Good Morning!
I got a new respironics chin strap from my DME provider in the mail yesterday.I used it last night and finally got a good solid night's sleep!!!!
My one and only concern was the price charged $55.00 for this item was charged to Tricare.Is this a bit steep?What is the typical markup on DME?
Tricare is currently renting my CPAP machine till I go back for a followup in August with my doctor.I was told after that If my therapy is going well I will keep the Machine and that any cost over $500.00 for the machine and mask and I will pay half.I looked at the Charges for everything its pretty expensive. But at least I have insurance. Just wondered what other people are experiencing.I love my CPAP, its a Resperonics Remstar plus with C-flex and heated humidifier and Miragde Activa mask.
DME costs
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MartiniLover
- Posts: 364
- Joined: Wed Jan 12, 2005 4:16 pm
- Location: Davison Michigan
There are so many different styles of chin straps that it is hard to tell with out knowing what kind it is. CPAP.COM is a good place to start comparing prices. They are very reasonable. Click on the cpap.com icon at the top of the page and do a search for your chin strap, and machine, etc.
You are wise to be asking these questions before you buy.
You are wise to be asking these questions before you buy.
_________________
| Mask: Mirage Quattro™ Full Face CPAP Mask with Headgear |
| Additional Comments: Second favorite mask--Nasal Aire II |
I am a two martini lover. Two martinis and I think I am a lover!
Bipap 13/9, 10ft Hose
Bipap 13/9, 10ft Hose
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Janelle
Each insurance company has a contract price with the DME that is an amount they will pay, regardless of what the charge from the DME is. I would think that you would only be responsible for your part of that same contract price. When you get your EOB, be sure to look at the column that says "You owe Provider This Amount". Do not pay anymore no matter what the DME bills you. Make a copy of that EOB (they should have received one but probably don't keep them anymore than Drs offices do), and send it to them with the appropriate payment. Highlight the amount your insurance says you owe.
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Nicolle
Ok, I am not the author of this, but it belongs in this thread as well. Please try to understand some of these points the guest makes when it comes to DME pricing.
" I hope I can address the DME haters for a moment. Ive come across many comments condemning them as evil, etc and wanted to share some insight on the industry.
1) Prices are not determined by the DME company. Anyone in business would love to charge millions of dollars for something that cost one dollar but the market wont allow it. The insurance companies each determine their own allowed amounts for medical equipment. Then it is up to the local DME provider to decide if they will participate, or accept, those allowables.
2) It doesnt matter what a DME company bills your insurance co. Insurance co only pay the amount they allowed for the equipment minus your co pay, deductibles, etc.
3) Many of you make comments concerning the service EXPECTED from DME providers. Just a point of mention, DME cos are paid for the equipment they provide, not service. Your healthcare is provided by your Dr. not the DME co! Very few insurances actually have AND PAY for a "Respiratory Therapist Visit" code. Many DME companies cannot afford to hire a Respiratory Therapist (in my area salaries start at $50k a year full benefits expected). Just because they are clinically trained in respiratory therapy doesnt mean they are going to give you a treatment. They are used as a marketing tool for the DME company. There is nothing that a therapist can do regarding mask fitting, machine selection, etc, that a properly trained technician couldnt do!
4) Pricing on the internet is bottom of the barrel, basterdised pricing! Most websites that you find have sold equipment that is given to sleep labs for free! Or a sleep lab tech might offer himself a five finger discount and sell masks on his own. Manufacturers give their product away as samples to sleep labs. Just like your Dr receives sample mediciations. Imagine if employees could take those free meds and start a website and sell them online? What price would you expect to pay for your viagra? Its easy to drop prices when the product is free isnt it?
5) Most DME companies will tell you that internet pricing is below cost! I can verify this, and manufacturers are thankfully trying to correct this. Enjoy your discounted mask prices while they last, cause you can expect them to go up! Margins for legitimate companies trying to compete are non existant and even johnny goodman who apparantly owns this site has attested to that, thats why there is no mask return policy.
6) How much money does the evil DME company make? When look at your insurance EOBs, how much did your insurance pay the DME? Most likely your in the <$100 range for a rental. The rental period is capped, so that item becomes yours in 10 to 15 months, considering your particular policy.
Pause here and consider, how much does it cost to rent a car? $40 a day for a compact? is that ford focus worth the $1200 a month the rental company collects on it? Would you pay less that 1/4 that price if you bought it? Would your local car rental agency give you the car, let you own it, if you rented it for a year straight?
Consider a hotel room, $100 a night. How does your home compare in cost to a hotel room? Thats $3000 a month, could you do better buying a home?
DME companies get paid what the insurance dictates and takes a minimum of 60 days to an average of 120 days to collect their rental fees. Can you go to mcdonalds and eat a meal and pay for it 6 months later? Can you name ONE OTHER BUSINESS that will allow you to do this? Interest free??
And then you demand a Respiratory Therapist available at your beckoning? You expect someone to be on call to poo poo you when you have a complaint at midnight? What could that person do to satisfy you, run over to your home with a suitcase full of masks for you to select?
DOES YOUR DOCTOR COME SEE YOU AT HOME? ? ?
How many members here to go their Drs and dont even see them? How many are attended by Nurses or Physicians assistants?
How many of you can get a service man to come over and just LOOK at your refridgerator for less than $75?
Thats all a DME co gets paid, total, and you expect them to provide the service AND THE EQUIPMENT?
I say, if your that demanding, open your wallet and get it from this site, cash. You still dont get the service, cpap.com is not going to answer your question at midnight like you expect, lol. They wont even take your mask back! So, either lower your expectations to a more reasonable level or just deal with the fact that you are just a little too damn demanding.
PS if you dont know that your sleep lab got paid over $2500 for a TEST, compare that to the expectations of your DME provider who over the coarse of a YEAR might make half that amount, provide you with the equipment, and care, EVEN THOUGH YOU DONT THINK IT ENOUGH, and be on the hook to replace or repair your equipemnt during that period of time. Selfish bastards they are huh? "
" I hope I can address the DME haters for a moment. Ive come across many comments condemning them as evil, etc and wanted to share some insight on the industry.
1) Prices are not determined by the DME company. Anyone in business would love to charge millions of dollars for something that cost one dollar but the market wont allow it. The insurance companies each determine their own allowed amounts for medical equipment. Then it is up to the local DME provider to decide if they will participate, or accept, those allowables.
2) It doesnt matter what a DME company bills your insurance co. Insurance co only pay the amount they allowed for the equipment minus your co pay, deductibles, etc.
3) Many of you make comments concerning the service EXPECTED from DME providers. Just a point of mention, DME cos are paid for the equipment they provide, not service. Your healthcare is provided by your Dr. not the DME co! Very few insurances actually have AND PAY for a "Respiratory Therapist Visit" code. Many DME companies cannot afford to hire a Respiratory Therapist (in my area salaries start at $50k a year full benefits expected). Just because they are clinically trained in respiratory therapy doesnt mean they are going to give you a treatment. They are used as a marketing tool for the DME company. There is nothing that a therapist can do regarding mask fitting, machine selection, etc, that a properly trained technician couldnt do!
4) Pricing on the internet is bottom of the barrel, basterdised pricing! Most websites that you find have sold equipment that is given to sleep labs for free! Or a sleep lab tech might offer himself a five finger discount and sell masks on his own. Manufacturers give their product away as samples to sleep labs. Just like your Dr receives sample mediciations. Imagine if employees could take those free meds and start a website and sell them online? What price would you expect to pay for your viagra? Its easy to drop prices when the product is free isnt it?
5) Most DME companies will tell you that internet pricing is below cost! I can verify this, and manufacturers are thankfully trying to correct this. Enjoy your discounted mask prices while they last, cause you can expect them to go up! Margins for legitimate companies trying to compete are non existant and even johnny goodman who apparantly owns this site has attested to that, thats why there is no mask return policy.
6) How much money does the evil DME company make? When look at your insurance EOBs, how much did your insurance pay the DME? Most likely your in the <$100 range for a rental. The rental period is capped, so that item becomes yours in 10 to 15 months, considering your particular policy.
Pause here and consider, how much does it cost to rent a car? $40 a day for a compact? is that ford focus worth the $1200 a month the rental company collects on it? Would you pay less that 1/4 that price if you bought it? Would your local car rental agency give you the car, let you own it, if you rented it for a year straight?
Consider a hotel room, $100 a night. How does your home compare in cost to a hotel room? Thats $3000 a month, could you do better buying a home?
DME companies get paid what the insurance dictates and takes a minimum of 60 days to an average of 120 days to collect their rental fees. Can you go to mcdonalds and eat a meal and pay for it 6 months later? Can you name ONE OTHER BUSINESS that will allow you to do this? Interest free??
And then you demand a Respiratory Therapist available at your beckoning? You expect someone to be on call to poo poo you when you have a complaint at midnight? What could that person do to satisfy you, run over to your home with a suitcase full of masks for you to select?
DOES YOUR DOCTOR COME SEE YOU AT HOME? ? ?
How many members here to go their Drs and dont even see them? How many are attended by Nurses or Physicians assistants?
How many of you can get a service man to come over and just LOOK at your refridgerator for less than $75?
Thats all a DME co gets paid, total, and you expect them to provide the service AND THE EQUIPMENT?
I say, if your that demanding, open your wallet and get it from this site, cash. You still dont get the service, cpap.com is not going to answer your question at midnight like you expect, lol. They wont even take your mask back! So, either lower your expectations to a more reasonable level or just deal with the fact that you are just a little too damn demanding.
PS if you dont know that your sleep lab got paid over $2500 for a TEST, compare that to the expectations of your DME provider who over the coarse of a YEAR might make half that amount, provide you with the equipment, and care, EVEN THOUGH YOU DONT THINK IT ENOUGH, and be on the hook to replace or repair your equipemnt during that period of time. Selfish bastards they are huh? "
...
Nice try. Johnny doesn't sell "Hot " Goods.
Remember the AA mantra. You must first admit that you have a problem before it can be cured. DMEs have a big problem .
What if I don't want or need all this service you are talking about.
I just want fair prices. You are against this. So why threaten us ?
:twist ed:
Nice try. Johnny doesn't sell "Hot " Goods.
Remember the AA mantra. You must first admit that you have a problem before it can be cured. DMEs have a big problem .
What if I don't want or need all this service you are talking about.
I just want fair prices. You are against this. So why threaten us ?
:twist ed:
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Janelle
Contrarywise, a few months ago, a DME employee posted on here that one reason the DME charged more was for the service the respiratory therapist provided with homevisits, appointments for fitting, etc. My DME no longer does homevisits for CPAP (guess they only do it for other respiratory needs because several times when I called to talk to an RT they were "out in the field"). Many of us have no other recourse except to go through the DME to get questions answered on the machine or mask or to find out if it is something that needs to be addressed. Many of us, me included have waited weeks to here back from leaving messages to get an answer, and then get a "Gee, I don't know but I'll find out". Another few weeks go by and still no answers. I got the answers from this forum. But when you have a machine doing runaway pressures and you don't know why, you don't want to keep using it for three weeks to find out if it is dangerous or not. yes, the initial problem was explained in detail on the answering machine.
And exactly what does a person without insurance have to pay the DME? I'm thinking the full amount the DME has the nerve to charge.
You say the DME doesn't make up the prices. Well who does decide the prices they submit to the insurance, the prices that those without insurance have to pay?
And exactly what does a person without insurance have to pay the DME? I'm thinking the full amount the DME has the nerve to charge.
You say the DME doesn't make up the prices. Well who does decide the prices they submit to the insurance, the prices that those without insurance have to pay?
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MartiniLover
- Posts: 364
- Joined: Wed Jan 12, 2005 4:16 pm
- Location: Davison Michigan
Some comments to DME
"1) Prices are not determined by the DME company. Anyone in business would love to charge millions of dollars for something that cost one dollar but the market wont allow it. The insurance companies each determine their own allowed amounts for medical equipment. Then it is up to the local DME provider to decide if they will participate, or accept, those allowables."
So if I don't have insurance you don't charge me what ever you want? Get real!
"2) It doesn't matter what a DME company bills your insurance co. Insurance co only pay the amount they allowed for the equipment minus your co pay, deductibles, etc."
It eventually reflects in the amount my insurance company charges in premiums
3) Many of you make comments concerning the service EXPECTED from DME providers. Just a point of mention, DME cos are paid for the equipment they provide, not service. Your healthcare is provided by your Dr. not the DME co! Very few insurances actually have AND PAY for a "Respiratory Therapist Visit" code. Many DME companies cannot afford to hire a Respiratory Therapist (in my area salaries start at $50k a year full benefits expected). Just because they are clinically trained in respiratory therapy doesn't mean they are going to give you a treatment. They are used as a marketing tool for the DME company. There is nothing that a therapist can do regarding mask fitting, machine selection, etc, that a properly trained technician couldnt do!
Every item sold, from a piece of gum to any automobile comes with some service. Easy to see why people like you don't understand.
4) Pricing on the internet is bottom of the barrel, basterdised pricing! Most websites that you find have sold equipment that is given to sleep labs for free! Or a sleep lab tech might offer himself a five finger discount and sell masks on his own. Manufacturers give their product away as samples to sleep labs. Just like your Dr receives sample mediciations. Imagine if employees could take those free meds and start a website and sell them online? What price would you expect to pay for your viagra? Its easy to drop prices when the product is free isnt it?
Just the service is less. CPAP.COM seems to do a good job with their phone advice and getting it from Texas into my hands, in many cases less time than my DME.
5) Most DME companies will tell you that internet pricing is below cost! I can verify this, and manufacturers are thankfully trying to correct this. Enjoy your discounted mask prices while they last, cause you can expect them to go up! Margins for legitimate companies trying to compete are non existent and even johnny goodman who apparantly owns this site has attested to that, thats why there is no mask return policy.
After many years in the retail sales business, I found the only reason to sell something below cost is to get rid of a bad investment. Take your hit and use the money to make more money. Profit is basically the same in what ever you are selling. The quicker you turn your dollar the more you make.
6) How much money does the evil DME company make? When look at your insurance EOBs, how much did your insurance pay the DME? Most likely your in the <$100 range for a rental. The rental period is capped, so that item becomes yours in 10 to 15 months, considering your particular policy.
I don't begrudge anyone making a living or a profit. Taking advantage of someones ignorance, or disability in criminal.
Pause here and consider, how much does it cost to rent a car? $40 a day for a compact? is that ford focus worth the $1200 a month the rental company collects on it? Would you pay less that 1/4 that price if you bought it? Would your local car rental agency give you the car, let you own it, if you rented it for a year straight?
Apple & Oranges
Consider a hotel room, $100 a night. How does your home compare in cost to a hotel room? Thats $3000 a month, could you do better buying a home?
Apple & Oranges
DME companies get paid what the insurance dictates and takes a minimum of 60 days to an average of 120 days to collect their rental fees. Can you go to mcdonalds and eat a meal and pay for it 6 months later? Can you name ONE OTHER BUSINESS that will allow you to do this? Interest free??
Yes my Doctor. My hospital. My pharmacist. But this is the nature of the game. Know any company that charges top dollar for minimal equipment, just because they can get away with it.
And then you demand a Respiratory Therapist available at your beckoning? You expect someone to be on call to poo poo you when you have a complaint at midnight? What could that person do to satisfy you, run over to your home with a suitcase full of masks for you to select?
NO!!!!
DOES YOUR DOCTOR COME SEE YOU AT HOME? ? ?
Don't expect them to unless there was no possible way for me to get to see him, and THEN I would.
How many members here to go their Drs and dont even see them? How many are attended by Nurses or Physicians assistants?
Not me!
How many of you can get a service man to come over and just LOOK at your refridgerator for less than $75?
I make a living as a home serviceman. EVERYDAY!
Thats all a DME co gets paid, total, and you expect them to provide the service AND THE EQUIPMENT?
YES
I say, if your that demanding, open your wallet and get it from this site, cash. You still dont get the service, cpap.com is not going to answer your question at midnight like you expect, lol.
I've done business with CPAP.COM less than a half-dozen times, but I have been very satisified EVERY time.
They wont even take your mask back! So, either lower your expectations to a more reasonable level or just deal with the fact that you are just a little too damn demanding.
Walk in to your showroom, buy a mask, week later bring it back? I don't think so. Only if your contract with my insurance company say you have to, do you. If I am a cash buyer off the street, I'll bet I'm out of luck.
PS if you dont know that your sleep lab got paid over $2500 for a TEST, compare that to the expectations of your DME provider who over the coarse of a YEAR might make half that amount, provide you with the equipment, and care, EVEN THOUGH YOU DONT THINK IT ENOUGH, and be on the hook to replace or repair your equipemnt during that period of time. Selfish bastards they are huh? "
In some cases yes.
"1) Prices are not determined by the DME company. Anyone in business would love to charge millions of dollars for something that cost one dollar but the market wont allow it. The insurance companies each determine their own allowed amounts for medical equipment. Then it is up to the local DME provider to decide if they will participate, or accept, those allowables."
So if I don't have insurance you don't charge me what ever you want? Get real!
"2) It doesn't matter what a DME company bills your insurance co. Insurance co only pay the amount they allowed for the equipment minus your co pay, deductibles, etc."
It eventually reflects in the amount my insurance company charges in premiums
3) Many of you make comments concerning the service EXPECTED from DME providers. Just a point of mention, DME cos are paid for the equipment they provide, not service. Your healthcare is provided by your Dr. not the DME co! Very few insurances actually have AND PAY for a "Respiratory Therapist Visit" code. Many DME companies cannot afford to hire a Respiratory Therapist (in my area salaries start at $50k a year full benefits expected). Just because they are clinically trained in respiratory therapy doesn't mean they are going to give you a treatment. They are used as a marketing tool for the DME company. There is nothing that a therapist can do regarding mask fitting, machine selection, etc, that a properly trained technician couldnt do!
Every item sold, from a piece of gum to any automobile comes with some service. Easy to see why people like you don't understand.
4) Pricing on the internet is bottom of the barrel, basterdised pricing! Most websites that you find have sold equipment that is given to sleep labs for free! Or a sleep lab tech might offer himself a five finger discount and sell masks on his own. Manufacturers give their product away as samples to sleep labs. Just like your Dr receives sample mediciations. Imagine if employees could take those free meds and start a website and sell them online? What price would you expect to pay for your viagra? Its easy to drop prices when the product is free isnt it?
Just the service is less. CPAP.COM seems to do a good job with their phone advice and getting it from Texas into my hands, in many cases less time than my DME.
5) Most DME companies will tell you that internet pricing is below cost! I can verify this, and manufacturers are thankfully trying to correct this. Enjoy your discounted mask prices while they last, cause you can expect them to go up! Margins for legitimate companies trying to compete are non existent and even johnny goodman who apparantly owns this site has attested to that, thats why there is no mask return policy.
After many years in the retail sales business, I found the only reason to sell something below cost is to get rid of a bad investment. Take your hit and use the money to make more money. Profit is basically the same in what ever you are selling. The quicker you turn your dollar the more you make.
6) How much money does the evil DME company make? When look at your insurance EOBs, how much did your insurance pay the DME? Most likely your in the <$100 range for a rental. The rental period is capped, so that item becomes yours in 10 to 15 months, considering your particular policy.
I don't begrudge anyone making a living or a profit. Taking advantage of someones ignorance, or disability in criminal.
Pause here and consider, how much does it cost to rent a car? $40 a day for a compact? is that ford focus worth the $1200 a month the rental company collects on it? Would you pay less that 1/4 that price if you bought it? Would your local car rental agency give you the car, let you own it, if you rented it for a year straight?
Apple & Oranges
Consider a hotel room, $100 a night. How does your home compare in cost to a hotel room? Thats $3000 a month, could you do better buying a home?
Apple & Oranges
DME companies get paid what the insurance dictates and takes a minimum of 60 days to an average of 120 days to collect their rental fees. Can you go to mcdonalds and eat a meal and pay for it 6 months later? Can you name ONE OTHER BUSINESS that will allow you to do this? Interest free??
Yes my Doctor. My hospital. My pharmacist. But this is the nature of the game. Know any company that charges top dollar for minimal equipment, just because they can get away with it.
And then you demand a Respiratory Therapist available at your beckoning? You expect someone to be on call to poo poo you when you have a complaint at midnight? What could that person do to satisfy you, run over to your home with a suitcase full of masks for you to select?
NO!!!!
DOES YOUR DOCTOR COME SEE YOU AT HOME? ? ?
Don't expect them to unless there was no possible way for me to get to see him, and THEN I would.
How many members here to go their Drs and dont even see them? How many are attended by Nurses or Physicians assistants?
Not me!
How many of you can get a service man to come over and just LOOK at your refridgerator for less than $75?
I make a living as a home serviceman. EVERYDAY!
Thats all a DME co gets paid, total, and you expect them to provide the service AND THE EQUIPMENT?
YES
I say, if your that demanding, open your wallet and get it from this site, cash. You still dont get the service, cpap.com is not going to answer your question at midnight like you expect, lol.
I've done business with CPAP.COM less than a half-dozen times, but I have been very satisified EVERY time.
They wont even take your mask back! So, either lower your expectations to a more reasonable level or just deal with the fact that you are just a little too damn demanding.
Walk in to your showroom, buy a mask, week later bring it back? I don't think so. Only if your contract with my insurance company say you have to, do you. If I am a cash buyer off the street, I'll bet I'm out of luck.
PS if you dont know that your sleep lab got paid over $2500 for a TEST, compare that to the expectations of your DME provider who over the coarse of a YEAR might make half that amount, provide you with the equipment, and care, EVEN THOUGH YOU DONT THINK IT ENOUGH, and be on the hook to replace or repair your equipemnt during that period of time. Selfish bastards they are huh? "
In some cases yes.
_________________
| Mask: Mirage Quattro™ Full Face CPAP Mask with Headgear |
| Additional Comments: Second favorite mask--Nasal Aire II |
I am a two martini lover. Two martinis and I think I am a lover!
Bipap 13/9, 10ft Hose
Bipap 13/9, 10ft Hose
-
guest
guest repying to martinilover
Martiini lover- consider loving them a little less, your judgment is clouded...
Being that the post you quoted from was a quote by DME, I will answer your replies, and try to do is so that you understand the point.
If a customer did not have insurance and paid cash for DME, he/she would most likely get pricing somewhere between internet and insurance allowables. That is done because 1) payment is received instantly, so I dont have to pay three girls $20 an hour to chase down your RX, CMN and sleepstudy from your Dr, dont have to submit your claim to insurance, dont have to contest their excuses for not paying on your claim after three to six months go by, dont have to chase you down for your co pay which you will conveniently forget you are responsible for, and dont have to pay for the office, computers, desks, benefits, electricity, water, coffee, software, internet and phone expenses just to collect our money. You wouldnt be aware of this, but the average DME billing software is $20k, per year...The second reason why cost would be between internet pricing and DME allowable is simply because internet pricing is wholesale. The manufacturers of Cpap equipment also publish MSRPs, goto http://www.invacare.com and compare that yourself.
Prices that DME companies charge to no reflect insurance premium increase or decrease, I dont know what the heck your trying to prove there but the simple fact is an insurance company has to have providers in the area they sell insurance. So the company allows providers to view their FEE SCHEDULE and decide if they can afford to do business with your insurance company. If a DME doesnt like what the insurance company offers as a payment for equipment, they simply do not do business with them. That is why your policy will also have an OUT OF NETWORK provision, namely because there are markets that an insurance co cannot find a DME co willing to do business at those prices. So insurance companies pay what THEY want to pay for equip, nothing more.
What service do you get from buying bubble gum? Does a Therapist come to your house to make sure the flavor is to your liking? Or that the elasticity of the gum is gentle enough for you? Do they give you another gum to try if you dont like the first one? Do they dispose of your gum when your done chewing it? This is where you need to get real! Cars come with warranties, sure but so does your DME equipment. Service in your analogy compared to what you EXPECT from a DME company would require the dealer to send an ASE CERTIFIED MECHANIC to your home at 12 AM saturday because you heard a noise in your car, bring you a loaner and take your car back to the dealer to work on it immediately. What brand car do you drive?
I dont know where cpap.com get their supplies from, but I do know that many DMEs would be better off buying their inventory from cpap.com then directly from the manufacturer.
I dont understand your statement "Just the service is less. CPAP.COM seems to do a good job with their phone advice and getting it from Texas into my hands, in many cases less time than my DME." to counter my statement "Pricing on the internet is bottom of the barrel, basterdised pricing! Most websites that you find have sold equipment that is given to sleep labs for free! Or a sleep lab tech might offer himself a five finger discount and sell masks on his own. Manufacturers give their product away as samples to sleep labs. Just like your Dr receives sample mediciations. Imagine if employees could take those free meds and start a website and sell them online? What price would you expect to pay for your viagra? Its easy to drop prices when the product is free isnt it? "
The reason internet websites sell DME equipment below cost is because they are getting it for free! Otherwise, they are buying in such huge volumes and making $2 to $7 on each mask sold.
I dont see how you claim that a DME company is taking care of someones ignorance. First of all, how fun do you think it is to work with assholes like yourself? How fun do you think it is to have sickly, grumpy miserable people demand the impossible from them? How fun do you think it is to wait six months to get paid for services rendered?
The comparison made between renting a car, a hotel room and a Cpap machine are not apples and oranges. The point you missed is that anything rented will cost far more than something purchased. And incidently, what service do you get from renting a car that is in addition to what you would receive if you bought it and saved the money? Theres an example that you refuse to see as it is, because you EXPECT a DME company to provide you with healthcare and emergency room services. By the way, in case you werent aware, apples and oranges are both fruit.
"Yes my Doctor. My hospital. My pharmacist. But this is the nature of the game. Know any company that charges top dollar for minimal equipment, just because they can get away with it." Are you trying to say that you dont make the same complaint about how much these other businesses get paid? Are you honestly saying you dont feel Doctors, Pharmacies and Hospitals dont charge too much? Youve never had an issue with a $12 pill? A $500 blood test? a $1000 a day stay at the hospital? Your really full of it you know...
I would pay you $1000 if you could get your Dr to come see you at home. Call him tonight at midnight and tell him your nose is drying out and you want your pressure checked, see how quick he gets there. By the way, $1000 is a joke. Make it happen and video tape it, Ill give you $10,000. Also, according to your reply, is there NO POSSIBLE way for you to go to your local DME???
You must live in a very remote, mid US state to actually see your Dr for the entirety of your visit. To imply that you dont have a nurse come in or a physicians assistant alleviate the Dr from wasting his time is total bullshit. Drs cant even afford to stay in business because of their liability insurance premiums and you expect they will run to your house because its not convenient for you? Or that they will tend to your ever need without relying on staff to free them up? People like you that are naive as to how the world really works is why their liability insurance premiums close offices down. I bet your the first person in line to try to file a lawsuit over something that didnt meet your expectations, since they are so impossibly high. And why the hell are they? Who owes you anything special or extra?
I say, if your that demanding, open your wallet and get it from this site, cash. You still dont get the service, cpap.com is not going to answer your question at midnight like you expect, lol.
I've done business with CPAP.COM less than a half-dozen times, but I have been very satisified EVERY time.
But have you received the service you people expect from the evil DMEs? Did cpap.com refuse your money to bill insurance? Did cpap.com offer to deliver it to your home? Did cpap.com take your mask back that rubbed your nose the wrong way? Did you call cpap.com for a new machine cause yours makes a squeeky noise when it starts up? Did you get an answer from cpap.com at midnight last time you called? BUT YET YOU EXPECT THIS TO JUST BE OWED TO YOU FROM A DME? THEY ARE JUST GOING TO PULL THE RESOURCES OUT OF THEIR ASS FOR YOU SINCE YOU DONT WANT THEM TO MAKE ANY MONEY TO AFFORD THIS??
They wont even take your mask back! So, either lower your expectations to a more reasonable level or just deal with the fact that you are just a little too damn demanding.
Walk in to your showroom, buy a mask, week later bring it back? I don't think so. Only if your contract with my insurance company say you have to, do you. If I am a cash buyer off the street, I'll bet I'm out of luck.
Thats a bet that youve lost, so continue on your miserable way. Its almost like you people with sleep apnea want to make it the fault of the companies trying to help you that you are miserable!
So, no issue with the sleep lab that charged your insurance $2k to $3k JUST TO SEE IF YOU EVEN HAVE SLEEP APNEA? They make that same amount if money even if you DONT HAVE IT!
How dare a DME company try to make a whopping $1000 on equipment, that msrps for $1375 btw over the course of a year, even though they provided me with all the extra service that I DONT get online, just because I can buy the same machine online for $299? Idiota
Being that the post you quoted from was a quote by DME, I will answer your replies, and try to do is so that you understand the point.
If a customer did not have insurance and paid cash for DME, he/she would most likely get pricing somewhere between internet and insurance allowables. That is done because 1) payment is received instantly, so I dont have to pay three girls $20 an hour to chase down your RX, CMN and sleepstudy from your Dr, dont have to submit your claim to insurance, dont have to contest their excuses for not paying on your claim after three to six months go by, dont have to chase you down for your co pay which you will conveniently forget you are responsible for, and dont have to pay for the office, computers, desks, benefits, electricity, water, coffee, software, internet and phone expenses just to collect our money. You wouldnt be aware of this, but the average DME billing software is $20k, per year...The second reason why cost would be between internet pricing and DME allowable is simply because internet pricing is wholesale. The manufacturers of Cpap equipment also publish MSRPs, goto http://www.invacare.com and compare that yourself.
Prices that DME companies charge to no reflect insurance premium increase or decrease, I dont know what the heck your trying to prove there but the simple fact is an insurance company has to have providers in the area they sell insurance. So the company allows providers to view their FEE SCHEDULE and decide if they can afford to do business with your insurance company. If a DME doesnt like what the insurance company offers as a payment for equipment, they simply do not do business with them. That is why your policy will also have an OUT OF NETWORK provision, namely because there are markets that an insurance co cannot find a DME co willing to do business at those prices. So insurance companies pay what THEY want to pay for equip, nothing more.
What service do you get from buying bubble gum? Does a Therapist come to your house to make sure the flavor is to your liking? Or that the elasticity of the gum is gentle enough for you? Do they give you another gum to try if you dont like the first one? Do they dispose of your gum when your done chewing it? This is where you need to get real! Cars come with warranties, sure but so does your DME equipment. Service in your analogy compared to what you EXPECT from a DME company would require the dealer to send an ASE CERTIFIED MECHANIC to your home at 12 AM saturday because you heard a noise in your car, bring you a loaner and take your car back to the dealer to work on it immediately. What brand car do you drive?
I dont know where cpap.com get their supplies from, but I do know that many DMEs would be better off buying their inventory from cpap.com then directly from the manufacturer.
I dont understand your statement "Just the service is less. CPAP.COM seems to do a good job with their phone advice and getting it from Texas into my hands, in many cases less time than my DME." to counter my statement "Pricing on the internet is bottom of the barrel, basterdised pricing! Most websites that you find have sold equipment that is given to sleep labs for free! Or a sleep lab tech might offer himself a five finger discount and sell masks on his own. Manufacturers give their product away as samples to sleep labs. Just like your Dr receives sample mediciations. Imagine if employees could take those free meds and start a website and sell them online? What price would you expect to pay for your viagra? Its easy to drop prices when the product is free isnt it? "
The reason internet websites sell DME equipment below cost is because they are getting it for free! Otherwise, they are buying in such huge volumes and making $2 to $7 on each mask sold.
I dont see how you claim that a DME company is taking care of someones ignorance. First of all, how fun do you think it is to work with assholes like yourself? How fun do you think it is to have sickly, grumpy miserable people demand the impossible from them? How fun do you think it is to wait six months to get paid for services rendered?
The comparison made between renting a car, a hotel room and a Cpap machine are not apples and oranges. The point you missed is that anything rented will cost far more than something purchased. And incidently, what service do you get from renting a car that is in addition to what you would receive if you bought it and saved the money? Theres an example that you refuse to see as it is, because you EXPECT a DME company to provide you with healthcare and emergency room services. By the way, in case you werent aware, apples and oranges are both fruit.
"Yes my Doctor. My hospital. My pharmacist. But this is the nature of the game. Know any company that charges top dollar for minimal equipment, just because they can get away with it." Are you trying to say that you dont make the same complaint about how much these other businesses get paid? Are you honestly saying you dont feel Doctors, Pharmacies and Hospitals dont charge too much? Youve never had an issue with a $12 pill? A $500 blood test? a $1000 a day stay at the hospital? Your really full of it you know...
I would pay you $1000 if you could get your Dr to come see you at home. Call him tonight at midnight and tell him your nose is drying out and you want your pressure checked, see how quick he gets there. By the way, $1000 is a joke. Make it happen and video tape it, Ill give you $10,000. Also, according to your reply, is there NO POSSIBLE way for you to go to your local DME???
You must live in a very remote, mid US state to actually see your Dr for the entirety of your visit. To imply that you dont have a nurse come in or a physicians assistant alleviate the Dr from wasting his time is total bullshit. Drs cant even afford to stay in business because of their liability insurance premiums and you expect they will run to your house because its not convenient for you? Or that they will tend to your ever need without relying on staff to free them up? People like you that are naive as to how the world really works is why their liability insurance premiums close offices down. I bet your the first person in line to try to file a lawsuit over something that didnt meet your expectations, since they are so impossibly high. And why the hell are they? Who owes you anything special or extra?
I say, if your that demanding, open your wallet and get it from this site, cash. You still dont get the service, cpap.com is not going to answer your question at midnight like you expect, lol.
I've done business with CPAP.COM less than a half-dozen times, but I have been very satisified EVERY time.
But have you received the service you people expect from the evil DMEs? Did cpap.com refuse your money to bill insurance? Did cpap.com offer to deliver it to your home? Did cpap.com take your mask back that rubbed your nose the wrong way? Did you call cpap.com for a new machine cause yours makes a squeeky noise when it starts up? Did you get an answer from cpap.com at midnight last time you called? BUT YET YOU EXPECT THIS TO JUST BE OWED TO YOU FROM A DME? THEY ARE JUST GOING TO PULL THE RESOURCES OUT OF THEIR ASS FOR YOU SINCE YOU DONT WANT THEM TO MAKE ANY MONEY TO AFFORD THIS??
They wont even take your mask back! So, either lower your expectations to a more reasonable level or just deal with the fact that you are just a little too damn demanding.
Walk in to your showroom, buy a mask, week later bring it back? I don't think so. Only if your contract with my insurance company say you have to, do you. If I am a cash buyer off the street, I'll bet I'm out of luck.
Thats a bet that youve lost, so continue on your miserable way. Its almost like you people with sleep apnea want to make it the fault of the companies trying to help you that you are miserable!
So, no issue with the sleep lab that charged your insurance $2k to $3k JUST TO SEE IF YOU EVEN HAVE SLEEP APNEA? They make that same amount if money even if you DONT HAVE IT!
How dare a DME company try to make a whopping $1000 on equipment, that msrps for $1375 btw over the course of a year, even though they provided me with all the extra service that I DONT get online, just because I can buy the same machine online for $299? Idiota
DME charges
I personally have had nothing but rotten experiences with the DME. I have received a humidifier that does not belong with the machine being used because "it is what we have available". I received the incorrect machine TWICE - they argued with me that it was the correct machine until I took them to the computer punched in the model number and proved them wrong. They charge the same amount for all interfaces - I thought this was really strange until I received my EOB and discovered that the insurance pays $105 for the interface, no matter which one it is. The insurance has been billed $40 a month for the heated humidifier - they pay $39. Let me see $39 times 15 months equals $585. They are billed $133 a month for the CPAP, insurance pays $128 times 15 equals $1920. They charged $47 for headgear. The insurance paid $34. All headgear was the same - I have 3. They charged $49 for a CPAP hose. The insurance paid $37. I paid $10 on the internet. They charged $6 PER FILTER. The insurance paid $4.85 per filter. I bought a whole bag of filters for $6 off the internet. I presently have $2068.90 in outstanding bills to the DME - why? Because they do the billing incorrectly every single month. I then have to waste my time calling them and the insurance and push 4 million different numbers until I get a real live human being. Do I expect some service for all this aggravation and money? Damn right I do. If I am only dealing with a tech or aide of some kind, I can set the machine myself. I now have my prescription in hand - look for me Johnny, I am coming your way!!!!!!!!!!!!
Life is not a dress rehearsal
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Guest
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Your gonna be hating life when your machine fails, cause good ol Johnny and delivering you a new one for free!
How exactly would you have that situation? Your machine breaks down, and yes you have a warranty.....lets seeeee
Well, your gonna have to call the manufacturer and give them the serial number, IF they even talk to you (most will tell you you have to go through the dealer) you will then pack up the cpap, take it to a pack and send and pay $40 to ship it to them (insured of course, signature required, wouldnt want to figure out what to do if it got lost right?) So what do you use in the meantime? Buy another cpap since there so damn cheap? rent one for a month cash from your local DME (imagine that, needing to turn to evil for help!). So you rent one from your local DME, paid $100 for the month, spent your $40 shipping your unit for repair. Now your machine is going on 5 weeks and still havent gotten it back! What, dont they know your VIP? How dare they not return it within 24 hrs right? BUT THEIR NOT EVIL ITS THE DME! Cause now youve got to rent it for another month! THOSE ASSHOLES, they couldnt prorate just to be a nice guy? Now you think back to when blockbuster video prorated your video rental hourly, just because you told them you deserved it.... So $250 in the hole, get your machine back, and IT MAKES THE SAME DAMN NOISE! rinse, dry, repeat....
All this avoided, had you rented it through your DME company. One phone call solves it all. Sure, they might ask you to bring it to their office, to get you taken care of immediately, otherwise they can schedule the delivery for you next business day. And this is provided, not at the $250 you spend for one instance, but for what they get paid by your insurance company, for 10 13 or 15 months. Imagine that!
How exactly would you have that situation? Your machine breaks down, and yes you have a warranty.....lets seeeee
Well, your gonna have to call the manufacturer and give them the serial number, IF they even talk to you (most will tell you you have to go through the dealer) you will then pack up the cpap, take it to a pack and send and pay $40 to ship it to them (insured of course, signature required, wouldnt want to figure out what to do if it got lost right?) So what do you use in the meantime? Buy another cpap since there so damn cheap? rent one for a month cash from your local DME (imagine that, needing to turn to evil for help!). So you rent one from your local DME, paid $100 for the month, spent your $40 shipping your unit for repair. Now your machine is going on 5 weeks and still havent gotten it back! What, dont they know your VIP? How dare they not return it within 24 hrs right? BUT THEIR NOT EVIL ITS THE DME! Cause now youve got to rent it for another month! THOSE ASSHOLES, they couldnt prorate just to be a nice guy? Now you think back to when blockbuster video prorated your video rental hourly, just because you told them you deserved it.... So $250 in the hole, get your machine back, and IT MAKES THE SAME DAMN NOISE! rinse, dry, repeat....
All this avoided, had you rented it through your DME company. One phone call solves it all. Sure, they might ask you to bring it to their office, to get you taken care of immediately, otherwise they can schedule the delivery for you next business day. And this is provided, not at the $250 you spend for one instance, but for what they get paid by your insurance company, for 10 13 or 15 months. Imagine that!
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guest
guest
Chrisp,
I replied to your wet airplane analogy and am waiting for your response. In the meantime,
You buy a SECOND cpap, ($500 or whatever) and add that to the cost of your FIRST cpap $500, and your repair expenses $40. Your pushing $1040 out of pocket.
One of the insurances the evil company I work for is a provider for is united. They pay $650 purchase on initial billing for a cpap. Imagine that!
I replied to your wet airplane analogy and am waiting for your response. In the meantime,
You buy a SECOND cpap, ($500 or whatever) and add that to the cost of your FIRST cpap $500, and your repair expenses $40. Your pushing $1040 out of pocket.
One of the insurances the evil company I work for is a provider for is united. They pay $650 purchase on initial billing for a cpap. Imagine that!
DME
Quote from BCBS: We do not pay for repair, we do not pay for rental of a machine if yours breaks down. Quote from DME: We will replace your machine if it is broken but only if it happens between 9-5, M-F and you drive 47 miles to bring it to us and exchange it. However, it will probably not be the machine that you need and we may not have any extras to loan you. In that event, we will call our other stores and if we locate one, you can drive to get it. The next nearest store is a 2 hour drive.
This is not New York City. There are not that many options. As Chrisp said, have a spare - and I already do - and yes, it is for power outages. Which are extremely frequent in the mountains.
If I had to deal with such rudeness in my DME, they would have been long gone. I have stated facts only of MY personal experience. I am certain that there are many who have pleasant experiences. I am happy for them. Since my choice of 1 DME has not worked out, it is MY CHOICE to seek my equipment elsewhere.
This is not New York City. There are not that many options. As Chrisp said, have a spare - and I already do - and yes, it is for power outages. Which are extremely frequent in the mountains.
If I had to deal with such rudeness in my DME, they would have been long gone. I have stated facts only of MY personal experience. I am certain that there are many who have pleasant experiences. I am happy for them. Since my choice of 1 DME has not worked out, it is MY CHOICE to seek my equipment elsewhere.
Life is not a dress rehearsal