe, hence, increased apnea. Using the Encore software, you could test for this simply by increasing the tension on the lower straps of your full-face mask. I found that my AHI went up greatly with increased strap tension, and so I went to a nasal mask which resolved the problem for me. Others here have reported similar experiences.

You could also simply try a nasal mask and see if that helps. I'm assuming though that you have a reason for using the Full-face mask, possibly congestion. If so, you'll need to deal with the congestion first. Nasal pillows masks can help with that, by the way.

Hope this helps.

Regards,
Bill

Dale92 · Post by **Dale92** » Wed Jul 05, 2006 9:10 am

Just to throw something else at you. I had a dentist make an oral appliance that holds my lower jaw in a slightly forward position when I sleep. I new I had a tendency for my jaw to drop down and back constricting my airway when I sleep. This oral appliance helps keep my jaw in place by holding my upper and lower teeth in place while using a full face mask.

Now if I can find a mask that doesn't leak!

Dale

tooly125 · Post by **tooly125** » Wed Jul 05, 2006 9:13 am

Rip,
By my own experience and by what I have read on this board two weeks is just too short of a time to judge if cpap is working for you.
If you do a search on "sleep debit" you should find plenty of info about how long it took others to feel results.
To some it's like a magic pill or a "cpap high" for me it's more like slow but sure.

Snoozin' Bluezzz · Post by **Snoozin' Bluezzz** » Wed Jul 05, 2006 9:19 am

I'll echo two themes here. 1st is that 2 weeks is just not long enough.

Second is that if you are that anxious and you don't already have it get the software and card reader and begin monitoring your own progress. It will help you understand if you are just recovering sleep debt or if your pressure is not correct

David

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Wed Jul 05, 2006 10:07 am

OK, you guys lost me with the Smart card reader and software. How do I get those? What kind of data does it track?

Wulfman- · Post by **Wulfman-** » Wed Jul 05, 2006 10:13 am

Here ya go! And.....at a new, lower price.

https://www.cpap.com/productpage/respir ... eader.html

Den

sleepylady · Post by **sleepylady** » Wed Jul 05, 2006 10:36 am

I agree with both theories as well. Two weeks is definitely too soon for some. I know quite a few people see an instant result, however, for me it was gradual. Give yourself a full month of using the machine and see how you are. Also, I found that I got the best treatment using nasal pillows as opposed to a full face mask. In my case, while I thought I was a mouth breather that was really a case of my OSA. Once I got my machine, no more mouth breathing.

You may find comfort in getting the software and card reader. I have the software for my machine and periodically download the data to see how I'm doing. It was with A LOT of patience and monitoring my pressure that I tweaked it to the point that I found the perfect range for me.

Melinda

TerryB · Post by **TerryB** » Wed Jul 05, 2006 11:26 am

I felt very much worse in the short term. I think it was because the presence of the system and the newness were causing more disturbance than the apnea had been at least as far as restfulness was concerned. It got lots better, but now I feel a downturn in rest again at 4 months in. There are so many posibilities.

TerryB

Snoredog · Post by **Snoredog** » Wed Jul 05, 2006 12:00 pm

I would suggest:

Setting your Cflex option to 2.
Lowering your pressure to 10cm.
Use the Ramp feature starting at 6cm over a 30 minute period.

Allow yourself a good 4-6 weeks.

sleepylady · Post by **sleepylady** » Wed Jul 05, 2006 12:18 pm

Snoredog why do you suggest lowering pressure, upping the CFlex, and using the ramp? RVW didn't say he was having problems with the pressure. He's saying he's still really tired after 2 weeks. Normally after a certain amount of time, a pressure is raised if a person isn't seeing an improvement and not lowered.

Melinda

mikemoran · Post by **mikemoran** » Wed Jul 05, 2006 1:52 pm

Just a note you may be suffering from adjustment more than "Sleep Debt". Where you were waking up because of apneas before, now you might be waking up because of straps, mask placement and just breathign agaisnt pressure. You have been sleeping one way for years., it takes time to learn a new sleep pattern. Not much different than when you change mattresses or pillows.

lvehko · Post by **lvehko** » Wed Jul 05, 2006 2:27 pm

I'm on day 22 of cpap treatment and still feeling sleepy during the day. In fact, right now I'm struggling to stay awake, even though I slept untill 11 this morning.

It *is* very discouraging not to see at least SOME improvement right away -- however, after reading on this board that lots of people take weeks and even months to see benefits, I'm willing to give it more time. I mean, what's my alternative, really? I don't see myself stopping cpap therapy, because I do have apnea and cpap is the treatment for that. However, if I get months into this and am still having a lot of sleepiness, I'll start looking for other reasons...

Keep us posted.

Min

Elibet · Post by **Elibet** » Wed Jul 05, 2006 3:23 pm

I'm having a tough time too with my cpap. I have the remstar plus M series.
I started out with the swift nasel pillows, but found out later they are not
recommended for slotted nares. I now have the F and P Flexifit 406 mask
and I find my nose to be slighty swollen/bulbious (sp?) and red in the
morning. Can anyone recommend a better mask. The Flexifit I have is the
extra small size. Once in a while it seems to fit and stay well. But most of
the time I'm constantly adjusting it through the night. Any advice would be
appreciated.

Sincerely,
Elizabeth

CPAP seems to be useless

CPAP seems to be useless

Re: CPAP seems to be useless

sleepiness

cpap mask

Humidifier

Additional Comments: ResScan and SleepyHead software

Mask

Additional Comments: Started CPAP June 14, 2006, pressure set at 8.0