OT - Cardiologists recommend wider use of statin drugs

[Janknitz]

Yep, at least they recognize that sooner or later as they age, everyone is going to show a risk on that calculator that doesn't correlate to the studies already done.

What I think is interesting is that they are comparing the data on the risk calculator to what they observed on the Framingham study. But one of the things Framingham found is that the older you are, the higher your cholesterol, the longer and healthier you lived. All cause mortality was decreased if your total cholesterol was over 200, and your LDL was in the 120's or so. Yet, for YEARS they have been treating total cholesterol and LDL "by the numbers" and putting a lot of people whom Framingham found were healthy and at a lower chance of mortality on statins because they were treating the numbers, not the person. They were trying to change the standards to less than 170 total cholesterol and under 100 (down to 70 for some) for LDL. Hello, in Framingham, people with low cholesterols like that were dying of cancer and infections and about 50% of those with cardiovascular problems had low cholesterol.

So now, all of the sudden, they are realizing that the new standards are going to capture a lot of people who really, according to Framingham data, have a very low risk???? So why weren't they on it when they were all treating strictly by the numbers and treating a huge number of people who really weren't going to ever benefit from statins???? I think a lot of practitioners recognized how stupid this was, and these new standards are giving them an opportunity to claim that they don't over-treat.

[DoriC]

Has anyone decided how they going to handle this if you're convinced you're being needlessly medicated but your Dr wants you to continue statins?

[Janknitz]

Dori, ask if your doctor will work WITH you and support your efforts to be healthy. You might start with this article: http://dietheartnews.com/2013/06/trigly ... t-disease/ and ask your doctor to monitor these four factors as you wean off statins.

The best way to bring trigs down is to reduce carbs, and (surprise!) that brings blood glucose down, too. Good, saturated fats and omega 3 fish oil bring HDL up.

If your doctor is adamant about statins, you might need to find a doctor who is more open to discussion.

[rkuntz123]

Has anyone decided how they going to handle this if you're convinced you're being needlessly medicated but your Dr wants you to continue statins?

The following worked for me:
One week after getting the 1st Statin Prescription "Doc, I'm getting horrible leg cramps"
One week after getting the prescription for a 2nd Statin "Doc, I'm getting horrible leg cramps"
One week after getting the prescription for a 3rd STatin "Doc, I'm getting horrible legs cramps"
My Medical record now says I'm allergic to Statins and it may be true.

[RestedRebel]

My doctor took me off my statin drug because I was on a low dosage and had a total cholesterol level of 138. He said as long as I'm under 200, he's not going to worry although we will continue to check my levels.

[idamtnboy]

The following worked for me:
One week after getting the 1st Statin Prescription "Doc, I'm getting horrible leg cramps"
One week after getting the prescription for a 2nd Statin "Doc, I'm getting horrible leg cramps"
One week after getting the prescription for a 3rd STatin "Doc, I'm getting horrible legs cramps"
My Medical record now says I'm allergic to Statins and it may be true.

I'm probably the rare exception, but pains caused by statins may very well have saved my life. In 2009 my PCP put me on Crestor. After a few weeks I called the office and left a message that I was experiencing pains in my shoulder and wanted to get off of Crestor, or change to something else. The nurse called me the next morning and asked me to explain when and where I had the pain. I told her after walking behind a self-propelled mower. She essentially said, "Get your butt down here, now!" The pain I described was not a side effect of Crestor. They did an EKG, found abnormalities, and scheduled a nuclear stress test two weeks later. I went in for the test on a Friday morning, and that afternoon the doc put in a stent to clear a 90% blockage and ballooned a partial blockage. Who knows what would have happened to me if I hadn't have suspected a statin pain. I could easily have had a heart attack in the next few months.

[bwexler]

If my doctor prescribed statins I did tell him I will not take them. When he insisted I weaned myself off that doctor.

NO DOCTOR CONTROLS MY HEALTH CARE. They only make recommendations which I evaluate and determine what I will do.

[Lazer1234]

I stop taking statin last week.

[ChicagoGranny]

In the meantime, the FDA has declared that walnuts are drugs.

“We have determined that your walnut products are promoted for conditions that cause them to be drugs because these products are intended for use in the prevention, mitigation, and treatment of disease.” Furthermore, the products are also “misbranded” because they “are offered for conditions that are not amenable to self-diagnosis and treatment by individuals who are not medical practitioners; therefore, adequate directions for use cannot be written so that a layperson can use these drugs safely for their intended purposes.”
Read more at http://www.realfarmacy.com/walnuts-are- ... fd8sUlz.99

[BlackSpinner]

In the meantime, the FDA has declared that walnuts are drugs.

“We have determined that your walnut products are promoted for conditions that cause them to be drugs because these products are intended for use in the prevention, mitigation, and treatment of disease.” Furthermore, the products are also “misbranded” because they “are offered for conditions that are not amenable to self-diagnosis and treatment by individuals who are not medical practitioners; therefore, adequate directions for use cannot be written so that a layperson can use these drugs safely for their intended purposes.”
Read more at http://www.realfarmacy.com/walnuts-are- ... fd8sUlz.99

You are not allowed to make health claims on any packaging or advertising unless those claims have been substantiated by by trials and have the approval of the FDA to make those claims. And when you do you must have dosages and such clearly indicated and tested. The FDA protects you from false or unproven claims. You can't claim walnuts good for a specific health issue. They sould have had their packkaging and advertising checked out by a professional in the alternative health market. Dumb, really dumb move on their part.

[Janknitz]

http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/4283650

Applies to all, but especially for women.

[DoriC]

http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/4283650

Applies to all, but especially for women.

Really eye-opening!

[Todzo]

From: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Statin [pulled 11-22-2013 5a]

Controversy

Some scientists believe the statins are overused. Their use has expanded into areas where they provide lesser benefit, and lesser evidence of benefit. The lower the risk of cardiovascular events, the lower the ratio is of benefits to costs. The US market for statins nearly tripled when the National Cholesterol Education Program revised its guidelines to recommend statins as primary prevention. Although the panel cited randomized trials to support statin therapy for primary prevention of occlusive cardiovascular disease, a report in Lancet notes, "not one of the studies provides such evidence." [16] Journalists have questioned the interests of the doctors who made such recommendations, as eight of the nine doctors on the panel were discovered to have been paid by statin manufacturers.[17]

A smaller group of scientists, The International Network of Cholesterol Skeptics, question the lipid hypothesis and argue that elevated cholesterol has not been adequately shown to cause heart disease. These organizations maintain that statins are not as beneficial or safe as suggested.[18] The beneficial effects of statins are suggested to be due to their working as vitamin D analogues.[19]

[16] Abramson J, Wright J (2007). "Are lipid-lowering guidelines evidence-based?". Lancet 369 (9557): 168–9. doi:10.1016/S0140-6736(07)60084-1. PMID 17240267.
[17] Associated Press (16 October 2004). "Cholesterol guidelines become a morality play". USA Today.
[18] Ravnskov U, Rosch P, Sutter M, Houston M (2006). "Should we lower cholesterol as much as possible?". BMJ 332 (7553): 1330–2. doi:10.1136/bmj.332.7553.1330. PMC 1473073. PMID 16740566.
[19] Grimes, D. (2006). "Are statins analogues of vitamin D?". The Lancet 368 (9529): 83–82. doi:10.1016/S0140-6736(06)68971-X. edit

[VikingGnome]

Some people have a genetic predisposition to having high cholesterol. These patients can exercise and diet themselves forever and still have high cholesterol. Many of them are normal weight and eat healthy diets.

I've been on simvastatin (Zocor) for 20+ years. The drug works great for me. My annual checkup with internal medicine doctor showed my total cholesterol at 125, LDL about 85, but HDL (good cholesterol) was low at 30 something. It is well known that statins do a great job in reducing bad cholesterol but unfortunately also lower good cholesterol. My doc says my HDL should be around 45 but overall I'm doing great. He told me to drink 1/4 cup of 100% concord grape juice each day and HDL will get back to normal. Red wine also works but I don't drink alcohol so grape juice it is. My total cholesterol has been below 150 for 20 years so I measure that as a great success for me with the hereditary nature of high cholesterol in my family.

I'd probably be dead from clogged coronary arteries and massive heart attack if hadn't been prescribed a statin. Two of my sisters died at age 55 and 50 from heart disease. Neither of them were on statins even though their cholesterol was almost 300.

So the next time all you pontificate that people can control their cholesterol with diet and exercise, that is not true for everyone. It is probably true for many, especially those that are very obese.

[Janknitz]

I'd be worried about the sugar in grape juice, and it's my understanding that it's very hard to get enough reversatrol in grape juice to make a difference. What about trying reversatrol supplements?

Ultimately, too much sugar WHATEVER THE SOURCE (even "natural" fruit juice) is going to cause problems.