Getting off arrhythmia medication

BonnieB · Post by **BonnieB** » Tue Mar 23, 2010 10:52 am

I was recently diagnosed with moderate sleep apnea and have been on CPAP for five days. I just got back from a consult with my arrhythmia doctor. (I take 100 mg of flecainide twice a day.) She said that treatment for apnea can eliminate arrhythmia some of the time. There are many factors that go into it, but she did not specify. She talked about how lack of oxygen causes the right side of the heart to swell. She was very positive--and definitely thought that the heart can heal with treatment. I am on a plan now--I go back to her in six months and she will reduce my medication to 50 mg/twice a day. And if I do well for six months, she will recommend that I stop taking flecainide altogether. Wanted to share this hopeful information with you.

She mentioned something that you guys already know. I had gained another 10 pounds since my last visit. And she said not to worry. People who don't get enough REM sleep, have much increased appetites.
Bonnie

SleepyBobR · Post by **SleepyBobR** » Tue Mar 23, 2010 12:01 pm

That is very encouraging to hear! My cardiologist has not told me that; his only comment was atrial fibrillation is co-related with sleep apnea in a statistically significant way but stopped well short of predicting that my a-fib would go away or even improve with proper therapy for my OSA. I will discuss this with him further at my next appointment but I suspect he doesn't think this is very likely because he has not seen it happen in his practice.

DreamStalker · Post by **DreamStalker** » Tue Mar 23, 2010 12:37 pm

Make sure you have sufficient hydration and electrolites.

My plumber put me on metropolol for my arrhythmia even though I told him I had been having muscle twitching and cramping. While the metropolol did curb my arrhythmia, it also caused my heart rate to go way down to bradichardia levels. While doing research for my continued muscle spasms and cramps I learned that insufficient minerals of magnesium, potassium, and calcium can cause muscle twitching, cramps, and arrhythmias.

I began supplementing daily with 400 mg magnesium and 200 mg potassium and occasional weekly calcium supplements. I have been off metropolol for 6 months and all symptoms went away with simple inexpensive mineral supplements.

They wear white coats, know lots of technical stuff, and make lots of money but they are still human. Don't leave your health to the health system regardless of whether it is high cost private healthcare or something else. YOU have to be your own healthcare advocate. Use the healthcare system to guide you to a diagnosis, but always double check how healthcare professionals advise you on treatment.

SleepyBobR · Post by **SleepyBobR** » Tue Mar 23, 2010 12:44 pm

That is really interesting and congrats on making the discovery. That said, I am very surprised; the first things they check for when someone presents with heart arrhythmias of any kind are hyperthyroid and electrolyte balance (Mg, CA and K in particular). Your Mg deficiency should have been discovered right away after your first blood work.

DreamStalker · Post by **DreamStalker** » Tue Mar 23, 2010 12:50 pm

I get bloodwork done every 3 months by my PCP.

Bloodwork has never shown Mg deficiency ... either before I began supplmentation or after. Don know if the Mg threshold is off, lab needs to calibrate their instruments, or what.

What I do think is that my "specialist" cardio plumber is just ... well, incompetent.

SleepyBobR · Post by **SleepyBobR** » Tue Mar 23, 2010 2:22 pm

I share your pain although, in my case, my problem is more with my sleep doctor than with my cardiologist. Of course, with months between appointments, my cardiologist has limited opportunity to screw up.

Country4ever · Post by **Country4ever** » Tue Mar 23, 2010 3:41 pm

Dreamstalker, I have never heard of using a beta blocker for muscle spasms!
What helped my muscle spasms/twitches the most was sublingual B12 and calcium and magnesium.
You can't rely on a blood test to accurately give your intracellular magnesium level, since it only measures your serum magnesium. Many times that is normal, while inside the cell is deficient.
Taking too much magnesium can only give you diarrhea, so don't worry about taking too much. You'll know soon if you do.
Its really important in treating muscle over-excitability.
I was having a ton of ectopy once and went to the ER. What a new experience.......the ER doc was very open-minded and suggested IV magnesium (after my ECG was normal), and I didn't have any irregular beats for 2 weeks after that!
Its always a delight to find a sensible doc!

DreamStalker · Post by **DreamStalker** » Tue Mar 23, 2010 7:23 pm

Country4ever wrote:Dreamstalker, I have never heard of using a beta blocker for muscle spasms!
What helped my muscle spasms/twitches the most was sublingual B12 and calcium and magnesium.
You can't rely on a blood test to accurately give your intracellular magnesium level, since it only measures your serum magnesium. Many times that is normal, while inside the cell is deficient.
Taking too much magnesium can only give you diarrhea, so don't worry about taking too much. You'll know soon if you do.
Its really important in treating muscle over-excitability.
I was having a ton of ectopy once and went to the ER. What a new experience.......the ER doc was very open-minded and suggested IV magnesium (after my ECG was normal), and I didn't have any irregular beats for 2 weeks after that!
Its always a delight to find a sensible doc!

He Rx'd it for the arrhythmia, not the spasms. He totally ignored my muscle spasms/cramps clue ... which should have alerted him to the Mg deficiency. Instead, he was auto-programmed by big-pharma to Rx a drug for symptoms rather than investigate the cause given the clues I provided to him.

Yes. I am aware of the Mg side effect though I don't have those issues (yet). I take magnesium citrate to mitigate the possibility for over doing it.

Do you know if the magnesium sulfate form better than citrate?

tonycog · Post by **tonycog** » Tue Mar 23, 2010 10:05 pm

From what I've read about A-Fib, it tends to replicate itself. The more your heart has been in A-Fib, the more likely it is that your heart will try to revert to A-Fib again. That's why the docs want to get your rhythm converted back to normal as soon as possible.

I was diagnosed with A-Fib last April. My cardiologist suggested I get a sleep study, which I did in May. I've been sleeping with Bi-PAP since June 2. I went back into A-Fib in mid-July one time, and then 4 more times between December 25 and January 10, despite 100% compliance with my Bi-PAP therapy. The July episode lasted for 10 days straight, converting on it's own 2 days before the scheduled cardio-version (shock to restore normal rhythm). The others lasted between 8 and 36 hours, eventually converting on their own with increased flecainide doses.

I was on Flecainide from July through Mid-February and now am taking Soltalol (a beta-blocker) since then. The RX was switched due to some uncomfortable arrhythmic side-effects from the flecainide. Sotalol seems to be working better for me, at least so far. I've also added Chelated Magnesium and some Omega Oils as supplements. I'd like to think that some day I can ditch the anti-arrhythmic drugs, but I fear that I won't be able to.

Best wishes,
Tony

slibhart · Post by **slibhart** » Wed Mar 24, 2010 5:44 am

My worst arrhythmia, to date, was just before I was diagnosed with OSA. I am on Metropolol to slow the heart down and of course the CPAP treatment. So far (knock on a big block of wood) I have had no other episodes. They are scary and I agree with the treatment I am receiving.

Country4ever · Post by **Country4ever** » Wed Mar 24, 2010 6:39 am

Sorry I misread your post Dreamstalker.
I take Calcium for my IBS (lots of diarrhea) and take magnesium with it. I've tried the Citrate and it seems to cause more diarrhea for me (probably because it is better absorbed.....which is why it works on muscles better) . I don't know about the sulfate form.
Taking Calcium along with the magnesium keeps the diarrhea side-effects from the magnesium to a minimum.
I also really feel that Calcium is very important to soothe muscle spasms too. Supposedly calcium needs magnesium and vise versa, to be most effective.
I have a very bright, knowledgeable Internal medicine doc. He's probably the best doc I've ever had. But.........when I was having tons of PVCs and I told him about my experience with the magnesium before and how much it helped, he said it has nothing to do with magnesium. He really disappointed me with that statement.
I don't know why docs are so closed to concepts like vitamins/minerals/nutrition, etc. How can you treat a person if you're closed to these basic things??

I found that sublingual B12 also works wonders on twitches.
I am on just a smidgen of metoprolol now because I'm hard-wired to have too big of a sympathetic response to everything, and the effects of the drug has been wonderful. I don't know if that's what helped my PVCs, or if its the cpap. I tend to think its the cpap because recently I've been getting bad numbers on my machine and my PVCs are increasing again.
Sorry for rambling........

nmajca · Post by **nmajca** » Wed Aug 24, 2011 6:53 am

@BonnieB:

I have a story for you to read - my story!
I've had arrhythmia which I managed to cure after doctors gave it their best try.
I know there are many different types of arrhythmia, but it costs you nothing to try my way and there are no dangers as well.
The only thing required is a change of diet. Do you have enough discipline to refrain from certain foods and drinks for some time?
If this can help you then you will be able to stop taking any medication and also improve the quality of your life (by eating healthier).

I hope you will at least try...
Here's the link to my story:

http://www.mcarticles.com/a/how-i-cured ... onal-story

Getting off arrhythmia medication