How to tell if my mouth is opening in sleep

[jjmahern]

So I am using nasal pillows and seem to have trouble tolerating the increase in air pressure and and have woken up with dry mouth and even one time with very dry mouth and the feeling of air rusing in. Also when watching tv with it turned on, one time the pressure when from 5 to past 6 and my mouth puffed up and opened slightly not of my own accord.

My question is: is there some way to measure if this is happening while I am awake? I don't want to spend money on a FFM if it isn't, but if it is and I need a FFM, I would rather know now so I can try to get some sleep.

Any ideas would be a great help!

[Pugsy]

Dry mouth usually means mouth breathing.
It doesn't take much mouth breathing to dry the mouth out. I have woke up with massive dry mouth during the night and mouth open and when I go look at the reports the leak line may not have even budged or it might show maybe 5 minutes of large leak from the probably mouth breathing.

I wouldn't worry about it right now...let's get you your software reports so you can see for sure what the leak line is doing.
It might only be ugly for 10 minutes....it might be ugly for half the night.
I wouldn't buy a full face mask or do anything for 10 minutes of ugly....I might for half the night in ugly but only if I couldn't resolve the issues with a chin strap or tape.

There's no way to measure mouth breathing leaks without the software.

Cheeks puffing out causing air to be expelled through the mouth....we call that chipmunk cheeks. It can be prevented or at least reduce by placing the tongue in the roof of the mouth so that the tongue acts like a door and stops the air from entering the mouth.
Practice it while masked up and you will see.

[jjmahern]

Also if I need a FFM what is one that you find most comfortable? My only issue seems to be that I hate wearing hats in general. One of the things is that my forehead always gets quite itchy. I am a bit afraid that since most all FFM go around the forehead that I will have really hard time tolerating it. Any suggestions?

[Pugsy]

Also if I need a FFM what is one that you find most comfortable?

None.
I don't own a FFM nor do I want one. Can't help you there at all.
If I was going to try or use a FFM it would have to be something like the Hybrid. I can't stand anything across the bridge of my nose.
Plus my neck doesn't like straps at the base of my skull...pretty much eliminates all masks except nasal pillow masks.

[jjmahern]

Guess I will wait to see what is happening. I ordered the humidifier and it shipped today but the woman from the online store said it will take 6 days to get here (ugh!). I also changed from a small nasal pillow to a medium. I am wondering if maybe that will help me tolerate the air.

Honestly it has been six nights now with such trouble and I am so incredibly tired. Seems almost worse than before I started. I will keep trying but every night it keeps happening just compounds the tiredness. I tried finally taking a sleeping pill last night, thinking I would sleep through with it but it backfired and I woke up at 3:30 am with mask off and I don't remember removing it. I put mask on then and wore for the remaining three hours.

I changed the air flow back to 20 max cause lowering didn't seem to make that much difference and I would rather be getting some actual help from machine for the small amount of time I am wearing it.

It is just so hard to keep doing it when everynight seems the same and it makes me more and more tired every day. I mean I don't mind waking up several times a night as long as I can get some day time relief from being able to wear it at least 4 hours straight. But right now I am waking several times, removing it unknowingly in the night, never getting more than three hours on it and more tired it seems each day. How do I keep going? I worry I will lose my job. I worry I won't be able to take it anymore. I have been sleep deprived for more than a year now and seriously deprived for more than a few months. The first week i was able to tolerate it more than now and I had some slight improvement in the day. I was able to not feel cranky and exhausted the whole day. I was able to cook dinner for the first time and two months. I was able to clean my house, but now it has just gone downhill again and it is so hard to go back. The first few days I was able to keep up my hope and keep going. Now I am am on the verge of tears all the time, cranky with everyone, eating loads and loads of sugary high fat foods and just so tired. Is there anything you think I can do to help me cope. I am sorry to complain and I know there are people with much worse problems in the world but I know that I am HIGHLY sensitive to lack of sleep.

[Pugsy]

You know that change to 20 maximum might not be the best thing..the M series machines would try to "fix" leaks with more pressure and more pressure then created more leaks and a nasty circle would develop.
So if you are mouth breathing a little the machine could sense that as a "leak" and try to fix it with more pressure and maybe make your other problems worse.
If you are having trouble breathing or feeling enough air is moving...what is your minimum pressure? That one would be the most important one both for comfort and ability to fight off the apnea events.

Here in this thread is an example of leaks feeding the pressure till I maxed out.
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=67883&p=631376&hili ... mb#p631376

[jjmahern]

Can you tell me any info from this. Before i turned down the pressure my average pressure from the machine was reported around 9. Since I turned the pressure down the average has gone up to above 10 or maybe even 12. I turned it from 20 to 12 btw. So should i just keep it at 12? I'm afraid esp with my back sleeping that 12 wont be enough and i'll be able to handle sleeping with it more but it won't be restorative sleep. I also thought that I have had it on 12 for the last night or two and still wake up with mask off. Those times unknowingly (in sleep)

[jjmahern]

Also this morning i had dry mouth and the max pressure was set at 12. So even at lower pressure my mouth seems to be opening

[jjmahern]

maybe upping the min and wearing the mask on higher pressure while watching tv at night? will allow me to learn to tolerate the higher pressure while awake so I can sleep better with it?

[jjmahern]

Last night I wore it for prolly more than 2.5 hours last night (not all at once) to keep getting myself used to it

[Pugsy]

The pressure number being reported on the M Series LCD screen is a 90% number.
All this means is that for 90 % of the time you were AT OR BELOW this number. It can be falsely elevated when leaks make the machine increase the pressure.
Don't forget the OR BELOW part of that definition. People tend to overlook that part.
If your 90% pressure has been running around 10 cm then for 90% of the time you were at or below 10 cm...10% of the time you were above 10cm..we have no way to know how far above 10 until we seen the software reports.

For now...work on being comfortable and getting decent sleep. If it takes a lower pressure (minimum and maximum) so that you can sleep decently..then use it. Or change the mode over to cpap mode and just use straight cpap mode so that the pressures don't go wild on you.

You gotta get the hours of sleep first...then let's work on any tweaking that might need to be done after we get the software up and running.

How about 8 cm minimum and 12 max in apap mode? Can you handle 8 cm okay?
Or how about straight cpap mode...say maybe 8 or 9...just so you won't have to deal with the higher pressures?
Sometimes just the changing pressures can be disruptive.

Mouth breathing....that can happen at any pressure...even 5 cm.

[jjmahern]

If I am going to do a straight 9, do you think wearing mask at 9 while watching tv might be helpful to ease me into it before trying to sleep?

[Uncle_Bob]

sound like jaw dropping resulting in leaks

a PapCap will help prevent your jaw from dropping

http://www.pur-sleep.com/products/produ ... category=6

[jjmahern]

Yeah, unfortunately the PapCap won't work for me. One of the reasons I use the nasal pillow mask I do is because it has so few straps and nothing across the forehead. I can't wear hats generally either as they make my forehead and head itch quite a lot. I think I wouldn't be able to tolerate the cap. I have bought some secure first aid tape to try taping my mouth shut tonight. We'll see how that works

[Uncle_Bob]

Yeah, unfortunately the PapCap won't work for me. One of the reasons I use the nasal pillow mask I do is because it has so few straps and nothing across the forehead. I can't wear hats generally either as they make my forehead and head itch quite a lot. I think I wouldn't be able to tolerate the cap. I have bought some secure first aid tape to try taping my mouth shut tonight. We'll see how that works

Oh OK. Taping should definately let you know. I taped for a few months then tried the PapCap and it worked.
Its a good idea to fold back the tape at one end to make a tab to easily remove the tape.