Does Bathroom Breaks and fixing Rainout affect Data?

vrgsph · Post by **vrgsph** » Sat Feb 09, 2008 10:54 am

I was lucky enough to get a new M Series Auto. I am now collecting data that I couldn't on my RemStar Plus.

I am wondering, though, how does one or two bathroom breaks a night affect the data being collected?

Also, I was able to get a FP HC150 humidifier. The unit works great, but it creates the worst rainout I have ever seen. Even with a hose sock and low setting. I wake up and have to drain the mask each night.

Does doing this affect data?

With my old unit, I would leave the unit on during bathroom breaks or rainout issues.

What do you guys do in these situations (Turn off unit, leave it on, unhook mask, etc.)?

Gerald · Post by **Gerald** » Sat Feb 09, 2008 11:27 am

Please post your "profile" so that everyone can better understand the equipment that you're using. Everyone can help you better if they know more.

About rainout & potty breaks...........I've found that rainout is primarily affected by exhaled breath, mask design, and room temperature. Different masks have different "rainout characteristics"....at least that's what I've found. You'll learn how to "tweak" those factors that affect rainout......humidifier setting....room temp......hose positioning....etc.

As for the potty breaks........I suspect these will become fewer and fewer as you get your AHI score down below about 2.0.....and your blood pressure falls with it. My opinion about nocturnal potty breaks (needing to "pee") is that it's caused by extremely high BP in the middle of the night. Get yourself one of those battery powered BP measuring kits.....check your BP as you wake up needing to "pee"....and you'll see what I mean.

Remember.........what you're fighting is sort of like self-induced "waterboard torture".....you're suffocating because of throat tissue collapse......and you're not getting enough O2. Check yourself with a recording Pulse-Oximeter......and you'll get a better picture of your O2 intake while sleeping.

Gerald

Wulfman · Post by **Wulfman** » Sat Feb 09, 2008 11:38 am

ALWAYS shut off your machine BEFORE taking your mask off (for trips to the bathroom, etc.). It screws up the leak data.

Den

Goofproof · Post by **Goofproof** » Sat Feb 09, 2008 11:50 am

Also the fact that your waking up will affect yur data as you spend less a percent of your night sleeping. Jim

vrgsph · Post by **vrgsph** » Sat Feb 09, 2008 12:01 pm

Wulfman wrote:ALWAYS shut off your machine BEFORE taking your mask off (for trips to the bathroom, etc.). It screws up the leak data.

Den

Wulfman,

I almost always use the PB Breeze Pillow mask. It shifts and I find myself pulling the front completely off my nose and readjusting it a half dozen times a night.

Since the machine doesn't know its me doing it, it registers as a leak. I don't know if it is going to be easy to stop this habit.

rwalther · Post by **rwalther** » Sat Feb 09, 2008 12:04 pm

My advice would be ...

(1) Get the humidifier that's integrated with your M-Series. It's wonderful. I use a "1" setting with no rain-out, and no dry-mouth. I've heard several people with M-Series machines that had this issue, went to the integrated Heater/Humidifier, and it went away.

(2) One of the people on this forum that's significantly smarter than me, gave me a little "class" on why we have to "pee" a lot at night. (Has something to do with the hypopnia episodes triggering a chemical in your heart that induces a natural diaretic ... very odd stuff.) It's absolutely true that if you use your data to tweak your settings and drop your AHI, the potty-breaks will simply go away. They did for me once my AHI was down below 4.

(3) Turn off your machine manually (middle button) before taking your mask off. Not doing that will skew your data. Doing it won't. It just shows in the time-continuum graph as a blank period, but not in the detail metrics.

(4) Try scratching down the time of your wake-ups, and then map them on your detail data page to the events that are taking place. Look for trends. One thing I noticed was that I had my "Max Pressure" set too high. In the "auto-setting", the M-Series is terrific about racheting up the pressure to adjust for your issues. It's not very good at deciding it's OK to drop the pressure back down. I looked at my data, and figured out I was waking up when the system would go up above 18. I set the "Max-Pressure" to 18, and slept much better. Then I started losing a little weight (I'm working out like a mad-man now because I get enough sleep to have some energy) ... and noticed that could start bringing down my Max-Pressure even further. It was a very odd and counter-intuitive chain of events. The pressure would rise to stop an event, and I'd wake up because the pressure wouldn't go down. I slowly dropped the max pressure, still leaving it high enough to compensate for the event but not so high that it "annoyed" my sleep, and the lower I could "tweak" my max pressure, the better I slept and the less I needed a higher pressure.

Disclaimer: This is my experience, and mine alone. Consult your doctor. I'm not a sleep therapist ... I don't even play one on television.

Good luck. I hope this helps.

My best advice for ANYONE on this forum is to use the new-found energy you have, and direct it towards getting a little exercise and dropping a few pounds. I've been over 300 lbs for years. In the last month and a half since getting on my CPAP machine ... I've lost 20 lbs and feel better than I have in a decade. My numbers and quality of sleep improve in direct proportion to the wieght I lose and the duration of my daily exercise.

Sorry ... now I'm preaching.

Rusty

6PtStar · Post by **6PtStar** » Sat Feb 09, 2008 12:27 pm

Do NOT get the intergtated humidifier. Sorry but it is a total POS. Mine came with one. It has now rurned the top of my chest and has shorted out part of the heating element because it sat in leaked water so much. Also taking the chamber in and out every day to fill it, the gaskets got to where they leaked pressure. I got the HC150 humidifier and I love it. I also have the "M" auto. I have not had any problems with rainout and I have run it all the way up to 3. and I have mine on my chest which is about a foot above my mattress which is supposed to be a No No for rainout. Rainout can be an elusive problem. Where you live (air humidity, air temperature, etc), temperture of the room, type of heating, pressure, mask type and a few other things effect rainout. Some have had to resort to the Aussie heated hose to finally get rid of it. Keep working at it til you find a solution for you. You might try leaving the heat off for a night and use it as a passover humidifier if you live in a humid area. Good luck in finding a solution.

Jerry

sleepycarol · Post by **sleepycarol** » Sat Feb 09, 2008 1:01 pm

I am with Jerry on this one -- I have the integrated humidifier and purchased the F&P 100 and love it!!! It is sooo much better than the intergrated humidifier in my own opinion. I do not use the heat feature with the F&P humidifier and use it is a pass over humidifier unless the weather is super cold out and the house is extremely dry. The F&P gives you more options I feel that it is worth the extra expense and is easier to use. No more tugging and fiddling trying to get the humidifier seated properly, trying to fill it through the tiny openings, etc. The F&P humidifier is easy to fill and maintain. Again this is my own opinion.

rwalther · Post by **rwalther** » Sat Feb 09, 2008 2:57 pm

Wow !!!

Let me say that backwards ...

woW !!!

This one is definitely a YMMV issue. Mine works wonderfully. Dry as a bone on the inside, no issues with the seals, slides in and out without problems.

Heck ... I even accidentally packed it up with water still in the chamber, and took it on a flight from SFO to San Diego, and didn't figure it out until I unpacked it. The seals were great and everything was totally dry.

Well ... the tough questions in life continue to be unanswered?

* Integrated humidifier or not?
* Clinton or Obama?
* With Peanuts, or without?
* Why is the word "abbreviation" so long?
* Do nudists have pin-ups of people with clothes on?
* Why is it that when someone asks "What three things would you bring to a desert island?" ... nobody ever says "A BOAT".
* If a man alone in the woods says something ... would a woman still say he was wrong?

Rusty

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Guest · Post by **Guest** » Sat Feb 09, 2008 10:55 pm

No problem, rwalther,

We are all after the same result -- a good night's sleep.

When it comes to the equipment, it is all very subjective.

I've learned a lot here. I've also bought a few things on the advice of the majority that just didn't work for me.

Overall, I am money to the good for all the advice and knowledge gained here.

xyz · Post by **xyz** » Sun Feb 10, 2008 2:09 pm

I have the integrated humidifier with my Auto M and have not had a problem. When I picked it up the RT said that some people make the mistake of putting the little silicone seal on _backwards_. That may account for some people's problems. Also overfilling could be a problem. I fill it to the blue fill line and run it at a setting of 5 (which is the max). It has never leaked water and it hasn't run out of water in 8 hours. I can't figure out why some post that they run out of water, since I run mine on max setting and don't. And some post that their humidifier leaks air. Putting that seal on backwards could cause that problem also. The RT pointed out that when you insert the water chamber into the humidifier you must continue to push it in until you hear a quiet "clunk".

Jerry wrote:
> It has now rurned the top of my chest ...
> I have mine on my chest ...

I'm trying to figure out what you are trying to say. Do you sleep with your humidifier on your chest? I thought that we were talking about the integrated Auto M humidifier that sits next to, in contact with, the machine.

Gerald · Post by **Gerald** » Sun Feb 10, 2008 4:24 pm

Like xyz, I've had no problems with my Integrated "M" humidifier. When I fired up my spare machine the first time, it had a little leak....caused by an imperfection in the mold. I smoothed out the imperfection with a knife....and it's been perfect ever since. My spare doubles as the travel machine that my honey and I both use. Between us, we have (3) "M" machines....all with integrated humidifiers.....and we like 'em.

We have shallow "drip-catcher" pans under each of our machines....just in case. Under the pans, we have non-slip cabinet lining material. Works great. "No runs, no drips, no errors."

From the standpoint of travel, the integrated humidifier is the most convenient. Carrying an extra piece of equipment (stand alone humidifier) is not convenient when traveling.

Each to his own......everyone has his own preference.

You'll find what works best for you.

Gerald

6PtStar · Post by **6PtStar** » Sun Feb 10, 2008 7:25 pm

Sorry, didn't mean to create a stur. If you do a search you will find that a lot of people besides me have had major leak problems with the intergrated humidifier on the "M" series. They were suposed to have fixed some of the problems with a new type of gasket but it did not help me. Mine was still in warrenty but I bought it from DME #1. Had so much trouble with #1 I switched to DME #2 after 3 months. Whin I had so much trouble with the intergrated humidifier I contacted Respronics and they agreeded it needed to be sent in for repair but would not except it from me. I took it to DME #2 that I was using at the time but they would not send it in because I did not buy it from them. I took it to DME #1 and they refused to send it in because I was no longer their patient. Contacted Respronics, they had no answer for my problem. I still have it but it is junk and i still would not buy another one.

No I don't set it on my chest. It sets on my "chest of drawers" which is about a foot higher than my mattress.

Jerry

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sleepycarol · Post by **sleepycarol** » Sun Feb 10, 2008 7:36 pm

The DME told me NOT to take the m series humidifier apart as they had trouble with them leaking. She told me just to rinse it out. I NEVER turned mine up past 3 or possibly 4 and it would run nearly dry by morning. I followed the directions explicitly and just didn't care for the intergrated humidifier. Granted in traveling it is easier to use and carry -- but for home use -- you can't beat the Fisher and Paykel stand alone humidifiers in my own opinion.

Regie · Post by **Regie** » Mon Feb 11, 2008 12:04 pm

xyz wrote:
Jerry wrote:
> It has now rurned the top of my chest ...
> I have mine on my chest ...

I'm trying to figure out what you are trying to say. Do you sleep with your humidifier on your chest? I thought that we were talking about the integrated Auto M humidifier that sits next to, in contact with, the machine.

Just in case you were serious, I think Jerry meant that it had ruined the piece of furniture called a chest. Either that or he meant that the hair on his chest is now rusty. Reckon?

Regie

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