sleep problems

[newname]

I've been on cpap over 5 years. It doesn't work well for me. I got a new machine-S9 Auto for her with Climateline hose. I was using Activa LT mask and last night went back to FFM. The FFM made me wake up with extremely dry mouth.

I cannot sleep more than 2 or 3 hours at a time. I wake up, stay awake for about 1/2 hour, fall asleep again, etc. etc. all night.

I've been to 3 sleep docs. I guess I just have a sleep problem that can't be fixed. It doesn't feel good to be sleepy all day and have no energy.

Has anyone had similar sleep problems? I don't know what else to do.

[avi123]

Is there an S9 Autoset FOR HER? I am ready to take a guess that with the Activa you have not used a chinstrap. With full face mask you can still mouth breathe. It would not effect the machine operation but it will dry your mouth.

[DreamStalker]

Do you have any data?

When CPAP treatment doesn't go smoothly, data can help diagnose the problem.

First and foremost is finding the right mask interface ... must be comfortable to wear all night long, must not leak. FF masks are difficult IMO because there is much more contact area to maintain a seal for. Supposedly they are designed for people who mouth breathe or who have sinus problems. A change in the orientation of your head (left, right, up, down) changes the tension of the lower strap which may lead to mask leaks. The lower strap also will often leverage your lower jaw open making mouth breathing more likely. Furthermore, breathing through your mouth all night generally leads to dry mouth and eventually a dry throat that makes it more difficult for air flow.

If you are comfortable with your FF mask, try using a chinstrap to counter-act the pull by the lower strap and keep you mouth closed ... assuming you don't have clogged sinuses.

To help you get to successful treatment, the folks here need data for leaks and pressures as well as your machine settings.

Best wishes and don't give up.

[notyorz]

Is there an S9 Autoset FOR HER?

Yep. It's pink. Ain't that grand? I bet the boys are jealous not to have one marketed FOR HIM. LOL

[avi123]

Can you post a few ResScan graphs? You can download this software from the link next to my signaure line.

Also, a Stats info like this by ResScan over a month or longer could provide lots of diagnostic data:




Has anyone had similar sleep problems? I don't know what else to do.

Yes, I had such sleep problem before I started CPAP about 20 months ago. Some call it Sleep Fragmentation. It took me almost a year to get the right mask, and the APAP optimal pressures. I also had my comorbids (underlying medical conditions) treated.

[newname]

How involved is dowloading the Rescan software? I started to install it and then cancelled it because I was afraid of doing it wrong. My laptop uses Window 7 Home Premium 64 bit. The sownload says its for Windows Professional. Will this work on my computer?
It says to do a "custom" install and save it instead of running it. Then it says to save it to whatever directory I want to. I'm not familiar with doing all this. It sounds so complicated.
After it gets installed, would I just put the sd card in my computer?

[kaiasgram]

Yeah, the S9 Autoset FOR HER is pink, kind of silly really because it's the same machine, but the reason I (and probably others0 bought the FOR HER version is because cpap.com offers it as a slightly discounted set. I'll deal with the pink and don't really care what color it is!

newname, what kind of computer do you have? PC or Mac?

[newname]

My laptop is a Dell Inspiron with windows 7 Home premium 64bit (which means nothing to me)

I'm not experienced with installing any software to read my sd card from my S9, so I don't get regular reports

[Pugsy]

I think SleepyHead will be easier for you to manage to start with.

For ResScan...you shouldn't try to do a custom install..you would be better off doing the "normal" "recommended" install.
Custom install for more experienced computer users...it will totally confuse you.
Did you not get a choice for the "regular" install?

[kaiasgram]

I agree with Pugsy, Sleepyhead is very user-friendly and a good choice for beginners like me. I use it on a Mac and it was a breeze to download and begin using. It's also free. My computer has a built-in SD card reader so no additional equipment was needed. Hopefully SleepyHead is as easy to use on your PC laptop as it is to use on a Mac, but pugsy can speak to that. It's worth having a way to look at your data, so give it a try!

[robysue]

Several comments directed to newname, the OP:

First, ResScan will work fine on your Windows 7 machine. In the install stage you will be ask to fill in some information. You can fill it in however you want, it doesn't matter. I believe Pugsy said she filled in her information as Micky Mouse @ Disney World or some such thing. However, there will be a check box that you will only use the software while under the care of a physician. You MUST check that box in order to continue the installation of the program. You won't be ask the doctor's name or anything like that as I recall.

Second you write:

've been on cpap over 5 years.
...
I cannot sleep more than 2 or 3 hours at a time. I wake up, stay awake for about 1/2 hour, fall asleep again, etc. etc. all night.

Five years is a long, long time to deal with a bad sleep pattern. The timing of those wakes seems to indicate that you are likely waking up after your REM cycles. That's actually pretty common and considered normal. What's NOT normal is that you are then unable to get back to sleep in just a few minutes--as in less than five minutes or so. (Most non-insomniacs cannot remember a wake that lasts less than five minutes and they do not remember their post REM wakes even though many non-insomniacs do wake up very briefly every two or three hours during the night.)

You say you've been to three different sleep docs with no real solution. Can I ask whether they've actually tried with you to treat for insomnia? Or have all the meetings focused solely on fixing your problems with CPAP therapys (i.e. answering questions such as How is the CPAPing going? Are you using the mask all night? What are your problems with CPAP?)

Because at this point you've got a problem with sleep maintenance insomnia---you wake up in the night multiple times and you cannot get back to sleep in a timely fashion AND you subjectively feel your sleep stinks when you wake up tired in the morning. You may also have problems with the efficacy of your therapy or the comfort level you've got with the machine and mask. But the fact remains that you could/would have thrown the mask in the closet a long time ago if you didn't think you were getting something postive out of it.

Now don't get me wrong: Finding a mask that's comfortable is critical. Fixing any leak problems is critical. Making sure your AHI is sufficiently low is critical. Figuring out the sweet spot on the humidifier is important. Learning how to deal with all the physical stimuli coming from the machine is important. But with five solid years (or more) of messed up sleeping, you're going to have to fix the sleep itself as well.

So some questions for you to think about:

Did the insomnia start with the start of CPAP? Or have you always had problems staying asleep during the night?

Have the sleep docs just prescribed a variety of sleeping pills over the last five years? Have they helped at all? Are you willing to take sleeping pills on a long term basis?

Has anybody ever told you about sleep hygiene? Have you ever been given the opportunity to use some cognitive behavior therapy in an effort to get the insomnia under control?

And some questions to tease apart what your sleep hygiene looks like:

Do you have a regular wake up time seven days a week? What about a regular bedtime? How much time are you trying to allow for sleep? How much sleep would you say you get on a typical night?

Do you have a TV in the bedroom? Do you spend a lot of time on the computer near bedtime? Do you read in bed?

When you wake up in the middle of then night and can't get back to sleep what do you do? Lie in bed watching the clock? Get out of bed to do something relaxing?

Do you spend a lot of time worrying when you find yourself awake in the middle of the night? If so, what do you worry about?

Do you get some time outside everyday? Do you get any exercise on a regular basis? What time do you eat supper? How much caffeine do you consume each day? How much alcohol do you drink in the evening before going to bed?

[kteague]

Was it ever determined if you have limb movement issues or not (like RLS or PLMD)? You talked in the past about that possibility. What did your original studies say about limb movements? If that has not been definitively answered, I suggest you work toward getting that answer. If another sleep study while wearing your machine and mask at your usual settings is not an option, maybe you could start with a video of you sleeping all night, or have a willing observer who is a nightowl watch you and note your movements. That may not be your issue, but even if my CPAP is doing a great job, if my legs are active, I'll still be unable to stay asleep and will be utterly miserable day and night.

[avi123]

So some questions for you to think about:

Did the insomnia start with the start of CPAP? Or have you always had problems staying asleep during the night?

Have the sleep docs just prescribed a variety of sleeping pills over the last five years? Have they helped at all? Are you willing to take sleeping pills on a long term basis?

Has anybody ever told you about sleep hygiene? Have you ever been given the opportunity to use some cognitive behavior therapy in an effort to get the insomnia under control?

And some questions to tease apart what your sleep hygiene looks like:

Do you have a regular wake up time seven days a week? What about a regular bedtime? How much time are you trying to allow for sleep? How much sleep would you say you get on a typical night?

Do you have a TV in the bedroom? Do you spend a lot of time on the computer near bedtime? Do you read in bed?

When you wake up in the middle of then night and can't get back to sleep what do you do? Lie in bed watching the clock? Get out of bed to do something relaxing?

Do you spend a lot of time worrying when you find yourself awake in the middle of the night? If so, what do you worry about?

Do you get some time outside everyday? Do you get any exercise on a regular basis? What time do you eat supper? How much caffeine do you consume each day? How much alcohol do you drink in the evening before going to bed?

Comment,

I doubt it that the OP would answer those questions b/c they sound too investigative. As a Math Prof you probably have a psychologist colleague at the school who could re-edit those questions to be more "friendly".

p.s. To newname: both SleepyHead and ResScan software(s) are too damn difficult to download and run if you are not a computer savvy.

[BlackSpinner]

So some questions for you to think about:

Comment,

I doubt it that the OP would answer those questions b/c they sound too investigative. As a Math Prof you probably have a psychologist colleague at the school who could re-edit those questions to be more "friendly".

She is not asking for answers. As she says "So some questions for you to think about" "Thinking about" does not require answering in public it suggest analysis of self.

[kaiasgram]

robysue's questions are both appropriate and helpful, and they have been reviewed and endorsed by a psychologist.