I took 2 tablets on Friday night and slept a solid 9 hours. Didn't hear the thunderstorms, train, or my son coming in during the middle of the night. Last night I took one tablet. Seven and half hours of sleep. So it puts me
right to sleep and keeps me asleep. Better than Ambien which would wear
off after about 4 1/2 hours. The problem with it was that my mask decided
to leak like crazy both nights, and I didn't notice it, so the PAP did very
little. Just like Ambien, the sleep is not that good true rested sleep, but
sort of hold you down and keep your eyes closed until the alarm clock goes off kind of sleep. It was something to try. http://www.lunesta.com
Lunesta -- FWIW
Hi Meister,
Thanks for the info on Lunesta. I am sure there are plenty of people here who gain from this type of information.
Doing sleep studies with ambien as a tool, I have not seen any alterations in sleep archecture on the titration side. On the baseline study, people with sleep apnea, mostly have less than normal sleep staging. Ambien really doesn't effect the type of sleep you get on that level.
Regards,
Ted
Thanks for the info on Lunesta. I am sure there are plenty of people here who gain from this type of information.
Doing sleep studies with ambien as a tool, I have not seen any alterations in sleep archecture on the titration side. On the baseline study, people with sleep apnea, mostly have less than normal sleep staging. Ambien really doesn't effect the type of sleep you get on that level.
Regards,
Ted
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Janelle
My problem for the last month or so has simply been "getting" to sleep, so my Sleep Dr. gave me some samples of Ambien. Took one one night and slept great. Took a second about a week later. Only thing I didn't like was waking up in middle of night to go pee or something (take a pain pill) and being unsteady, so I switched to 1/2 a pill. That seems to give me just as good a sleep but not quite so deep and if I wake up from something I'm not unsteady.
Glad to hear Ted say he hasn't noticed Ambien having an affect on sleep studies, 'cause I know I'm gonna have to have one for my next one a week from now. Even though I'm probably going to be ready for bed after a long hard day at work.
Glad to hear Ted say he hasn't noticed Ambien having an affect on sleep studies, 'cause I know I'm gonna have to have one for my next one a week from now. Even though I'm probably going to be ready for bed after a long hard day at work.
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Guest
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Janelle
sleeping pills
It seems my perspective as a pharmacist on sleeping pills are being totally ignored by those who pop a pill and magically have a good nights sleep and report back how wonderful they feel.
Nothing is free and this comes at a high price later.
The restoril mentioned is a second generation of the class, Dalmane being the first. These had the problem of accumulating and causing daytime sedation that caused many problems like older patients falling and breaking their hips and dying a few months later in the nursing home.
Next came the later generations, including ambien and the others. They are technically a different class, but work selectively on the same receptors the earlier ones do.
Public advertisements are giving the impression that all of lifes problems and getting a good nights can be had by simply going to the doc and asking for it.
The docs simply do not take the time to explain the eventual problems to a person and simply order it.
Pay attention to the TV ads that say FOR SHORT TIME USE ONLY!!! and to ask your doc about longer use.
This again, is ignored and they keep taking them forever.
Notice how some come back and say the Ambien is not working any more?
There is a reason for this. PAY ATTENTION!!!
Look up REBOUND INSOMNIA to understand the problems you are causing yourself.
You can ignore my perspective, but cannot avoid the consequences down the road. There is no such thing as a free lunch.
Nothing is free and this comes at a high price later.
The restoril mentioned is a second generation of the class, Dalmane being the first. These had the problem of accumulating and causing daytime sedation that caused many problems like older patients falling and breaking their hips and dying a few months later in the nursing home.
Next came the later generations, including ambien and the others. They are technically a different class, but work selectively on the same receptors the earlier ones do.
Public advertisements are giving the impression that all of lifes problems and getting a good nights can be had by simply going to the doc and asking for it.
The docs simply do not take the time to explain the eventual problems to a person and simply order it.
Pay attention to the TV ads that say FOR SHORT TIME USE ONLY!!! and to ask your doc about longer use.
This again, is ignored and they keep taking them forever.
Notice how some come back and say the Ambien is not working any more?
There is a reason for this. PAY ATTENTION!!!
Look up REBOUND INSOMNIA to understand the problems you are causing yourself.
You can ignore my perspective, but cannot avoid the consequences down the road. There is no such thing as a free lunch.
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UKnowWhatInSeattle
- Posts: 148
- Joined: Tue Nov 16, 2004 7:20 pm
- Location: Seattle, Merica, Earth...
Tomjax,
Thanks very much for posting that perspective. With so many people on this forum desperate for sleep, it can be easy to be influenced by the marketing hype, etc. I know my father's doctor said there'd be no problem taking Ambien every night indefinately...
My wife sort of fell through the monitoring cracks and was taking Ambien every night for close to a year and just kept getting refills without anyone telling her that there might be a problem with this long term. Well, she got very dependent on it and as you mention, it started to not work and she got rebound insomnia. She's pretty hypersensitive to medications, so she had a heck of a time kicking her Ambien "habit". She's much better now, but still cycles through a couple of different meds to help her sleep sometimes.
Thanks very much for posting that perspective. With so many people on this forum desperate for sleep, it can be easy to be influenced by the marketing hype, etc. I know my father's doctor said there'd be no problem taking Ambien every night indefinately...
My wife sort of fell through the monitoring cracks and was taking Ambien every night for close to a year and just kept getting refills without anyone telling her that there might be a problem with this long term. Well, she got very dependent on it and as you mention, it started to not work and she got rebound insomnia. She's pretty hypersensitive to medications, so she had a heck of a time kicking her Ambien "habit". She's much better now, but still cycles through a couple of different meds to help her sleep sometimes.
sleeping pills
OK Loony Loonvr.loonlvr wrote:From what I have read, Lunesta is approved for long term use. I requested it first, but insurance requires I use one of the big three first as they are cheaper. So, i'm on restoril. If that doesn't work will go to ambien then lunesta. Weird.
You can totally ignore what I said and proceed. Let me know in about a year or two. The restoril has a degree of muscle relaxation that may worsen OSA. But you will feel so good cause you are getting some rest.
The doc that told a person ambien could be taken indefinitely is not surprising. Some have absolutely no clue and others have absolutely no concern. Just keep the patient happy and coming back. Deny them and they will go to another doc. Believe me, I know how this works.
I remember too well the little old ladies who went a local doc that was treating every body with arthritis with amazing results. They all could not believe that they had relief for the first time in years. he was giving them PREDNISONE and allowing them to up their dose. This was criminal, imho, but they just smiled when I warned them and said "Well my doc said......."
I always shuttered when a person starts a reply with, "well, my doc said------"
Yet we continue to blindly follow them.
Go ahead and take your restoril, then ambien, then the others.
I remember when the advice for patients being prescribed valium when it came out in about '64 was to take it because it was not habit forming. I told many that as long as you took 2 to 3 a day there would be no problems- This kinda changed.
Go Back and look at the info on cocaine in the 60's. It said it was mainly a recreation drug for the jetsetters and was not at all addicting and would cause no problems.
And the band played on-----
Re: Lunesta -- FWIW
I treid Lunesta. I did not sleep the 8 hrs they mentioned. I got 6-7. Still groggy in the a.m. but not as bad as ambien. I have stopped taking anything, unless it's a very bad night.
I tend to wonder about those who are so anti-med's. How do the fall asleep? If they can market that ''secret'', the rest of us would not need Lunesta. Its certainly not cocaine, or valium as referred to..
Listen to your body, doctor, and see what works for YOU....
Don't feel guilty if you need medication. It is there for us to use. There are so many other variables for many of us as to why we can't sleep, and to feel guilt or pressure from those who are fortunate enuf to be able to fall asleep and stay asleep is enuf negativity when we have to deal with sleep apnea/cpap's also.
Do what's best for you..! (ps..as if you didn't know this, eh?
I tend to wonder about those who are so anti-med's. How do the fall asleep? If they can market that ''secret'', the rest of us would not need Lunesta. Its certainly not cocaine, or valium as referred to..
Listen to your body, doctor, and see what works for YOU....
Don't feel guilty if you need medication. It is there for us to use. There are so many other variables for many of us as to why we can't sleep, and to feel guilt or pressure from those who are fortunate enuf to be able to fall asleep and stay asleep is enuf negativity when we have to deal with sleep apnea/cpap's also.
Do what's best for you..! (ps..as if you didn't know this, eh?
meister wrote:I took 2 tablets on Friday night and slept a solid 9 hours. Didn't hear the thunderstorms, train, or my son coming in during the middle of the night. Last night I took one tablet. Seven and half hours of sleep. So it puts me
right to sleep and keeps me asleep. Better than Ambien which would wear
off after about 4 1/2 hours. The problem with it was that my mask decided
to leak like crazy both nights, and I didn't notice it, so the PAP did very
little. Just like Ambien, the sleep is not that good true rested sleep, but
sort of hold you down and keep your eyes closed until the alarm clock goes off kind of sleep. It was something to try. http://www.lunesta.com
There is nothing like a self righteous pharmacist. I know what restoril is. Its in the benzodiazepine family. Guess what? Same family as valium. I did my homework. Thats why I wanted lunesta. But have to try the others first. Your whole attitude about insomnia shows that you have no clue. Getting very little sleep for nites on end till you are able to sleep is no fun. And your knowledge of addiction is quaint. I took Xanax for over 10 years for anxiety. I never abused it. During the early 80s I had as much coke as I wanted for nothing, and walked away. Everyone is different. Let each person, with their doctors help, solve their problems. With your attitude, I'm surprised you don't give everyone an aspirin and send them home. Or maybe your related to the pharmacist here in minnesota that wouldn't sell the morning after pill because it was against his religion.p.s. Whats the rebound affect of stopping an insomnia medication? Insomnia?
Lunesta
Loonvr, you are entitled to vent with whatever knowledge you may have.
I do have a clue. I do know about sleep problems. Mine are not idle ramblings at all. Perhaps I should contact you privately to help you better understand.
Just what makes you believe you need such to sleep?? You do not. I KNOW.
The prisons are full of people who do not get sleeping pills and they end up sleeping as well as those outside, maybe better.l
Your attitude is very familiar to me in dealing for more tha 35 years with those with your attitude. Recovery centers are full of those with your attitude..
I could relate my many years of not getting to sleep at night and my role in the problems that led me to respond to your rant.
Maybe your admonition for me to send patients home with an aspirin is sage advice. It imay be far better than the docs who send those home with Xanax for ten years.
It depends on which doc whose advice a person follows that is also important. Look back at this.
You may ignore if you like. Don't shoot the messenger. I do not have a dog in this fight.
I do have a clue. I do know about sleep problems. Mine are not idle ramblings at all. Perhaps I should contact you privately to help you better understand.
Just what makes you believe you need such to sleep?? You do not. I KNOW.
The prisons are full of people who do not get sleeping pills and they end up sleeping as well as those outside, maybe better.l
Your attitude is very familiar to me in dealing for more tha 35 years with those with your attitude. Recovery centers are full of those with your attitude..
I could relate my many years of not getting to sleep at night and my role in the problems that led me to respond to your rant.
Maybe your admonition for me to send patients home with an aspirin is sage advice. It imay be far better than the docs who send those home with Xanax for ten years.
It depends on which doc whose advice a person follows that is also important. Look back at this.
You may ignore if you like. Don't shoot the messenger. I do not have a dog in this fight.
Is it really necessary for some to get so upset? Part of what I have enjoyed and appreciated here was the wide knowledge base to draw from. I, too, have tried all the sleeping meds. I am now taking Trazadone (a sedating antidepressant) at night. I AM truly unable to sleep without it. Have tried all of the "good sleep habits" I've ever read. Unfortunately, my brain doesn't have the ability to turn itself off at night and without a little help, I am awake very frequently. However, I do appreciate other people's opinions. IMHO we need to all do what we are most comfortable with and not assume because someone disagrees with us that they are uneducated and have not done their research. By the way, if anyone finds the "magic" formula that works across the board, will you please let me know? I'm tired of muddling my way through.
Sue, who thinks it's about time for Liam's humor to break this tension around here!
Sue, who thinks it's about time for Liam's humor to break this tension around here!
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Janelle
I DO understand where Tom is coming from as a pharmacists. These people fill prescription after prescription all day long, many they know may not help their clients, clients who are often people they have come to know over the years. It is the pharmacists duty, too, to know which drugs will interact with others the patient is on and make those calls to the doctors who prescribed them to see if they are aware the patient is on such medications.
For years I simply took a decongestant like Sudafed to get me slightly drowsy so I could sleep. I heard this was safe and for long term and had no rebound effect like some.
I've taken Benadryl too under the same assumption.
Until this last month I had never taken a prescription sleep drug. I had heard Ambien had rebound effects. And the night after my first dose, I was totally insomniac. This was after my doc has assured me they were not habit forming. But if you have a rebound the second night or when you discontinue, isn't that urging you to take the med the next night so you can sleep? In a way, that sounds habit forming, even though there may be nothing in there that is addictive.
I've tried soaking in a hot tub right before bedtime. And that helps me to relax and gets rid of the aches and pains of the day so I can drowse off.
Sometimes reading makes me drowsy and other times it doesn't. Ditto watching TV. In fact I think one of my problems lately is my husband comes to bed after me and turns on the TV and watches it for about an hour. I can be on the edge of sleep when he does this and then I am wide awake even after he turns it off, even if I turn over and don't watch it. I remember now why I used to stay up so late on the computer until he was a sleep. Naturally, when he turns it off, he immediately goes to sleep for the entire night. AARGH!
For years I simply took a decongestant like Sudafed to get me slightly drowsy so I could sleep. I heard this was safe and for long term and had no rebound effect like some.
I've taken Benadryl too under the same assumption.
Until this last month I had never taken a prescription sleep drug. I had heard Ambien had rebound effects. And the night after my first dose, I was totally insomniac. This was after my doc has assured me they were not habit forming. But if you have a rebound the second night or when you discontinue, isn't that urging you to take the med the next night so you can sleep? In a way, that sounds habit forming, even though there may be nothing in there that is addictive.
I've tried soaking in a hot tub right before bedtime. And that helps me to relax and gets rid of the aches and pains of the day so I can drowse off.
Sometimes reading makes me drowsy and other times it doesn't. Ditto watching TV. In fact I think one of my problems lately is my husband comes to bed after me and turns on the TV and watches it for about an hour. I can be on the edge of sleep when he does this and then I am wide awake even after he turns it off, even if I turn over and don't watch it. I remember now why I used to stay up so late on the computer until he was a sleep. Naturally, when he turns it off, he immediately goes to sleep for the entire night. AARGH!