CPAP use causes major sinus problems

[ChicagoGranny]

I HAVE found this wonderful little product called NeilMed NasoGel for dry noses. It's wonderful for me while using CPAP! In fact, it says on the label "for users of CPAP or oxygen." You might check it out....

https://www.amazon.com/NeilMed-Nasogel- ... noses&th=1

I've also used that. It is quite good! I should remember to recommend it more often.

[ChicagoGranny]

In fact I have found that since starting therapy my sinus swelling has been drastically reduced; I would assume it is the CPAP pressure keeping the swelling at bay.

It could also be reduced exposure to dust mites. Dust mite debris is universal in bed linens. Before CPAP, we are breathing it all night. With CPAP, we are getting filtered air from the nightstand. Both Gramps and I believe this is a big factor in our nasal symptoms improvement. https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-con ... c-20352173

[palerider]

Or, just cleaner air in general...

[CreativeChris]

The cleaner air does make sense!

[Holden4th]

This is amazingly coincidental. I went to the doctor today to check out why I've had a raspy and scratchy throat for nearly eight months now. I thought it was from an abscessed tooth but that's been fixed and the problem is still there. She asked a number of questions and said that we will go through an elimination process, starting with the likeliest candidate which is post nasal drip.

The comments in this thread make me wonder if my xPAP therapy might be part of the issue. I asked the doctor but she wasn't sure as her knowledge of CPAP therapy didn't indicate it as an issue.

The plan she has outlined for me is brilliant in its simplicity. The first step will be to use a nasal rinse combined with an antihistamine. I've used the Neilmed rinse before and while it's a messy process it works - especially when you feel your ears pop. It's much better than a netipot as you can get the saline solution much further up into your sinuses. The next step, if this doesn't work will be to treat for GERD. The third step will be an oesophageal endoscopy. Not looking forward to that so the first two steps better work.

[ChicagoGranny]

The next step, if this doesn't work will be to treat for GERD.

This doesn't make sense. GERD can be a dangerous condition. ("In very serious cases, untreated GERD (and subsequent Barrett's esophagus) can lead to cancer of the esophagus. In 2010, 16,640 new cases of esophageal cancer were diagnosed in the U.S." https://www.health.com/gerd/9-reasons-n ... d-symptoms ).

If you have GERD, it needs to be treated immediately. It is often the cause of a chronic "raspy and scratchy throat". Antihistamines and nasal rinses may be useless at best and counterproductive at worst.

[Gryphon]

One thing that got me wondering was mask choice and placement. What if your overdoing the tightening of the headgear? I know if I have my headgear too tight it restricts the flow of fluid in my face around my sinuses etc... I wake up looking like I just lost a round with Mike Tyson. Minus any bruising... soon after I take my mask off and massage my face a bit things get much better. Could pressure from the mask be causing a localised histamin responce, localised swelling in the tissue near the nose causing or aggravating a sinus condition?

My nose doesnt like being tweaked or messed with. As a kid if some one messed with my nose it would cause my allergies to kick in big time. Could that be playing a role?


Rest well,
Gryphon

[peelunkins]

This is amazingly coincidental. I went to the doctor today to check out why I've had a raspy and scratchy throat for nearly eight months now. I thought it was from an abscessed tooth but that's been fixed and the problem is still there. She asked a number of questions and said that we will go through an elimination process, starting with the likeliest candidate which is post nasal drip.

The comments in this thread make me wonder if my xPAP therapy might be part of the issue. I asked the doctor but she wasn't sure as her knowledge of CPAP therapy didn't indicate it as an issue.

The plan she has outlined for me is brilliant in its simplicity. The first step will be to use a nasal rinse combined with an antihistamine. I've used the Neilmed rinse before and while it's a messy process it works - especially when you feel your ears pop. It's much better than a netipot as you can get the saline solution much further up into your sinuses. The next step, if this doesn't work will be to treat for GERD. The third step will be an oesophageal endoscopy. Not looking forward to that so the first two steps better work.

CPAP causes the nasal passages to swell
Acute impact of continuous positive airway pressure on nasal patency
'Acute exposure to positive pressure via CPAP is associated with subjective and objective reductions in nasal patency. In individuals with allergic nasal symptoms, deterioration is even more severe than in patients without these symptoms.'
https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs ... /alr.21948
https://www.physiology.org/doi/full/10. ... 00639.2006

Q: I have sleep apnea. How can I use CPAP with a stuffy nose?

A: Nasal congestion is one of the most common reasons that patients with obstructive sleep apnea fail to use continuous positive airway pressure (CPAP) machines. Positive airway pressure is prescribed to hold the airway open by preventing collapse of the soft tissues in the throat. However, the nose has a more rigid bony structure that is not readily inflated by the pressure. To the contrary, research has shown that the use of CPAP actually stimulates the nose to swell shut, with measurable decreases in the nasal volume and increased resistance to nasal airflow.

[palerider]

CPAP causes the nasal passages to swell

Funny, cpap for me has the opposite effect.

Don't you have anything better to do than dig up old threads and post crap into them?

Interesting that, in the second link you posted, that you likely didn't even scan, much less read, there's this:

DISCUSSION

This study demonstrates that CPAP exposure for 6 h is associated with a reduction in nasal resistance compared with the control condition, and with no significant change in subjective nasal symptoms. The study finding is contrary to our hypothesis that CPAP would be associated with physical irritation of the turbinate mucosa and a consequent progressive increase in nasal resistance over time. It is important to note that CPAP was administered in the present study without the potential ameliorating effects of heated humidification to the inspired CPAP airflow.

[Wulfman...]

This is amazingly coincidental. I went to the doctor today to check out why I've had a raspy and scratchy throat for nearly eight months now. I thought it was from an abscessed tooth but that's been fixed and the problem is still there. She asked a number of questions and said that we will go through an elimination process, starting with the likeliest candidate which is post nasal drip.

The comments in this thread make me wonder if my xPAP therapy might be part of the issue. I asked the doctor but she wasn't sure as her knowledge of CPAP therapy didn't indicate it as an issue.

The plan she has outlined for me is brilliant in its simplicity. The first step will be to use a nasal rinse combined with an antihistamine. I've used the Neilmed rinse before and while it's a messy process it works - especially when you feel your ears pop. It's much better than a netipot as you can get the saline solution much further up into your sinuses. The next step, if this doesn't work will be to treat for GERD. The third step will be an oesophageal endoscopy. Not looking forward to that so the first two steps better work.

CPAP causes the nasal passages to swell
Acute impact of continuous positive airway pressure on nasal patency
'Acute exposure to positive pressure via CPAP is associated with subjective and objective reductions in nasal patency. In individuals with allergic nasal symptoms, deterioration is even more severe than in patients without these symptoms.'
https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs ... /alr.21948
https://www.physiology.org/doi/full/10. ... 00639.2006

Q: I have sleep apnea. How can I use CPAP with a stuffy nose?

A: Nasal congestion is one of the most common reasons that patients with obstructive sleep apnea fail to use continuous positive airway pressure (CPAP) machines. Positive airway pressure is prescribed to hold the airway open by preventing collapse of the soft tissues in the throat. However, the nose has a more rigid bony structure that is not readily inflated by the pressure. To the contrary, research has shown that the use of CPAP actually stimulates the nose to swell shut, with measurable decreases in the nasal volume and increased resistance to nasal airflow.

Horse shit! Neither of those studies used humidification.
That's why the heated humidification was incorporated with XPAP therapy. It can be adjusted to use a wide variety of settings from either cool "passover" to higher humidity settings.
When I started therapy, the heated humidifiers were optional and/or had to be prescribed by the doctor. Over the years, they've become a standard because the industry recognized that they help almost all users adjust to this new way of sleeping and breathing.

Far too many "studies" are rigged to produce the predetermined outcomes that they're meant to produce.


Den

.

[ChicagoGranny]

Q: I have sleep apnea. How can I use CPAP with a stuffy nose?

A: Nasal congestion is one of the most common reasons that patients with obstructive sleep apnea fail to use continuous positive airway pressure (CPAP) machines. Positive airway pressure is prescribed to hold the airway open by preventing collapse of the soft tissues in the throat. However, the nose has a more rigid bony structure that is not readily inflated by the pressure. To the contrary, research has shown that the use of CPAP actually stimulates the nose to swell shut, with measurable decreases in the nasal volume and increased resistance to nasal airflow.

OMG! When I have a cold with congested nasal passages, CPAP is even more wonderful. CPAP (plus sleep) is the most effective treatment for a cold that I know of.

[zonker]

CPAP causes the nasal passages to swell

Funny, cpap for me has the opposite effect.

Don't you have anything better to do than dig up old threads and post crap into them?

please bear in mind that this is the user who came in recently telling us he gets NO sleep in 7.5 hours. when asked to make the slightest effort to give the forum members something to work with (ie DATA) he pretty much refused. then started in bombing other peoples' threads with his same complaints.

i'd post his past "stuff" but he's on my foe list. not worth UN-foeing him long enough to post it.

[Pugsy]

please bear in mind that this is the user who came in recently telling us he gets NO sleep in 7.5 hours. when asked to make the slightest effort to give the forum members something to work with (ie DATA) he pretty much refused. then started in bombing other peoples' threads with his same complaints.

Now I remember this guy.

He's going to go digging for any excuse in the world to not use cpap or have it cause problems and such.

Just consider the source and move on. Correct the misinformation he seems to be wanting to spew and move on about our business.

[Gryphon]

I've found that during the night - my sinus swelling will usually go down because of the added gentile pressure - it's when I take the darn thing off in the morning that my congestion gets worse... you've taken away the supports and the surrounding tissue swells a bit more.

Then again - if I can't get any air through my nose at all, which some times happens - I use a full face mask all the time anyway so I don't really care.

I've have had really really bad congestion before where during the day I couldn't get much air through my nose at all - then after about 1 or 2 hours, I'm still awake but notice that the swelling in my nose has gotten much better, so on the nights I'm sick I'll usually lay down much earlier and sit there for quite a while trying to relax and sleep... it's these nights that I notice the "Improvement" in my nose because of the constant pressure.

[peelunkins]

I have moderate OSA and was prescribed a ResMed Airsense 10 machine with a "nasal pillow" type of mask. I'm about ready to throw this %#$% thing out a window. Every time I use it, it causes sinus issues. It doesn't matter if I have a brand new mask on it. It doesn't matter that I religiously have kept the humidifier container sanitized and filled with fresh distilled water. I wake up with a chronic running nose, stuffed up nostrils (usually one or the other but not both at the same time), and the most intense sneeze-causing irritation when I inhale (this is always in my left nostril, which has a moderately deviated septum, and man, it's such an intense irritation when it comes on that the sneeze reflex stops me in my tracks).

I've gone to an allergist, thinking that I had an allergy. She ran me through a battery of tests and they all came out negative. No allergies. She did, however, put me on steroidal nose spray that is designed for allergies. This has done nothing to help. I told her and she recommended another over-the-counter anti-allergy nose spray called FloNase. Which also was useless advice, because it not only did nothing to help, it seemed to exacerbate the problem. And when the problem came on, I was taking Sudafed, Mucinex, Benadryl, Claritin and Wal-Fex (not all at the same time) to try to fight the symptoms, so I didn't want yet another medication, especially one that seemed to be having an opposite effect on the problem.

So I went off everything -- CPAP machine, all medications, everything. My sinus problems cleared up and I felt a lot better. But, aware that I still have an apnea problem and was doing nothing to treat it, I went back on the CPAP a couple nights ago as a test. I wore it for almost exactly an hour before having to get up to go to the bathroom. And when I got up, the sinus problems were all back -- with a vengeance. I've concluded without a doubt that it's the stupid machine that is causing these problems.

I went off the CPAP again. I'm currently trying to recover from the sinus problems that it triggered a couple nights ago. I'm afraid of the blasted thing now. No way I'm going to wear it before I'm off work on Christmas vacation; don't want to ruin that with sinus problems. There has *got* to be a better treatment for this stuff. Hose on the nose ain't cutting it.

Looking for any advice from people that have had a similar experience.

'CPAP air is an irritant - to one degree or another - to everyone. The irritation may cause the nasal passages to dry out and bleed, or the mucous membranes may try to protect the nasal passages by producing excess mucous, resulting in congestion. The irritation can be cumulative, developing over time. Furthermore, dry, cracked or bleeding nasal passages are a breeding ground for infection. '
https://www.cpap.com/cpap-faq/Common-Side-Effects