Just bought Intellipap Auto, not so happy, need advice

[remstarcpap]

I just bought a new Intellipap auto machine, and after trying it for two nights I have to say I'm not that happy with it.

My first complaint is that it is noisy. When I breathe in, there is kind of a wheezy sound coming from the machine. Breathing out it is quite quiet. It's noisier on the inhale then my old Remstar Tank auto machine. Is this normal? I thought the machine was supposed be very silent. (I have the humidifier attached to the machine.)

The other issue I have is with Smart flex. The breath rounding feature is very hard to adapt to. It feels almost more like a respirator than a CPAP. The way that the breath rounding anticipates the inhale and begins to raise the pressure before I start inhaling is quite disturbing. Even on the lowest setting of breath rounding, I still find it abrupt and disturbing. Last night I tried lowering the Smart flex setting and that helped, but am a little disappointed that there seems to be no way to have Smart flex expiration relief but no breath rounding. Am I wrong? Is there a way to have expiration relief without the breath rounding?

The only other issue I'm finding is that sometimes when I check the data from the LCD screen I get garbage data. If I turn the machine on and off for a moment, then the data seems accurate. Is this a bug? For instance, my AHI the first night was 3.5. When I went to check it it said 35.1, but after I turn the machine on and off it was accurate again.

The only other issue is that I received the machine new from CPAP.com, but it had 15.3 hours on the blower. Is this typical? Or did they somehow send me a used machine? (I called them and they said it's normal with testing etc.).

Any feedback would be much appreciated especially from others who have the Intellipap auto.

I should say that other than these issues I like the machine. It's compact, has a simple menu structure, has an easy to fill humidifier, and probably will travel very well. But I really wanted a machine that would be silent, or at least have consistent sound rather up-and-down sound.

I just noticed another thread on the noise issue, and discovered that if I take the machine off my bedside table, and put a foam pad under it, it is much quieter. So the noise seems to be vibrational, and isolating the machine from the table top (which acts as a sounding board) greatly reduces the noise. So now I am wondering, return the machine, or just accept that it needs to sit on some sort of pad?

[nanwilson]

[quote="remstarcpap"

The only other issue is that I received the machine new from CPAP.com, but it had 15.3 hours on the blower. Is this typical? Or did they somehow send me a used machine?

This the only answer I can give you, others will chime in later I'm sure.
If you bought it from cpap.com it is a new machine...the few hours that are on it are from the testing done at the manufacturing plant. This is normal, I would be suspiscious if it had 0 hours on it.
Good luck with the rest of your questions.
Nan

[Slartybartfast]

Agreed. What Nan says. Medical devices have to be tested before they're sold. And frequently one is pulled off the line and put through a testing regimen to make sure it's up to spec. Just like eyedrop bottles on a filling line are check-weighed to make sure they're filled to spec. The 15 hours is inconsequential. As I recall, mine had that on it, too, so maybe they test every machine overnight before they box them up. Although I work in Pharmaceuticals which follows similar regulations to Medical Devices, I don't know the Medical Device regs well enough to say whether every machine has to be tested to the same degree.

Re: the noise, you can't place any CPAP, even my very quiet S9, on a hard surface like a nightstand or you'll hear it and be unable to sleep. Try to get it out of line-of-sight from your ear. That sounds like I'm mixing metaphors, doesn't it? I keep my S9 on a folded up T-shirt on a chair next to the side of my bed. It's lower than the level of the bed and just out of sight and that makes all the difference.

Re: your Intellipap, which I also have (and love), if you get into the SmartFlex menu and choose the maximum rounding (I think it's 5) it will lose the Darth Vader feeling when you first start breathing in. My S9 even does that a little, but it's not adjustable. If you're looking for it with the S9, you'll notice it.

The Intellipap is a great machine, especially when you consider the price is half that of an S9. It's also very customizable, so play around with the settings until you get everything set up right. You'll get used to it soon enough.

One thing I really don't like is the stiffness of the hose that DeVilbiss supplies. I really prefer the Slimline hose that Resmed sells with their S9s. It uses the same connectors as the Intellipap, so next time I fly to the wife's place amongst the big drippy trees in Washington where my Inellipap is waiting for me, I'll change out the stiff DeVilbiss hose for the Slimline hose.

[remstarcpap]

Agreed. What Nan says. Medical devices have to be tested before they're sold. And frequently one is pulled off the line and put through a testing regimen to make sure it's up to spec. Just like eyedrop bottles on a filling line are check-weighed to make sure they're filled to spec. The 15 hours is inconsequential. As I recall, mine had that on it, too, so maybe they test every machine overnight before they box them up. Although I work in Pharmaceuticals which follows similar regulations to Medical Devices, I don't know the Medical Device regs well enough to say whether every machine has to be tested to the same degree.

OK, that makes sense.

Re: the noise, you can't place any CPAP, even my very quiet S9, on a hard surface like a nightstand or you'll hear it and be unable to sleep. Try to get it out of line-of-sight from your ear. That sounds like I'm mixing metaphors, doesn't it? I keep my S9 on a folded up T-shirt on a chair next to the side of my bed. It's lower than the level of the bed and just out of sight and that makes all the difference.

My Remstar Tank sits on my bedside table, and makes no noise. It is true that the Intellipap is quieter on a cushion, but given that none of my other three Remstars vibrates variably on the table, I still suspect this one is somehow defective.

Re: your Intellipap, which I also have (and love), if you get into the SmartFlex menu and choose the maximum rounding (I think it's 5) it will lose the Darth Vader feeling when you first start breathing in. My S9 even does that a little, but it's not adjustable. If you're looking for it with the S9, you'll notice it.

I did do that, and it helps, but really I had to lower the Smartflex setting to it's lowest level to really make a difference.

The Intellipap is a great machine, especially when you consider the price is half that of an S9. It's also very customizable, so play around with the settings until you get everything set up right. You'll get used to it soon enough.

One thing I really don't like is the stiffness of the hose that DeVilbiss supplies. I really prefer the Slimline hose that Resmed sells with their S9s. It uses the same connectors as the Intellipap, so next time I fly to the wife's place amongst the big drippy trees in Washington where my Inellipap is waiting for me, I'll change out the stiff DeVilbiss hose for the Slimline hose.

So I could use the S9 Slimline hose with my Intellipap? On Cpap.com it says "This tubing will ONLY work with the S9 Series CPAP Machines."

[DoriC]

A thick mouse pad underneath muffles the sound.

[Emilia]

All IP units are tested first and will have a some hours on them. In addition, the online vendor is supposed to set your machine to your Rx pressure(s) and test them as well. 15 hrs is about standard so don't worry about that.

No cpap machine will be 'silent.' The IP is second to only the S9 in sound and only by 2 db's.

Can you tell me what your setting are? For example, my SmartFlex is set to be on full time and at 2. My iRounding is at 1 and my eRounding is at 2. What are your pressure settings? Remember that your Flex will reduce your pressure by the # you set. So, if you have a pressure setting of 10 and you have Flex set at 3, your pressure is actually 7. This will have an impact on your therapy results.

The Rounding is actually a patented feature from DeVilbiss and it should be making your transitions from pressure to pressure as smooth as glass. I don't even notice any change in pressure. You can set both i and eRounding to 0, if you wish. Do you have the clinician's manual for your machine? If you need it, PM me with your email address and I will send you a pdf copy of it.

The LCD screen on the IP doesn't give you data, per se, it gives out Smart Codes for you to check your data online. And, of course, you can see your data via the software and the SD card.

If you have any other questions, do not hesitate to PM me.

[Slinky]

... I'll change out the stiff DeVilbiss hose for the Slimline hose.

Not a wise idea. That changes the pressure provided and confuses the data your PAP is trying to record and report.

[redjoe]

... I'll change out the stiff DeVilbiss hose for the Slimline hose.

Not a wise idea. That changes the pressure provided and confuses the data your PAP is trying to record and report.

I agree completely with slinky. When I was researching machines, I remember reading that the S9 had a setting to choose whether using a standard or slimline hose, because of that pressure change. There is no such setting on a DeVilbiss, so it seems to me that could really mess things up if you tried to use a slimline with it.

[rested gal]

I think, but I might be wrong, that using a slimline hose instead of a regular hose would be ok with a machine that does not use small pressure pulses to try to recognize open airways during cessation or near cessation of breathing. However, I don't know if an IntelliPAP does that.

Probably any machine that does not have a tube selection in the menu (other than tube length...nothing to do with diameter) would be ok to use with a slimline hose. But I don't know that for sure.

[Slartybartfast]

I agree with everyone's comments. However, let me explain. Yes, the Slimline connectors WILL fit on the Intellipap. All hose fittings on the major brand machines and masks are compatible. The S9 has two settings to compensate for the different pressure drop characteristics of the two hoses. One for the standard hose, another for the slimline hose.

The Slimline hose, having a smaller diameter, will have more surface area per unit volume, and thus higher backpressure than the standard hose. So the I'Pap will therefore deliver slightly less pressure to the mask with the Slimline hose. I'm fine with that, since this machine is only used when I visit the wife amongst the big drippy trees in Washington one week/month. And I suspect that if, due to the slightly lower delivered pressure, I exhibit some symptoms of apneic breathing, the I'Pap, being an automatic machine, will ramp up the pressure to compensate. So I'd be surprised if it really made any difference at all. And yes, Restedgal, the I'PAP doesn't do the Forced Oscillation Thingy (FOT) to determine the status of the airway that Resmed does, so that shouldn't pose a problem with the operation of the machine. It's just sensing airflow and back pressure at the machine and calculating the delivered pressure at the mask on the basis of the geometry of the standard hose.

I'm not recommending that anyone do what I'm talking about. I 'm just saying this is what I'm doing because I don't particularly like the rather stiff hose DeVilbiss supplies with the I'PAP. Were DeVilbiss to come out with a more flexible hose, I'd buy one. Better yet, a heated AND more flexible hose. (ARE YOU LISTENING, DEVILBISS?) However, since there is (apparently) nothing like that on the market at present, I'll make do with the spare Slimline hose when I'm up North where pinecones bounce off the roof and the roving herds of banana slugs frolic and play beneath the trees.

[edit: Just checked CPAP.com and yes, all hoses use the same fittings. See: https://www.cpap.com/productpage/respir ... ubing.html

"It's not just for Respironics CPAP/BiPAP systems. Performance Tubing will work with all ResMed S6, S7, S8 and VPAP systems as well as many systems from DeVilbiss, Fisher & Paykel, Puritan Bennett and others. "]

[Emilia]

I believe DeVilbiss Marketing hinted that they are working on a heated hose...... not something I need, living in FL, but it may be a deciding factor for those in the Northern, frozen tundra once available.

[remstarcpap]

I'm liking the machine more after several days. I've had to lower Smartflex down to 1, and the smoothing to it's lowest setting, but it's comfy now. I put the machine on a foam pad and the sound is not so annoying now.

One thing I don't understand is that my AHI is significantly higher than with my Remstar. With the Remstar, it is 1.8-2.5, and so far with the I-Pap it is 4.5! both show the same 90% pressure, about 8.5. I guess I have to play with the i-pap settings a bit.

I'm still debating whether to exchange it for another machine. I don't want to go thru the hassle if the replacement will be just as noisy.

[remstarcpap]

I agree with everyone's comments. However, let me explain. Yes, the Slimline connectors WILL fit on the Intellipap. All hose fittings on the major brand machines and masks are compatible. The S9 has two settings to compensate for the different pressure drop characteristics of the two hoses. One for the standard hose, another for the slimline hose.

The Slimline hose, having a smaller diameter, will have more surface area per unit volume, and thus higher backpressure than the standard hose. So the I'Pap will therefore deliver slightly less pressure to the mask with the Slimline hose. I'm fine with that, since this machine is only used when I visit the wife amongst the big drippy trees in Washington one week/month. And I suspect that if, due to the slightly lower delivered pressure, I exhibit some symptoms of apneic breathing, the I'Pap, being an automatic machine, will ramp up the pressure to compensate. So I'd be surprised if it really made any difference at all. And yes, Restedgal, the I'PAP doesn't do the Forced Oscillation Thingy (FOT) to determine the status of the airway that Resmed does, so that shouldn't pose a problem with the operation of the machine. It's just sensing airflow and back pressure at the machine and calculating the delivered pressure at the mask on the basis of the geometry of the standard hose.

I'm not recommending that anyone do what I'm talking about. I 'm just saying this is what I'm doing because I don't particularly like the rather stiff hose DeVilbiss supplies with the I'PAP. Were DeVilbiss to come out with a more flexible hose, I'd buy one. Better yet, a heated AND more flexible hose. (ARE YOU LISTENING, DEVILBISS?) However, since there is (apparently) nothing like that on the market at present, I'll make do with the spare Slimline hose when I'm up North where pinecones bounce off the roof and the roving herds of banana slugs frolic and play beneath the trees.

[edit: Just checked CPAP.com and yes, all hoses use the same fittings. See: https://www.cpap.com/productpage/respir ... ubing.html

"It's not just for Respironics CPAP/BiPAP systems. Performance Tubing will work with all ResMed S6, S7, S8 and VPAP systems as well as many systems from DeVilbiss, Fisher & Paykel, Puritan Bennett and others. "]

Another option would be to just use the above listed tubing, which is quite light, very flexible, and has no diameter issues.

[Slartybartfast]

Another option would be to just use the above listed tubing, which is quite light, very flexible, and has no diameter issues.

Absolutely. $14.95 is a great price for a lighter hose. I wrote that before I looked it up on CPAP.com. Since I already have a spare hose, that's what I'll use for now.

Re: my comment, Emilia, I was hoping if I banged on the cage like that, DeVilbiss Marketing would show up. But it's a Friday and a holiday in most places, so . . .
And it's not the frozen tundra. It's the big drippy trees where the vast herds of banana slugs roam.

Re: the AHIs, don't expect to be able to compare AHIs from one machine to another. The differences in the algorithms between manufacturers, and even between models are significant, and the way events are scored also differ. If you COULD compare AHIs from one manufacturer to another, I'm sure the marketing types from the lower AHI-reporting manufacturer would be shouting their superior numbers from the rooftops, minarets, church steeples and spires. But they don't.

It's best to compare night to night numbers from your own machine. For example, my Resmed S9 Autoset consistently gives me lower numbers than my Intellipap. However, I can adjust the Intellipap to mimic the S9 in how it responds to events, but in doing so, that raises the recorded AHI even higher. So I don't worry about it. I use the Intellipap and am happy with how I feel. The wife says I sleep like a baby. No snoring, no apneic events, no observable anomalies in my breathing, unlike B.C. (Before CPAP).

[Emilia]

Your results will be different from machine to machine because the algorithms are different and proprietary to each manufacturer. The DeVilbiss considered an AHI under 10 to be good. I am not convinced of that and prefer the under 5 rule. My AHI on my IP is consistently under 2 and sometimes under 1. BTW: Because I have my hose snaking up and over a rather high headboard, and I tend to move all over my queen size bed, I use a 10' hose....for which the IP allows you to set it. I wish they would make that light weight hose in a 10' version..... just sayin'